How about that, a padded and form fitted case. Just what you want when it goes flying around in a tornado.
I guess this guy was happy that his guitar wasn't banging against the sides of the case in that tornado.
Liar, Liar case on fire...
- Thread starter classiccues
- Start date
How about that, a padded and form fitted case. Just what you want when it goes flying around in a tornado.
I guess this guy was happy that his guitar wasn't banging against the sides of the case in that tornado.
No, we have a case that took on a fire, now its your turn. Find someone willing to put in a Bushka. The benchmark is already set.
JV
The other issue here is that any case we have Fellini or other, are substatially more valueable than a GTF. I mean really, what would you have into the case? Forty bucks, a bowl of rice and some fish? Lets be realistic here. As I said, one test has already been completed, step up to the plate.
I mean they are the most bestest designed 1x2 there is, right? It shouldn't be hard to get ONE of your happy loyal customers to ship you a Balabushka of an approximate value of 8500?
JV
I have a unknown case with cue and chalk , I used to keep in my Peterbuilt . Got a little warm now haveing trouble getting it out of the case . . Thanks Jim
That cue needs a set of j/p's
Great, well then go buy a Fellini then. Oh wait, there aren't any more. So I guess that leaves Ron Thomas and GTF and possibly It's George if they ever actually really come out again.
And why does it need to be a Balabushka? Those are legendary for their awesome construction. Wouldn't it be much better if we put an el cheapo chinese cue in that supposedly can't withstand the heat from a cigarette within five feet of it? If we used one of those for the test and it came out unscathed then we could logically conclude that anything made to a better standard should also be ok. Agreed?
I think I will do the test. You seem to think for some reason that our case won't handle it. Well, I am willing to try and if I am wrong then I will address it at that point and get busy reformulating the tubes to resist more heat. And if the GTF does hold up as well then I can use that too.
Either way the point is made that protection matters. I am sure that the owner of the Bushka didn't intend to test it this way but for all those who come on here and say protection is overrated, well apparently not when it's an $8000 at stake.
You mean the $55 Fellini is worth more? Or the artificially inflated "collector" priced Fellini is worth more? I mean if you want to get into prices and all we can talk about $85 Palmers you sell for $1200 now. What make thems worth $1200 to anyone? Oh desire. Yes. Which is the same reason why an Ipad that is torn apart and broken down by the cost of the parts comes in at about $200 but sells more than 30 million of them for $6-900. Desire.
Which is why you can buy a cue for 30-50% off the retail and make up to 100% profit or more on it. Desire.
I might have $10 in a GTF or I might have $100 or whatever - it doesn't matter because the only thing that the customer cares about is are they getting what they want for a price they consider to be a good value. So far that is working just fine and everybody in the chain is happy.
No one is asking you to detail how much you make or the cost of building the cues you sell. I don't understand that you resort to this knock every time but it won't work.
But you are right in that I can certainly afford to sacrifice a GTF easier than you can a Fellini. And I really don't need you to reduce the amount of surviving Fellini cases just to prove that our case is as good or better. I can build a fire and stick one or ten in as I please and collect all the data I want and choose to use it any which way I please. Using your story as a springboard for the marketing of protection and why it's important.
So, challenge accepted, sans Bushka. I will have to use a cheaper cue than that and just hope that everyone knows that if a lesser cue is ok then a Bushka will probably be okay as well.
In that case (no pun intended) I have a few questions:
- Are you going to do any pre-testing prior to the actual test
- Will it be a full burn or partial burn
- Can you simulate the same flame and temperature conditions as the Fellini / Balabushka burn
YouTube please?
John, please do not set yourself on fire while doing this test, it will be like when you miscued during the Kamui chalk test. 
I might.
Well I think that the idea is to see if the case can protect the cue for a while before the fire melts the plastic and opens the case to the flame. So I guess I would want to leave it in until I see it in about the same condition as the Fellini shown.
I suppose that I could try to figure out what those might have been based on the condition of the Fellini? It would be really hard to duplicate this as we don't really know what those conditions were other than leaves caught fire and car burned. No idea how close to the flame the case was, what if any extra accelerants were present or what not. Maybe it's best to just use a blowtorch. I am open to suggestion.
I think distance and cost are prohibitive.
But of course, what other way is there? If I could possibly live stream it I would.
John, please do not set yourself on fire while doing this test, it will be like when you miscued during the Kamui chalk test.
Noted. I will try to remember to stay upwind. Although I think Joe and a few others would be more than happy to test just how flame resistant John Barton is these days.
I think distance and cost are prohibitive.
In that case (again, no pun intended) I suggest you review the API procedures for controlled burn testing
Be happy to if we can have a fire there.
This is China we don't follow no procedures
This is China we don't follow no procedures
No OSHA, WOW that's unbelievable.
Well OK, I just don't want to read about you in one of Cocobolo Cowboy's copy & paste threads.
Oh there is a TON of rules on the books. In fact the way I hear it is that the safety standards are tougher than OSHA's. But the Chinese have another saying and it goes that the Emperor is far away and cannot see or something like that.
My wife's friend owns a machine shop, they make molds for styrofoam containers. Lots of heavy steel blocks and tools around. All the worker work in flip flops. I asked the owner why they don't wear steel-toed safety boots. He said he bought them for everyone but they won't wear them. Same thing in another factory with ear splitting noise, I said why don't they wear ear plugs? The foreman took me over to a cabinet with a huge full box of them. They don't like them, superstitious about them. And despite what everyone thinks there is NOT a line at the gate in front of every factory of people wanting a job. So employers give in when they know that workers SHOULD be wearing safety gear or doing something a safe way but they refuse to.
And of course some employers could care less or don't even try to provide a safe environment. And yet others DO impose the rules and their factories are run as safely as any in the USA. So it goes the whole range here.
Last edited:
We built a couple of large ISO 9001 manufacturing plants in China.
When they moved 1000 miles away not one employee moved with them, and at least 400 were offered jobs.
You didn't have to do that I am happy to answer your questions.
Yes the GTF is a knockoff of the Fellini and Centennial cases. I was asked if I could do this type of case by Roy Malott and I accepted the commission. Ever since I had seen the cover of the Snap Magazine that featured a Szamboti box cue with a matching Fellini case I had been in love with the super clean look of the Fellini case. Having seen many case makers do this style over the years I decided to try my hand at it.
But as with everything I do I had to try and find a way to do something more with this style and put my own philosophy into it. What I did was add more padding to it and bring the fabric over the ends to eliminate the interior degradation that is sometimes see on these cases. I also wanted to eliminate any chance that the cue could touch plastic.
Then I decided to use a latch that could be easily replaced should it break as I had personally found latch replacement to be a big problem on this style of case over the years. I wanted to make a case that didn't need a latch to stay closed but for those that want one the latch is easy to replace.
Then I focused on the ends and devised a way to fold them over in such a way as to make them permanently secure. A by product of this is that the center cap on the Replica series of GTF can be removed easily and replaced with a personalized piece. This can be done by any cue maker, trophy shop, or anyone with a laser engraver.
I also redesigned the pockets on the 2x4s and made them stronger inside and out. Once the construction was complete and I felt that I had made a better case I focused on the decoration and went in search of many different leathers to make a batch of really cool cases in addition to the common black and brown ones.
Stuff like this
And then we started doing the tooling and I am very proud to say that I personally believe we really raised the bar here. We were I believe the first to tool over the seam on this style of case and the results were pretty nice in my eyes.
Front and Back
And then I was given the commission to do my own version of the famous Fellini Szamboti case to match a different Szamboti. I was really honored to be chosen for this and it took us two tries to get it right.
And so much more we have been able to do with this style. Yes, GTF is clearly taken from Fellini and Centennial. I have always been 100% up front on this point from the very first post I ever made on AZ about them and continuing today. More than any other case maker I acknowledge my ancestors constantly and give them praise and thanks for the foundation they laid.
Far from being lazy I feel that I have taken this style to new levels previously unseen and preserved it for generations to come.