Keith McCready beats MIKA 8-7 for the HOT-SEAT

[Rich R.]

I was also the guy with the pretty capable camera lens.

Although I wasn't at this tournament, I happen to have a more than capable camera lens, as some on this forum can attest to. I have sat in the front row of major tournaments, with TV lighting, and through my camera lens I can not see gaps in the racks.

And yes, it was my first time at a high-level pool tournament.

This statement answers a lot of questions.
I attend several pro tournaments a year, in addition to a number of high level regional tournaments. I have never been at at tournament where someone didn't argue about the racks. I repeat, NEVER, and that includes the tournaments using the Sardo racks.

Also, because of your inexperience, I will tell you, Mika has a very quiet demeanor and a soft voice, but don't let that fool you. He can be very irritating to opponents, especially when he is in a tight match, or losing. He will complain about the racks and whine about almost anything else. Believe me, he is no angel at the table.

I won't call you a liar, but I don't believe you really saw, what you think you saw, either through the lens of your camera or at the table. I think you need a little more experiance on the tournament trail.

 

[Koop]

Also, because of your inexperience, I will tell you, Mika has a very quiet demeanor and a soft voice, but don't let that fool you. He can be very irritating to opponents, especially when he is in a tight match, or losing. He will complain about the racks and whine about almost anything else. Believe me, he is no angel at the table.

I wasn't going to mention an instance of this but based on iacas' comments I will.

At the Joss finale a couple of years ago a local guy, Shorty, was playing some of the best pool of the tournament. He just knocked Frankie Hernandez and Earl Strickland out and his next match was against Mika.
Shorty picked up where he left off and jumped out to a nice lead. This is when Mika tried to slow it down by continuously complaining about the racks until Joe Tucker was brought in to rack the remainder of the set. I have to admit that I was a little put off by this but after thinking about it I came to realize that when you get to this level there isn't much difference in capabilities so sometimes it comes down to trivial things such as the rack.

I think a little more time on the tournament trail will teach you(iacas) that this is just one of those things that happens in a tournament and while you think it may be justified to bring it here, both Keith and Mika understand it's all part of the game.

JMO,
Koop

 

[iacas]

a shot by shot of the last game of the match. It was reported that Mika, when on the hill, missed the 8 ball, and Keith got out, that would have made it hill-to-hill. What went on in the last game?

And why did Mika have to bank the 8 ball? Did he just miss shape? Did the cue kiss another ball coming around the table?

Actually Keith got to the hill first, 8-6 I believe. Mika won a few games. The eight that Mika (then Keith, then Mika again) missed was in the hill-hill game. Keith finally made the eight and then the nine to win the match, 9-8.

 

[Rickw]

I have to wonder about his intentions considering he made multiple posts in multiple threads.

For me, it all goes back to the useless point of naming names. If Keith were the only pool player to ever pull this stunt, then maybe. This happens at every tournament. Luckily people don't feel the need to run to the forum after every tournament and complain about this.

I just think the way he went about it and his timing were in very poor taste. JMO

(Even if your daughter isn't the best dancer, I bet she's adorable! LOL, little girls in their dance outfits are too cute! )

She's not little anymore, she's 24. She's still the best dancer I ever saw.

I don't disagree with you, Tims, that he came on awful strong. My whole point was that he came on, gave his opinion which was pretty strong and that's it. I don't think he was lying to make trouble, I just think he just got rubbed the wrong way by what Keith did.

I know it's tough for Jam to read that kind of stuff but I like to get other peoples' views even if they might be a little over the top. It would have been nice if someone else that had been there gave their account, excluding Jam because she's biased. After all, this is the only way we can get a sense of what transpired if we weren't there.

 

[sixpack]

And you are a back-peddling crawfish. Again, it is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE -- again, IMPOSSIBLE -- with a zoom lens or the naked eye to see any crack in any rack unless you were sitting on top of the overhead table lamp.

I am not going to pick apart your posts and display your ignorance. You truly have no clue as to tournament happenings, as evidenced by your posts. If you think Keith behaved poorly, you haven't seen the best of the best when it comes to racking problems. Enjoy the forum, Iacas. I am now of the opinion that AzBilliards isn't a good place for posters like me, a mere railbird with a zest to report my tournament experience. Your opinions are truly slanted towards degrading one of AzBilliards so-called "pros." I don't think you will be seeing Keith or myself posting here much anymore, and for that, Keith thanks you.

JAM

JAM,

I understand your sentiments and your anger and I don't think they are misplaced. Please keep in mind that even though one person posted something like that, the rest of us are not pool newbies and his comments help us judge him more than they reflect on Keith.

I appreciate your tournament updates and insights and ask you to have faith. Faith that we as a community are independent enough that opinions based on meanness, naivete or whatever motive we aren't privy to, have no bearing on our opinion or appreciation for your (and Keith's) contributions to this forum.

Cheers,
RC

 

[Timberly]

How come I got a warning for calling someone an idiot, yet other people can name call all they want and nothing happens. Also, why does Iacas get to delete posts in other threads yet nothing happens to him , and other people get banned. lol, this entire forum makes no sense.

Actually you called the person "sh!t for brains" and an "idiot".

LOL, anyone notice the one thing Iacas has ignored? The same thing Mr. Wilson has ignored repeatedly when it's brought up.... Iacas has admin controls. There was an announcement made when Mr. Wilson was named as a moderator. The last I heard, Iacas said he had admin controls to switch over the software.... that job has been done.

What gives?? Iacas, you buy the site from Mike, you go in halves?? Admin controls override moderator controls so in essence, Iacas has more power than Mr. Wilson but nothing has ever been said to anyone on the forum.

Inquiring minds have wanted and still would like to know what the deal is.

Jennie, don't let one bad apple get to you like this. The majority of us have been to numerous events and have witnessed this every time. Unlike some people, I won't name any names but do ya'll remember Valley Forge last yr? There were a few instances with different players but there was one player that had numerous issues in multiple matches... it wasn't Keith.

 

[iacas]

LOL, anyone notice the one thing Iacas has ignored?

I've ignored it (here) because I said I'd made my last post in this thread some time ago. If you want to call me out, fine, call me out. Here I am once again, contributing yet more off-topic banter to this thread in an attempt to answer your question.

The last I heard, Iacas said he had admin controls to switch over the software.... that job has been done.

vBulletin was just updated to version 3.5.4. This will require work on my behalf to once again update the skin (software) to continue to work with the new version as old templates, etc. may be over-written, the ads will need to be re-inserted, etc.

Rather than give me admin privs, remove them, give them again, remove them (ad infinitum), Mike seems to have chosen to just leave it and trust me to do the work I told him I'd do. I've let him know each time I've finished something and he's done what he's done for a reason, I'm sure.

Realize that there are various levels of "admin." I have access to only those settings that allow me to install and manage the skin(s) on this site. I cannot ban people, make sweeing changes to the forum (outside of the skin) or its membership.

I also run my own vBulletin forum and have had to ban two "people" in nearly two years of operation. One got on the site just to piss everyone off and the other was a spambot. Even if I could ban someone (again, I can't), I wouldn't here, because the simplest solution is always to ignore the trolls, and that's YOUR responsibility as a user of the forum, not the responsibility of the moderator(s).

Admin controls override moderator controls so in essence, iacas has more power than Mr. Wilson but nothing has ever been said to anyone on the forum.

Except that I don't have more control over certain (most) things. As I said, I can't ban or warn anyone (nor have I even threatened to do so, since that'd be lying as I'd be unable to back up such a threat). I can't do a lot of the things Mr. Wilson can do, because I have access to the skin-related portions of the site and little else.

Inquiring minds have wanted and still would like to know what the deal is.

Inquiring minds have never sent me a PM asking me directly, either. Instead, they've accused without knowledge or understanding, as you have done here. Do you run a vBulletin board? Do you understand that just because someone is an "admin" doesn't mean they have full privileges to do everything? Do you realize that there are several levels of admin/mod and that Mike can create as many as he wants?

Had inquiring minds asked me directly, I'd have told you exactly what I said here: I'm an admin, but a fairly "crippled" one who can do little more than change and work with the skin(s). And the only reason I can do a "little more" is because some areas that relate to the skin also relate to other parts of the forum, but they're things like the default display of the forum, # of threads to show per page, etc.

Inquiring minds will also note that as of this post, I'm not an admin, though I probably will be from time to time to do skin-related things.

Jennie, don't let one bad apple get to you like this. The majority of us have been to numerous events and have witnessed this every time. Unlike some people, I won't name any names but do ya'll remember Valley Forge last yr? There were a few instances with different players but there was one player that had numerous issues in multiple matches... it wasn't Keith.

I've attempted to honor my commitment to remain silent while people here abuse the point, miss the point, or shove it aside in their own interests. My point had nothing to do with how he was racking the balls (or how anyone was). My point got at the manner in which he behaved when asked to re-rack by Mika. He was petulent, childish, overbearing, rude, condescending, etc. You can try to side-track that as much as you'd like by talking about how tough it was to rack at that tournament, or that I'd only attended that tournament, or whatever unrelated points you want to throw out there. I don't need to attend 100 pro tournaments to know bad behavior when I see it.

 

[watchez]

I've attempted to honor my commitment to remain silent while people here abuse the point, miss the point, or shove it aside in their own interests. My point had nothing to do with how he was racking the balls (or how anyone was). My point got at the manner in which he behaved when asked to re-rack by Mika. He was petulent, childish, overbearing, rude, condescending, etc. You can try to side-track that as much as you'd like by talking about how tough it was to rack at that tournament, or that I'd only attended that tournament, or whatever unrelated points you want to throw out there. I don't need to attend 100 pro tournaments to know bad behavior when I see it.

And you side-track my point to you that you state that you looked thru your expensive camera lens time & time again to see the gaps in the balls but failed to take one picture? Iacas, I think maybe you witnessed Keith get out of line with Mika but then exaggerated your point to a lie when you stated you could see the gaps. This puts a dent in your whole topic & to your credibility. Go to your local pool hall, sit in the stands (stand on a stool or whatever) about as far away as you were from the KM-Mika match, take a picture of a rack with gaps & post it here.

 

[iacas]

And you side-track my point to you that you state that you looked thru your expensive camera lens time & time again to see the gaps in the balls but failed to take one picture? Iacas, I think maybe you witnessed Keith get out of line with Mika but then exaggerated your point to a lie when you stated you could see the gaps. This puts a dent in your whole topic & to your credibility. Go to your local pool hall, sit in the stands (stand on a stool or whatever) about as far away as you were from the KM-Mika match, take a picture of a rack with gaps & post it here.

You know, I had a whole rant typed up, but it's just not worth it.

The gaps (which were there, and even if they hadn't been, are irrelevant to the way Keith behaved) are off-topic. And I don't recall saying "expensive," either. I don't need to take a picture (one you'd simply call a "fake" anyway). Go research the science of camera optics. Figure out what you can see on an 8+ megapixel Canon with a 500mm lens at 15-20 yards. I know what the answer is, and it doesn't look good for you.

As a general rule, I try not to discuss things with people whose main methods are erecting straw men (and other irrelevancies), putting words in my mouth, or calling me names.

The countless PMs I've gotten saying "you won't win, but thanks for saying it" back up my earlier assertion that the behavior of all those calling me names does more to harm their reputation than it has mine.

So I've lost favor with some of you? Big deal. Ask yourselves why, though: because I didn't like the way Keith treated an opponent and dared to say so? Oh my goodness, are we living in China or something? How dare I have an opinion and express it in as respectful and intelligent a tone as possible.

Bah, this is turning into a rant again. I'd agree to disagree, but again, we're discussing an opinion (mine) based on an event almost none of you witnessed. I'm done with this thread.

 

[Icon of Sin]

Way to go Keith, Im always happy to see you place well.

Jam, dont leave, you are a valuable asset to this board.

 

[Gunn_Slinger]

I've ignored it (here) because I said I'd made my last post in this thread some time ago. If you want to call me out, fine, call me out. Here I am once again, contributing yet more off-topic banter to this thread in an attempt to answer your question.


vBulletin was just updated to version 3.5.4. This will require work on my behalf to once again update the skin (software) to continue to work with the new version as old templates, etc. may be over-written, the ads will need to be re-inserted, etc.

Rather than give me admin privs, remove them, give them again, remove them (ad infinitum), Mike seems to have chosen to just leave it and trust me to do the work I told him I'd do. I've let him know each time I've finished something and he's done what he's done for a reason, I'm sure.

Realize that there are various levels of "admin." I have access to only those settings that allow me to install and manage the skin(s) on this site. I cannot ban people, make sweeing changes to the forum (outside of the skin) or its membership.

I also run my own vBulletin forum and have had to ban two "people" in nearly two years of operation. One got on the site just to piss everyone off and the other was a spambot. Even if I could ban someone (again, I can't), I wouldn't here, because the simplest solution is always to ignore the trolls, and that's YOUR responsibility as a user of the forum, not the responsibility of the moderator(s).


Except that I don't have more control over certain (most) things. As I said, I can't ban or warn anyone (nor have I even threatened to do so, since that'd be lying as I'd be unable to back up such a threat). I can't do a lot of the things Mr. Wilson can do, because I have access to the skin-related portions of the site and little else.


Inquiring minds have never sent me a PM asking me directly, either. Instead, they've accused without knowledge or understanding, as you have done here. Do you run a vBulletin board? Do you understand that just because someone is an "admin" doesn't mean they have full privileges to do everything? Do you realize that there are several levels of admin/mod and that Mike can create as many as he wants?

Had inquiring minds asked me directly, I'd have told you exactly what I said here: I'm an admin, but a fairly "crippled" one who can do little more than change and work with the skin(s). And the only reason I can do a "little more" is because some areas that relate to the skin also relate to other parts of the forum, but they're things like the default display of the forum, # of threads to show per page, etc.

Inquiring minds will also note that as of this post, I'm not an admin, though I probably will be from time to time to do skin-related things.


I've attempted to honor my commitment to remain silent while people here abuse the point, miss the point, or shove it aside in their own interests. My point had nothing to do with how he was racking the balls (or how anyone was). My point got at the manner in which he behaved when asked to re-rack by Mika. He was petulent, childish, overbearing, rude, condescending, etc. You can try to side-track that as much as you'd like by talking about how tough it was to rack at that tournament, or that I'd only attended that tournament, or whatever unrelated points you want to throw out there. I don't need to attend 100 pro tournaments to know bad behavior when I see it.

Since you won't go on my ignore list and I have to see the longwinded stuff you type pleases answer the following two questions with yes or no answers

1. Did you delete the TBA posts out of the thread you started

2. Did you get a picture of the rack you said you saw that was so poorly racked?

Please answer yes or no on the forum don't send me anymore pm's

 

[Egg McDogit]

So I've lost favor with some of you? Big deal. Ask yourselves why, though: because I didn't like the way Keith treated an opponent and dared to say so? Oh my goodness, are we living in China or something? How dare I have an opinion and express it in as respectful and intelligent a tone as possible.

you didn't express your opinion respectfully - one of the first things you did was slam Keith

you didn't express your opinion intelligently either. it strongly reflects the fact that you knowing nothing about this game. and it's REALLY REALLY REALLY OBVIOUS to anyone who does - believe me.

what is pissing a lot of people off is that you are singling out and disrespecting someone about something that you know nothing about - and you're so stupid and ignorant that you don't even understand how stupid and ignorant you're being. Someone tried to explain to you why what you said is so stupid and ignorant, but I guess you missed their point.

 

[watchez]

You know, I had a whole rant typed up, but it's just not worth it.

Okay lets go over your original statement

I could see the gaps a few rows back in the stands.

This infers that you could see it with the naked eye. That exactly the impression you wanted to give to readers of your post until JAM questioned that you could not possibly 'see' any gaps.

No, I'm not claiming that I could see them with my bare eyes. But with a 500mm zoom lens? Yeah, I could. It ain't an impossibility. That's what zoom lenses do...

This is your crawdad statement. Ok, maybe you didn't say your lens was expensive & I will admit I don't know a thing about cameras. But a 8+ megapixel Canon 500mm zoom lens sounds expensive. My point is and am willing to have you prove it, that you didn't take any pictures of what you saw even though you had camera in hand. And maybe a zoom 500mm lens could get a nice close up pic and show the gaps but you also have to deal with the ANGLE of the shot, not just distance.

None of my post was "holier than thou"

As a general rule, I try not to discuss things with people whose main methods are erecting straw men (and other irrelevancies), putting words in my mouth, or calling me names.

Now you sound as if you believe you are holier than me. Another contradiction as you cannot stand behind anything you say.

Also, you should know that I have had my run ins with JAM/KM in the past thru another board as I called KM out on an article he wrote in a national billiard magazine. JAM thinks of me as 'the crackpot of Missouri', if you want to know. So, I am probably theh least likely person on this board to jump to 'their' side. Yes JAM can be too defending & blinded by all of what KM does & says but that is her perogative. I guess love is in fact blinding in some cases. However, when you came up with the camera lens bullsh** even I will step in to set you straight.

 

[UpThrill6]

you didn't express your opinion respectfully - one of the first things you did was slam Keith

you didn't express your opinion intelligently either. it strongly reflects the fact that you knowing nothing about this game. and it's REALLY REALLY REALLY OBVIOUS to anyone who does - believe me.

what is pissing a lot of people off is that you are singling out and disrespecting someone about something that you know nothing about - and you're so stupid and ignorant that you don't even understand how stupid and ignorant you're being. Someone tried to explain to you why what you said is so stupid and ignorant, but I guess you missed their point.

Tap,Tap,Tap, I was talking to friend of mine and Keith has not alway been the peach that he is today, but as time passes we all get older and mellow out, "I bet Grady can attest to that."

 

[Rich R.]

Go research the science of camera optics. Figure out what you can see on an 8+ megapixel Canon with a 500mm lens at 15-20 yards. I know what the answer is, and it doesn't look good for you.

First of all, the 8+ mega pixels wouldn't mean a damn thing, as far as what you saw through the lens of the camera. They would only affect the image computer file and the final printed image, if you took the picture.

On another note, you previously indicated that you were using a zoom lens. In this post, you indicated that your lens was 500mm and the camera was a Canon.
Canon doesn't make a zoom lens that goes up to 500mm, which indicates that you were using some type of cheap, off brand lens, with inferior glass.

Previously, you also said you couldn't take pictures, because the lens gave you too close of a view.
Assuming, the 500mm was the top end of the zoom, you should have been able to back off to the low end of the zoom and get some good pictures. Also, I can't believe that every table in the place was too close to you, for you to take pictures. If you didn't take pictures, after hauling a heavy camera and lens with you, I have to assume that your main problem was not the focal length of the zoom lens. Your main problem was the low light situation, as indicated in your wife's pictures. Your big zoom lens was too slow the get a decent image in the low light conditions.

I know I'm making a lot of assumptions here, and I know what happens when people 'ass'ume things, but in this instance, I believe I am correct.

You had a nice camera, with a cheap, off brand lens, that was too slow to get pictures in the low light situation, and you want us to believe that you got a good view of the gaps between the balls.
Sorry, but I don't buy it for a second.

I've had some experience with the off brand lenses and they are just not sharp and they do not give you a crisp view.

I also don't buy the bit about your main point being the way Keith was acting towards Mika. If I was giving Mika as good a rack as possible, and he was whining about it, as he has been known to do, I wouldn't treat him too well either. It's extremely irritating to be forced to keep reracking, when nothing is wrong with the rack.

BTW, a little hint for the furure, if you plan to take pictures at pool tournaments, get the fastest, highest quality lens available, in a usable focal length. Since you have a Canon camera, I highly recommend the Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 zoom, with the image stabilizer. From my experience, it works extremely well and I know, for a fact, several of the pool magazine photographers are using that lens.

 

[watchez]

First of all, the 8+ mega pixels wouldn't mean a damn thing, as far as what you saw through the lens of the camera. They would only affect the image computer file and the final printed image, if you took the picture.

On another note, you previously indicated that you were using a zoom lens. In this post, you indicated that your lens was 500mm and the camera was a Canon.
Canon doesn't make a zoom lens that goes up to 500mm, which indicates that you were using some type of cheap, off brand lens, with inferior glass.

Previously, you also said you couldn't take pictures, because the lens gave you too close of a view.
Assuming, the 500mm was the top end of the zoom, you should have been able to back off to the low end of the zoom and get some good pictures. Also, I can't believe that every table in the place was too close to you, for you to take pictures. If you didn't take pictures, after hauling a heavy camera and lens with you, I have to assume that your main problem was not the focal length of the zoom lens. Your main problem was the low light situation, as indicated in your wife's pictures. Your big zoom lens was too slow the get a decent image in the low light conditions.

I know I'm making a lot of assumptions here, and I know what happens when people 'ass'ume things, but in this instance, I believe I am correct.

You had a nice camera, with a cheap, off brand lens, that was too slow to get pictures in the low light situation, and you want us to believe that you got a good view of the gaps between the balls.
Sorry, but I don't buy it for a second.

.....yeah, what he said. Finally, a man that sounds like he knows what he is talking about.

 

[Jaden]

I don't get it.....

If those of you who are complaining about IACAS coming on and degrading the validity of KM's achievement are wanting the achievement to be the highlight of this thread, then why in the hell are you continuingthis banter about zoom lenses and such?

Why didn't you just ignore his original comment and go on with some posts about the achievement?

I don't know wether I believe IACAS' comment was malicious in nature or not, but I do know that by continuing with the complaining like you all have done you have empowered his original post in the exact way you were complaining about. His comment was an opinion nothing more.

Ignore it move on and don't empower it by feeding it the way you have....

This is just my opinion.....

 

[pillage6]

Personally I really can't see how you can see gaps in a rack from that far away. There is a reason why people have their noses basically buried in the rack looking at it from all angles and covering it from the light to show gaps better. Sitting in one place more than 10 feet away is no way to tell if there are gaps in a rack.

 

[breakup]

Opinions are stated to convince, manipulate, insult, praise, inform etc. etc. etc. They are not meaningless. They can and do have affect on people and should not be trivialized in their affect. It is a shallow position to hide behind righteous indignation citing an inherent right to express an opinion without regard to how offensive some may find it. The “forum leaders” page is full of them.

 

[Perk]

You are not gonna see the gaps looking INTO the rack due to the lack of light inside the rack. You check racks by viewing top down looking from the inside out. Check your next rack from the outside and it may look fine, but from the inside it may show the gaps since there is more light on the outside of the rack. Would be interesting to see a picture in question even though it has no bearing on: KM's great finish, his antics, or this post in general. Heck, I might want to purchase a similar camera.

Congrats to Keith for his finish in the event, glad to see you playing well. JAM, please continue to post your thoughts, results, and photos on these forums. There are plenty of people that enjoy them.

Iacas in the pool world there are many issues with the racks amongst players. I have witnessed many people get irritated with racks, and unfortunately it can be a game within itself. Each player may handle these situations differently, and you made your views of KM known. Plenty good, move on with life to your next tourney.