Last night

bobforest

bobforest

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hi guys

Just looking for some opinions on an incident last night. I was playing in an 8-ball bar tournament - quite relaxed atmosphere, good vibes and the only thing we're playing for is pride and a cheapo bottle of whiskey.

Anyway, I was just a spectator in this particular game, a player makes a shot using the rest, after he shoots he tries to lift the rest off the table and the end falls off and lands on the table. The object ball is potted legally but the cue ball rebounds off the rail and hits the end of the rest. Now both players, being good-natured, just shrug and continue as if nothing happened. However, the next shot was on the 8-ball. the cue ball had stopped in a position that left a simple shot, whereas if the cue ball had continued on its original path it would have been a much trickier shot.

So... my question is - What would you have done in this situation??? we play by WPA rules - but I'm more interested in what you think is 'right' in a more 'moral' sense.
 
Double D, I like your idea of the game replayed, however I saw a high dollar game of 1 hole lost to the exactly the same thing. The head of the bridge fell off and broke up some balls and the other guy called it a foul since it hit balls in motion.--Smitty
 
bobforest said:
Hi guys

Just looking for some opinions on an incident last night. I was playing in an 8-ball bar tournament - quite relaxed atmosphere, good vibes and the only thing we're playing for is pride and a cheapo bottle of whiskey.

Anyway, I was just a spectator in this particular game, a player makes a shot using the rest, after he shoots he tries to lift the rest off the table and the end falls off and lands on the table. The object ball is potted legally but the cue ball rebounds off the rail and hits the end of the rest. Now both players, being good-natured, just shrug and continue as if nothing happened. However, the next shot was on the 8-ball. the cue ball had stopped in a position that left a simple shot, whereas if the cue ball had continued on its original path it would have been a much trickier shot.

So... my question is - What would you have done in this situation??? we play by WPA rules - but I'm more interested in what you think is 'right' in a more 'moral' sense.
Click to expand...
As a spectator??? Absolutely do nothing.

As a player, it all depends on who I'm playing. If we agreed on rules and we're cool with each other especially just playing for pride and a cheapo bottle of whiskey, it's going to be called a foul by both of us.

Freddie <~~~ Black Velvet if you please
 
Sitting at the computer my answer is "I would hand my opponent the cue ball."

In actuality, I would probably look at my opponent and ask what he wants to do about it.

matthew ← not as good in real life as I am on paper. :wink:
 
I'm not sure what being a friendly game really has to do with it. It's a rather blatant rule violation IMHO and a foul, the CB was interfered with by the shooter. BIH for his opponent, shouldn't even have been a question. If it was that friendly, the shooter should have handed his opponent the CB. In my own experience, one way to turn a friendly game unfriendly is to start ignoring the rules.
 
bobforest said:
hi guys

just looking for some opinions on an incident last night. I was playing in an 8-ball bar tournament - quite relaxed atmosphere, good vibes and the only thing we're playing for is pride and a cheapo bottle of whiskey.

Anyway, i was just a spectator in this particular game, a player makes a shot using the rest, after he shoots he tries to lift the rest off the table and the end falls off and lands on the table. The object ball is potted legally but the cue ball rebounds off the rail and hits the end of the rest. Now both players, being good-natured, just shrug and continue as if nothing happened. However, the next shot was on the 8-ball. The cue ball had stopped in a position that left a simple shot, whereas if the cue ball had continued on its original path it would have been a much trickier shot.

So... My question is - what would you have done in this situation??? We play by wpa rules - but i'm more interested in what you think is 'right' in a more 'moral' sense.
Click to expand...

foul!...........
 
Cornerman said:
As a spectator??? Absolutely do nothing.

As a player, it all depends on who I'm playing. If we agreed on rules and we're cool with each other especially just playing for pride and a cheapo bottle of whiskey, it's going to be called a foul by both of us.

Freddie <~~~ Black Velvet if you please
Click to expand...

I agree with the spectator answer.

If it's a pal who commits the foul, I hurriedly say foul, run out the rack and get two glasses to share that bottle of cheap whiskey.

If it is an acquaintance or a stranger, I just sit like a Tibetan Monk committed to a lifetime of silence.
 
I try to be decent to other people and not penalize them for bad luck caused by outside factors.
For example if someone bumps my opponent and causes them to tap the cue ball, I just tell 'em to reset it.

In the case of a moving ball getting stopped, if the opponent is amenable,
I suggest we pull up the sunk ball and restore it (and the cue ball) to their positions before the bridge shot.
Then the player must re-attempt the bridge shot.
To me that feels much more fair than replaying the whole rack, or collecting ball in hand, or just accepting it.
 
Technically it's a foul, same as if a chalk was dropped in the path of the ball by the player or he dropped his cue stick. However, if I was playing with someone in a non-finals match (regular league game or a cheap local tournament), I would probably ignore the foul since the player could not control how well the bridge head was on the cue, unless it was obviously wobbly to begin with and was used anyway. If he checked the bridge, make sure it was solid, then it fell off, eh, no biggie if it fell off afterward.
 
The shooter did not cause the foul as described. The plastic head of the bridge "fell off" while lifting the bridge off the table, and when it crashed to the table it disturbed the balls.

Would this fall under act of god? What if the rack hanging on the light falls down in the middle of a game and lands on the balls. I see this as the same situation.
 
the fact that it was a friendly game meant that no one wanted a row over the rules to spoil a good night out (isn't that what pool is all about for most of us?)

the choice between foul or play-on basically gifted the game to one or the other player, when it was neither player's fault IMO. It was down to the bar's crappy equipment. I personally never like to try to re-spot balls to their original positions, it just seems wrong

Reading the responses so far - i think a re-rack is the 'moral' answer (regardless of the whiskey involved)

anyway, thanks for taking the time to respond

Bob
 
iusedtoberich said:
The shooter did not cause the foul as described. The plastic head of the bridge "fell off" while lifting the bridge off the table, and when it crashed to the table it disturbed the balls.

Would this fall under act of god? What if the rack hanging on the light falls down in the middle of a game and lands on the balls. I see this as the same situation.
Click to expand...

The player is "responsible for the equipment he uses at the table". Meaning he needed to check to make sure the bridge head was on tight and when he lifted it, he did not push on it to loosen it. I can see that happening, if it's at the edge and you push on the bridge a bit during the shot or when moving it.

If a rail fell of or something, or the light in your example, it would not be "equipment the player was using".

I'm sure a ref would call a foul on the player if this happened in a real tournament.
 
I think if it was the player's personal equipment like a bat bridge or such he may be more culpable than if it was the common bridge of the room. I would offer to replay the game if I was the offender and feel lucky if the other player didn't try to call a foul. These guys were probably in a hurry to get it over and share the whiskey.

JC
 
Had a similar instance like this last night in my APA match. My opponent made a legal shot using the bridge, upon lifting the bridge moved the 8 ball. The cue ball bounces off the rail and contacts the 8 ball. According to the APA rules it is a clear foul...but of course it is a rarely called foul due to people not knowing the rules. Needless to say the opponent wasn't too fond of it being called seeing they were already down 4-1 and I'm on the hill.
I guess depending on what I was playing I may just ignore it...but given who I was playing I wasn't letting it go.
On the other end...this session I have actually called this foul on myself...of course leaving my opponent totally confused because he had no idea why it was a foul.

Oh...I have 4 balls on the table...they were on the 8...I take ball in hand...run out the rack for the match.
 
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