Justis Case Interior Upgrades

[JB Cases]

Yes he can void the warranty. By your own words, printed many times here, the interior is the case. By changing the interior, Jack could claim that since its a major component, and according to you, THE major component, being swapped out, that the case can no longer be considered his. The single easiest way around the Magnuson act is to claim that the replacement part is over 50% of the product and according to YOU, many times, it is. So you lose, again.

You cannot apply this law in an automotive analogy, whatsoever. What you're doing is in essence jacking up the radiator cap of a Ford and putting a Yugo in its place and expecting Ford to hold the warranty.

You and anyone else would lose this argument in a second in any court.

JV

All right. I will accept that. So your argument then is that the interior IS the case and more than 50% of the work? I am fine with that and fine with Jack voiding his warranty because of it.

To which I say again that I will honor Jack's warranty and repair any part of the case that Jack would cover as long as he won't. You can't get a better deal than that.

The case is transformed into a more protective unit and the customer loses no warranty.

See we can agree on something.

 

[JB Cases]

This comment was a little harsh now that I reread it...don't get me wrong Jack builys an aesthetically beautiful case, I just think they do det lack in the protection department. I personally feel Johns cases whether a custom or a GTF are the total package. I have said many upon many of times they are the best and I think a Barton interior on a Justis case is indeed an upgrade. So in short, Jacks talent cannot be denied but I think Johns designs are a little better. I don't know for sure but I assume JB isn't making too many cases these days and his staff probably takes care of most of the building so I don't know......

Price is really subjective. We think it should be an objective apples to apples comparison but really it's more along the lines of whatever someone has the stones to charge is what they will get most of the time.

As for me and building cases I am guessing this is coming from Bobby again working the PMs.

I can guarantee you and everyone else that plenty of my DNA is in every case we build. The ONLY reason I am able to offer a better interior is because I have spent dozens of hours experimenting with just the right way to do them, going though dozens of iterations of examples.

And we never stop tweaking either. When I have an idea that might make it better I test it immediately and implement it if it works.

The benefit to the way my shop works is that I am not tied down to just a small set of ways to do things and hampered by my own ability or lack thereof. Whatever we are asked to do is something that we are normally willing to try. But these things don't automatically get done without my input UNLESS I have trained my staff on how to do them. Ultimately the goal is if I am not here I hope that the company can continue to make cases and leather good according to my philosophy of continuous improvement and willingness to try whatever the customer desires.

One man shops are great but they tend to be constrained by the time it takes one man to do each task. It's very simple math, two men can do 3x the work of one man and more if the tasks are apportioned correctly. The result is generally that the larger shop can turn out more variety with as high of a quality as the single man shop for less money to the consumer.

I realize it's romantic to get stuff from one man shops. There is a certain connection there, a bond between the maker and customer that you don't neccessairly get with a item that came from a workshop full of people. I mean you KNOW that Jack himself sewed your case and you don't know who sewed it in my shop. We will never be that and if I die tomorrow JB Cases continues on and if Jack dies then Justis cases dies with him.

I see my business as something that hopefully will provide for my family and my staff long after I am gone.

 

[classiccues]

Thats not my argument at all. Its your words, not mine. But the point is, in accordance to the lemon law cited, the claim of Jack not being able to void the warranty is unsubstantiated, and false.

But since I see in total how you are playing this game, I am in for a little funsies. I also saw where you wrote that your kind of competitive advertising is "allowable". Good, I like it.

I will be back.

JV

All right. I will accept that. So your argument then is that the interior IS the case and more than 50% of the work? I am fine with that and fine with Jack voiding his warranty because of it.

To which I say again that I will honor Jack's warranty and repair any part of the case that Jack would cover as long as he won't. You can't get a better deal than that.

The case is transformed into a more protective unit and the customer loses no warranty.

See we can agree on something.

 

[JB Cases]

Thats not my argument at all. Its your words, not mine. But the point is, in accordance to the lemon law cited, the claim of Jack not being able to void the warranty is unsubstantiated, and false.

But since I see in total how you are playing this game, I am in for a little funsies. I also saw where you wrote that your kind of competitive advertising is "allowable". Good, I like it.

I will be back.

JV

I said comparative advertising. If you want to compete on facts then I am all for it. Feel free to take any case you want and dissect it and tell us all FACTUALLY what's wrong with it and I will answer your points. If something needs to be improved then I will improve it.

Given your history I doubt we will see much in the way of actual facts about my current product but you and everyone else are more than welcome to critique them as much as you like.

Regarding the warranty the way I see it is regardless of the law, Jack should simply allow the people who purchased his case to install whatever interior that they wish to without invalidating the warranty on the other parts.

We both know that no law is going to make Jack do what he doesn't want to do. I mean the law probably does apply and technically he probably can't void the warranty for replacing a part that doesn't affect the rest of the case but it's just conversation because no one would ever go to court over it.

Can't say I look forward to whatever you intend to do but I hope it's a factual comparison. As Henry Ford said, 'whichever man does the best job should get the business'. And could you find another thread to do it in please, this one is to sell interior upgrades.

 

[uwate]

Are you making interiors for the 2/4 its georges?

 

[rigmaster]

Cost of material

^^agree^^...not only did jack already get the money for the case, I can almost guarantee that customer GROSSLY overpaid for it too. I especially enjoy the atrocious markup on a Justis with exotic hydes....actually comical considering the cost of the material but to each his own.

I just can't see how anyone can put a $1000 Barton in their right hand and a $1000 Justis in their left and not laugh. Good luck in your inevitable disagreements John and Jack.

How many 14 1/2 foot gators have you bought? You get a 3x6 out of the belly and a 2x4 out of the tail , I have both cases. They have Jacks interior and are full of Szamboti's never had any damage to my cues in any of the 16 Justis cases I own. If I wanted Johns interior I would buy his case not change the interior in one of my Justis cases! I have 2 early Instroke cases made in Europe but they have tube interior . I don't like the idea of foam fitting that tight on my cue if it gets dirty seems it would be like sandpaper. I will leave my cases as the maker intended as well as my cues!

 

[blucollar]

How many 14 1/2 foot gators have you bought? You get a 3x6 out of the belly and a 2x4 out of the tail , I have both cases. They have Jacks interior and are full of Szamboti's never had any damage to my cues in any of the 16 Justis cases I own. If I wanted Johns interior I would buy his case not change the interior in one of my Justis cases! I have 2 early Instroke cases made in Europe but they have tube interior . I don't like the idea of foam fitting that tight on my cue if it gets dirty seems it would be like sandpaper. I will leave my cases as the maker intended as well as my cues!

None, How many full alligator hydes have you purchased?( not that it matters) As long as your happy with your cases that's great, my point was simply that a Barton case offers better protection and if put to an actual test of some sort I am guessing that could be easily proven. A simple experiment would be to go out in ur driveway pop open the top of any one of your Justiis cases and tip it upside down and watch what happens to your Szams. Then do the same with a $100 sterling case. My Whitten case has slipped out of my hands on a couple occasions and my cue slipped out luckily it landed on carpet but it could have been bad. So basically I was saying no matter which way you slice it, an ultrapad interior is an upgrade, its tough to accept for someone who is dumping up to $2500 on a case that an ultapad interior inside a PVC plumbing tube will protect better than their case but its just the way it is....So again, Jacks cases are beautiful but Johns are better.

 

[trob]

How many 14 1/2 foot gators have you bought? You get a 3x6 out of the belly and a 2x4 out of the tail , I have both cases. They have Jacks interior and are full of Szamboti's never had any damage to my cues in any of the 16 Justis cases I own. If I wanted Johns interior I would buy his case not change the interior in one of my Justis cases! I have 2 early Instroke cases made in Europe but they have tube interior . I don't like the idea of foam fitting that tight on my cue if it gets dirty seems it would be like sandpaper. I will leave my cases as the maker intended as well as my cues!

I like my justice case but its nothing more then a status symbol and since you also have a zam its obvious your into have things to show how much money you have. With my jb interior I have a justice status symbol without having to hear my cues bounce around in my case like like an old Chevy on a cobblestone road lol

 

[classiccues]

How about a more realistic test. Keep both cases and use as intended and see if anything happens to any cue.. Only a moron pops the lids and shakes the cues out of a case. (BTW watch Johns video, and see the cue fall out of HIS case)

The only test requirement is how do they function in a real enviroment as intended. Do accidents happen, sure they do, the question is how often and what are the real consequences.

I guess if someone was to walk around with slippery fingers, and have the coordination of a one armed, one legged, cross eyed neandertal, maybe they do need Johns case.

Of course, then there is always resale value and actual cost to manufacture we could discuss.

JV

None, How many full alligator hydes have you purchased?( not that it matters) As long as your happy with your cases that's great, my point was simply that a Barton case offers better protection and if put to an actual test of some sort I am guessing that could be easily proven. A simple experiment would be to go out in ur driveway pop open the top of any one of your Justiis cases and tip it upside down and watch what happens to your Szams. Then do the same with a $100 sterling case. My Whitten case has slipped out of my hands on a couple occasions and my cue slipped out luckily it landed on carpet but it could have been bad. So basically I was saying no matter which way you slice it, an ultrapad interior is an upgrade, its tough to accept for someone who is dumping up to $2500 on a case that an ultapad interior inside a PVC plumbing tube will protect better than their case but its just the way it is....So again, Jacks cases are beautiful but Johns are better.

 

[Jack Justis]

None, How many full alligator hydes have you purchased?( not that it matters) As long as your happy with your cases that's great, my point was simply that a Barton case offers better protection and if put to an actual test of some sort I am guessing that could be easily proven. A simple experiment would be to go out in ur driveway pop open the top of any one of your Justiis cases and tip it upside down and watch what happens to your Szams. Then do the same with a $100 sterling case. My Whitten case has slipped out of my hands on a couple occasions and my cue slipped out luckily it landed on carpet but it could have been bad. So basically I was saying no matter which way you slice it, an ultrapad interior is an upgrade, its tough to accept for someone who is dumping up to $2500 on a case that an ultapad interior inside a PVC plumbing tube will protect better than their case but its just the way it is....So again, Jacks cases are beautiful but Johns are better.

"It is better to stay quiet and be thought a fool than open your mouth and remove all doubt" :thumbup:

 

[Shazar]

I'd like a chance at a free one

What's the favor?

 

[Jack Justis]

Be sure to inform the owner of the case that any repair you make on one of our cases will lower the value even more than changing the interior.

Would you allow Cuetec to make a repair on your Searing?

 

[blucollar]

"It is better to stay quiet and be thought a fool than open your mouth and remove all doubt" :thumbup:

Nothing I said is untrue. I realize its a tough pill to swallow when a Chinese woman working for JB can build a case that offers more protection in the event of something happening outside normal use as in a drop, someone knocking over your case, etc.....Even in my own line of work it sometimes bothers me that people perform better than me but hey... I don't make up lies to make people think otherwise, like the folks that say johns cases damage cues. There are many folks that prefer beauty over function...me being one of them....I was just stating facts and the dozens upon dozens who switched their interiors can't all be wrong.

 

[kvinbrwr]

since you also have a zam its obvious your into have things to show how much money you have

I'm lost. How is this "obvious" by the fact that he own a Szam?

Thanks

Kevin

 

[trob]

I'm lost. How is this "obvious" by the fact that he own a Szam?

Thanks

Kevin

I've hit with plenty of them and personally find nothing that I couldn't get for a quarter of the price. So IMO its a status symbol.

 

[CMD]

I've hit with plenty of them and personally find nothing that I couldn't get for a quarter of the price. So IMO its a status symbol.

Hit is subjective. What is not subjective the fact that Szamboti is an investment. Same with a Justis case. In the years to come, the cue and case will only go up in value. While the cue (which you did not name) and a JB case will not....


Truth.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[trob]

Hit is subjective. What is not subjective the fact that Szamboti is an investment. Same with a Justis case. In the years to come, the cue and case will only go up in value. While the cue (which you did not name) and a JB case will not....


Truth.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep... Because for whatever reason they became a status symbol.. So that made people covet them more ... Which made the prices go up... Which made them more of a status symbol. and on And on it goes lol It's a vicious circle isn't it.

 

[CMD]

Yep... Because for whatever reason they became a status symbol.. So that made people covet them more ... Which made the prices go up... Which made them more of a status symbol. and on And on it goes lol It's a vicious circle isn't it.

What you fail to realize cue and case collecting having nothing to do with how well a person plays. Or a case protects. Is it a status symbol what a person drives? Or where they live? Or vacation? People spend THEIR money how THEY see fit.

Live and let live... No need to mock how or what a person spends their hard earned money on.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[rigmaster]

I find that Szamboti's, Searing, Tascarella, Hercek and Murray Tuckers cues are consistant from one to another as is Ron Ross tooling and Jack Justis cases. I don't open my case and turn it upside down so I will be just fine with my cases and their original Justis interior. I have never heard my cues rattle in a Justis either. I have a couple Dale Perry cues and I put them in a Instroke case made in Europe.

 

[kvinbrwr]

I've hit with plenty of them and personally find nothing that I couldn't get for a quarter of the price. So IMO its a status symbol.

"personally" and "IMO" fit far better in your logic than "obviously". If you had said "to my way of thing" blah blah blah, it would have made perfect sense to me. That's the way you think and that's fine.

A playboy centerfold covers a couple feet of wall, to some guy's way of thinking, far better than a Picasso original painting would, for 1/10,000,000 of the price. So by your stated logic, the only reason to own a Picasso is for status in other people's eyes.

However, many folks acquire them and squirrel them away, showing nobody (same with cues BTW) , so the "status-symbols is the only reason for collecting" shows pretty thin pretty quick.

Not to mention, those guys now holding Picassos they bought for 10K, or Guses they bought for $275. You'd have a very tough time convincing me that its "obvious" that the reason they hold have their collectibles is as status symbols.

You have an appreciation for the artistry and history of collectible cues or you don't. If you don't appreciate them, then spending 10K for an old heavy cue with hand-cut inlays, when a modern 2K cue might hit better and be built with more precision, makes no sense. If you do appreciate them, it makes nothing but sense.

Thanks for sharing

Kevin