Kill Shot

boogieman said:
Elevate the butt and strike with the edge of the tip (top edge of the tip contacts the CB). After that, it's all about controlling and refining this stroke, as it amplifies any fundamental issues. Look up the 8 ball bible by monk. He elaborates on the 4 stokes needed and gives you plenty of drills to hone them with.

EDIT: I misunderstood, I thought you were wanting to kill the ball dead on a hard shot. I still recommend the book above though, it gets you understanding the different types of shot required at some point in your pool career.
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No need to elevate the butt of the cuestick. You're striking the edge of the CB with the edge of the tip in almost all shots. The Eight Ball Bible was not written by The Monk (Tim Miller). Far from it, it was written by Robin Givens, and is a great bar table pool resource. The Monk's baloney about 4 different strokes is just that. There is only one stroke...just many ways to use it.

Scott Lee
2019 PBIA Instructor of the Year
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour
 
Scott Lee said:
No need to elevate the butt of the cuestick. You're striking the edge of the CB with the edge of the tip in almost all shots. The Eight Ball Bible was not written by The Monk (Tim Miller). Far from it, it was written by Robin Givens, and is a great bar table pool resource. The Monk's baloney about 4 different strokes is just that. There is only one stroke...just many ways to use it.

Scott Lee
2019 PBIA Instructor of the Year
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour
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Sorry, it was The 8-Ball Book by The Monk.

I respect your thoughts on strokes, I'm just a mid level player, but to me it seems there is more than one type of stroke. A punch stroke is mechanically different than a follow, a half masse is different from both. You can get by or excel with one type of stroke, but to say there is one type of stroke... I don't buy it. A hard stroke is even different than a shot where you baby it like in 14:1. I'm genuinely curious what you mean, again, no disrespect but I don't see it. 🤔
 
boogieman said:
Sorry, it was The 8-Ball Book by The Monk.

I respect your thoughts on strokes, I'm just a mid level player, but to me it seems there is more than one type of stroke. A punch stroke is mechanically different than a follow, a half masse is different from both. You can get by or excel with one type of stroke, but to say there is one type of stroke... I don't buy it. A hard stroke is even different than a shot where you baby it like in 14:1. I'm genuinely curious what you mean, again, no disrespect but I don't see it. 🤔
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Whether you "buy it" or not means nothing to me. Many players believe there are lots of different kinds of strokes (some instructors too). We don't! Like my buddy and fellow Master Instructor Randyg says: "There's only two strokes...a good one and a bad one." We prefer to teach good ones! Students who want to learn more and excel, learn how to develop their ONE stroke, so that it can be applied to almost an infinite series of situations.

Scott Lee
2019 PBIA Instructor of the Year
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour
 
Scott Lee said:
Whether you "buy it" or not means nothing to me. Many players believe there are lots of different kinds of strokes (some instructors too). We don't! Like my buddy and fellow Master Instructor Randyg says: "There's only two strokes...a good one and a bad one." We prefer to teach good ones! Students who want to learn more and excel, learn how to develop their ONE stroke, so that it can be applied to almost an infinite series of situations.

Scott Lee
2019 PBIA Instructor of the Year
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour
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So again, respectfully what is the "one" stroke? I might "buy it" if you care to explain it. I'm not attacking you or anything, I'd genuinely like to hear your thoughts on this. I'm not so stupid as to think a man awarded Instructor of the Year is full of shit. I understand everyone's mechanics are slightly different. I'm not trying to piss in your boots, really I am just curious. If you have to put draw on a shot that is 1" from the rail... do you stroke it the same as a follow shot in the middle of the table? Both shots can be stroked "good" or "bad" but the mechanics of the stroke seem nothing alike to me. Again, I'm a mid level player and might just be ignorant but I'd genuinely like to learn and see things the right way.
 
boogieman said:
So again, respectfully what is the "one" stroke? ...
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The main idea is that for the vast majority of shots, one single set of mechanics is not only adequate but it is as good as or better than any other approach. Of course you have to adjust elevation and bridge style in various situations, but there is no good reason to change the fundamental parts of the stroke, usually.

Some players feel they get some benefit out of punch or quick or flowing or extended or .... strokes for specific shots. As an example, someone might feel that they play a better stop shot with what they call a punch stroke. If such a mental/psychological preparation helps them shoot stop shots better, I guess that's OK for them, but a standard, normal stroke will probably be more effective for them in the long run. "Punch" does not get any kind of special "kill spin" on the cue ball that you can't get on the cue ball at least as easily with a normal, standard stroke.
 
Bob Jewett said:
The main idea is that for the vast majority of shots, one single set of mechanics is not only adequate but it is as good as or better than any other approach. Of course you have to adjust elevation and bridge style in various situations, but there is no good reason to change the fundamental parts of the stroke, usually.

Some players feel they get some benefit out of punch or quick or flowing or extended or .... strokes for specific shots. As an example, someone might feel that they play a better stop shot with what they call a punch stroke. If such a mental/psychological preparation helps them shoot stop shots better, I guess that's OK for them, but a standard, normal stroke will probably be more effective for them in the long run. "Punch" does not get any kind of special "kill spin" on the cue ball that you can't get on the cue ball at least as easily with a normal, standard stroke.
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Thanks Bob!
 
boogieman said:
So again, respectfully what is the "one" stroke? I might "buy it" if you care to explain it. I'm not attacking you or anything, I'd genuinely like to hear your thoughts on this. I'm not so stupid as to think a man awarded Instructor of the Year is full of shit. I understand everyone's mechanics are slightly different. I'm not trying to piss in your boots, really I am just curious. If you have to put draw on a shot that is 1" from the rail... do you stroke it the same as a follow shot in the middle of the table? Both shots can be stroked "good" or "bad" but the mechanics of the stroke seem nothing alike to me. Again, I'm a mid level player and might just be ignorant but I'd genuinely like to learn and see things the right way.
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Bob Jewett explained it quite adequately. The student is taught how to assess, create and implement their own custom stroke. So, while technically you're right that everybody's a little bit different, we help students to "find" their best process, practice it correctly, until it replaces what they used to do. Explaining the stroke process is much easier done in person on the table, with video analysis to assist and reinforce. If you're ever interested I'd be happy to explain it to you in person....and you're right, someone doesn't get voted instructor of the year without merit! I do know what I'm talking about! LOL

Scott Lee
2019 PBIA Instructor of the Year
Director, SPF National Pool School Tour
 
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