Long Draw Shot

the problem here is just about everyone on az will give people the benefit of the doubt (myself included) but when all u are doing is wasting a lot of people's time and even bandwidth at the amount of posts somethings gotta give, take russ for instance he has ruffled a lot of feathers in the recent past but the guy is willing to take at least some of the criticism thrown at him and alter some of the things he did wrong and also when he's attacked he can fight back or roll with the punches
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stroke check!

i call shots like this stroke check shots. for the simple reason that if you miss the ball or don't draw the ball enough, the cause is usually a flaw in your stroke and/or alignment.
 
> I find that it is as easy to miss this ball with your feet,as it is to miss it by something you actually do with your stroke. What I mean by this is maybe a misalignment is the problem,with something in your stance causing the error. I've personally found that in most cases where a miss completely takes me by surprise,the error was caused by me getting lost in my rhythm and not consciously taking the time to step into the shot correctly. Something like this sends incorrect info to your brain,which tries to compensate by swerving the cue on delivery,chokes the stroke off short,or any number of other things that can cause what is to me the most distasteful way to lose,missing a ball you just KNEW you made when you swung at it.


Are you practicing this shot on a home table? Try using a chalk line and laying down a dead straight line,and using hole reinforcements to set the balls along the same line. Set the cue ball in one of them,and the object ball in the other,and shoot a couple hundred of these,pretty soon you can feel when something is out of line,and back off to correct it. Tommy D.
 
nothing to do

Russ Chewning said:
Now that you've read the posts from people (like me) who've seen the hundreds of posts exactly like this from DCP...

Don't you feel silly? :D :D :D :D

Russ
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People like you should stay out of posts like this,
go back to barking at people you'll never play. :)
 
New tip. Anytime you have one of these questions, practice it 250 times in a row...then see if you still need to post it.
 
If most of you set this shot up on your table as it is diagrammed, I think alot of you will find that it's not THAT difficult. If the cueball were back another 12 or 16 inches, then yes it's fairly tough. I don't mean to offend, but I am getting the impression from some people that just looking at the diagram makes them cringe with horror. :D
 
Russ Chewning said:
People, people, people, people. Those of us that know DCP know that he isn't actually planning on taking anyone's advice if they are actually saying he has to practice a shot.

He wants a "quick fix" for every tough shot or position. He never responds to anyone who suggests he should practice a shot he has trouble.

Just figured I'd let you all know, lest you waste your time with him. :D

Russ
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just soes everyone will know...........

i already have a list started of shots i want to practice tonight. and this long, straight draw shot is #1 on the list. also have made some notations from some of the points you posters have mentioned in this thread.

those that make positive, constructive criticisms/comments on my threads - you are very much appreciated. and trust me, i do read them, and learn from them.

the rest of you posters - well, as Gomer said, "You can just go off into an alley and yell fish!" :eek:

DCP
 
I think it's not easy - especially when you have to do it for the cash. If the 9-ball were a little closer to the 5-ball or if the 5 ball were a hair further up table and closer to the rail (to make the window smaller), I'd bet everyone on the board $20 / try they couldn't get to your marked position, and over 98% would quit after $80 left their pocket. It's real hard to do when you HAVE to.

Based on what others have said before me, I wouldn't waste your time practicing that. Long, precision draw shots are out of your ability, %-wise. You're better off not wasting time practicing it..... snap that CB back as far as possible and focus on being long, than short. If you miss your mark, play safe.

But if you really want to practice it, straighten your stroke first. If you missed that, you're stroking crooked or jumping up--- which, either way, makes this shot way out of your ability %-wise. Someone before me said to setup an OB along a diamond on the rail... and practice drawing back 1 diamond at a time. Do the "ladder" if you know what I mean.

Better yet, do Kinister's Shot #1 like 5000 times. You'd be surprised how that will help every other shot in pool.
 
although the draw shot is a good option here, you could also have cheated the pocket a little bit, rolled the cueball softly up to the rail where the "b" cueball is and off a bit and just taking that shot on the five. You run a big risk when shooting harder at the ball of being off line just a little by jerking your stroke and ending up missing the ball.
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
had this shot today and elected to try and draw back. i didnt see any other way to get back up table for the 5-Ball since the shot was perfectly straight in. besides, i wanted to work on my long draw shots so i decided to go with this. anyway, i missed a mile. i wanted to draw back to around Point A but i overcut the shot to around Point B, and the 4-Ball came off the short rail, back up table.

do you posters struggle with this long draw shot? seems like when i have to hit it harder, and put the "Oomph" into the shot, i lose accuracy big time.
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Compare this shot to your soft draw straight in shots. Do you draw those straight back? If yes, then your firm stroke mechanics need examining. If no, then your aim (and possibly stroke mechanics) need addressing.

If it's your firm stroke mechanics, you really should have spent more time finding a SPF instructor. That being said, I've found that the old "follow through" advice is a little bit lacking, meaning that the advice isn't complete.

For any sports throwing, hitting, swinging motion, it's not so much how far you follow through as much as it is where you follow through, from a coaching black-box perspective. That is, ignore the details, and pay attention to a few positions in the swing. This is true for swinging a bat, throwing a ball, shooting free throws, bowling, etc.

The SPF family of instructors pay attention to the follow through position by watching the grip hand and where it hits the body ,as well as watching the tip and watching where it hits the cloth.

For the power long draw, I tell people to really concentrate on the tip final position (assuming they are actually drawing the ball). Normally, if they miss the object ball a hair to the right, or even hit the right of center in the pocket, the cue tip usually has followed through to the right as well. So, I tell them to forget about everything else, and just concentrate on the tip following through to a point on the cloth in the EXACT direct line of the shot.

All this means, DCP, is that if you take my advice, you really need to try it and absorb it. Reading it and half-assing it won't help.

Fred
 
Thank you

DrCue'sProtege said:
just soes everyone will know...........

i already have a list started of shots i want to practice tonight. and this long, straight draw shot is #1 on the list. also have made some notations from some of the points you posters have mentioned in this thread.

those that make positive, constructive criticisms/comments on my threads - you are very much appreciated. and trust me, i do read them, and learn from them.

the rest of you posters - well, as Gomer said, "You can just go off into an alley and yell fish!" :eek:

DCP
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I for one appreciate you starting threads such as this. There are those of us out here that enjoy and learn from the comments, info and advice given by the thoughtful and sincere posters who are trying to help.

Hopefully you are applying what is to learned here, but even if what your critics say is true, it makes no difference to me. The fact that situations are being presented and questions asked with quality responses to same is what imo these forums are all about.

If your critics were to keep in mind that you are not the only one reading your threads, perhaps they would look at things a bit differently.


Thanks again for posting and thanks to all who respond with well intentioned info.

Steve
 
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A lovely draw stroke is part of the soul of pool. It's tons of fun to send the cue ball forward and watch it spin backwards again off the object ball.

It's simple physics--strike the cue ball below its equator (as it faces you) and you will impart bottom spin on the ball, enough for it to rebound again on most shots.
 
If a good instructor is not available try this to practice. After you have lined up your shot and you are on your final stroke---keep your eye on the cue ball. This may help with a more accurate hit on the cue ball and therefore more draw action. This is just for pratice.
 
Tennesseejoe said:
If a good instructor is not available try this to practice. After you have lined up your shot and you are on your final stroke---keep your eye on the cue ball. This may help with a more accurate hit on the cue ball and therefore more draw action. This is just for pratice.
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i keep my eye on the cueball vice the object ball all the time anyway. i aint hitting the object ball, i am hitting the cue ball. hopefully right at the precise point i am aiming for.

DCP
 
one thing that i feel comes into play here is the fact that the pros on TV are playing on new cloth, with new balls. as we all know this longer draw shot is easier on slick cloth, with clean balls. i am going to go home and polish the cueball slightly tonight, then practice this same shot. i am guessing i will have an easier time with it then since i wont have to put so much "Oomph" into the shot.

DCP
 
Well, if you can't shoot this shot with enough draw to get back and accurately enough to pocket the ball, then you need to practice your draw shots like everyone else said. Also, it would help to be very confident in your stroke mechanics/fundamentals before doing much practice on this, because this is the type of shot where the difference between a good stroke and a bad stroke is really pronounced, and if your stroke is bad, you'll just be practicing how not to shoot this shot.

Draw is a strength of mine; what I find difficult on shots like these is not pocketing the ball or getting enough action, it's controlling the distance of the draw. I overdraw this shot half the time I shoot it, but if I try to take a little off, I come up short every time. But I'm very confident in my stroke fundamentals, so I know all I need to do is practice this shot to gain better control over the amount of draw I get.

Either way, DCP, move the CB 4 inches to the left or right from where it is now, and see how many BETTER options you now have to get on the 5 ball. Let this be your lesson: play for an angle, especially when there's a lot of separation between the ball you're on and the next. You're absolutely right that this is a demanding position shot, and even while watching Efren himself run out, if the commentators saw him get this position, they'd say it will be tough for him to get on the 5. Efren's probably going to make it work most of the time, because he's the best player in the world, but it's not a good spot to be in. Learn the shots that help you avoid these situations, i.e. practice getting angles on balls.

-Andrew
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
i keep my eye on the cueball vice the object ball all the time anyway. i aint hitting the object ball, i am hitting the cue ball. hopefully right at the precise point i am aiming for.

DCP
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Not good for most players.
 
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