Man playing as woman at APA nationals

[jasonlaus]

Some of you keep saying this is ok, I think there's more people who oppose this crap than you think, they just don't say anything for fear of being called names by you understanding, caring people

A womans event is a womans event PERIOD, if you have a D, you are not a woman no matter how bad you want to be - hell, I wanna be a woman come shower time. How will you and your wives, and daughters feel about that?

Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah

 

[PoolBum]

I think YOU don't know that

I have no clue now what you're talking about.

 

[haystj]

So I actually have a question for all the men out there that feel (and you are entitled to your feelings) that a trans woman is actually a woman.

Are you honestly open to dating a woman that has transitioned from a male to a female?

I only ask this because people have very strong feelings about this subject. For example, would you be open to dating Catlyn Jenner knowing it was Bruce Jenner (assuming you found Catlyn attractive)?

I wouldn't see why not, if you were open to the idea of that individual being a woman.

Just wondering

And no, I am not interested in gambling with the "Catfish Killer" from NC.

 

[jasonlaus]

So I actually have a question for all the men out there that feel (and you are entitled to your feelings) that a trans woman is actually a woman.

Are you honestly open to dating a woman that has transitioned from a male to a female?

I only ask this because people have very strong feelings about this subject. For example, would you be open to dating Catlyn Jenner knowing it was Bruce Jenner (assuming you found Catlyn attractive)?

I wouldn't see why not, if you were open to the idea of that individual being a woman.

Just wondering

Gonna be a whole lot of silence on this one lol. But we know the answer

 

[billiardthought]

So I actually have a question for all the men out there that feel (and you are entitled to your feelings) that a trans woman is actually a woman.

Are you honestly open to dating a woman that has transitioned from a male to a female?

I only ask this because people have very strong feelings about this subject. For example, would you be open to dating Catlyn Jenner knowing it was Bruce Jenner (assuming you found Catlyn attractive)?

I wouldn't see why not, if you were open to the idea of that individual being a woman.

Just wondering

And no, I am not interested in gambling with the "Catfish Killer" from NC.

I am not open to dating a woman that has gone through a gender change just like I am not interested in dating a woman with a kid. Either way, more baggage than I want to deal with.

But then again, what does that have to do with what they have done with their lives?

 

[haystj]

I am not open to dating a woman that has gone through a gender change just like I am not interested in dating a woman with a kid. Either way, more baggage than I want to deal with.

But then again, what does that have to do with what they have done with their lives?

Nothing. Nothing at all.

What is has to do with is the definition of a "woman".

If someone is born a male, and starts taking hormones to be more feminine.... and people feel strongly to identify that person as a female (entering female sports events etc) ------

Then I think those people should be OK with dating them (assuming they want to date women).

It is tough to have it both ways,,

 

[billiardthought]

Nothing. Nothing at all.

What is has to do with is the definition of a "woman".

If someone is born a male, and starts taking hormones to be more feminine.... and people feel strongly to identify that person as a female (entering female sports events etc) ------

Then I think those people should be OK with dating them (assuming they want to date women).

It is tough to have it both ways,,

But why do I have to be ok with dating them? Do I have to be ok with dating someone who smokes cigarettes because cigarettes are legal?

 

[haystj]

But why do I have to be ok with dating them? Do I have to be ok with dating someone who smokes cigarettes because cigarettes are legal?

Well, are you OK with dating women?

Are you OK with dating smokers?

I don't want to mix apples and oranges.

I think the real question is the definitions.

Are you OK with dating trans women? It is no that is fine, but there isn't a classification in APA events for trans women. Which was more to my point.

One or the other,,, let's just be consistent. (hard to call a person a woman, but not interested in dating them because they are a trans woman)

 

[dardusm]

OK, let's recap:

1) A guy is wearing womens clothes and playing pool.
2) He can't win a game but people complain anyway, to get him DQ'd
3) Thread takes a turn and a guy from NC wants to fly anywhere to play high stakes. He also threatens to catch all catfish in your local lakes.....
4) Some users are labeled as liberals or insensitive....

Ok, carry on

Wish I would have read this recap before spending 20 minutes reading the thread.

 

[billiardthought]

Well, are you OK with dating women?

Are you OK with dating smokers?

I don't want to mix apples and oranges.

I think the real question is the definitions.

Are you OK with dating trans women? It is no that is fine, but there isn't a classification in APA events for trans women. Which was more to my point.

One or the other,,, let's just be consistent. (hard to call a person a woman, but not interested in dating them because they are a trans woman)

So do you have a point?

There is a set of people called women. There are subsets of Women: mothers, smokers, women who used to be men, and all sorts of other subets, including subsets of subsets such as women who smoke who used to be men.

I don't have to or can choose to date any of them. That doesn't IN ANY WAY affect how their gender is classified.

 

[hang-the-9]

"We" aren't making women a protected class. Women are choosing to join women only leagues or tournaments. It is a free market. Just like some women join women only gyms.

I agree that it would be nice if women didn't feel the need for a separate league, but society isn't there yet, at least not as I see it.

And by the way, some of it is not necessarily "bad" conduct. I personally know couples who formed out of being in the same pool league, and no doubt someone hit on someone else to get that going. So a man may legitimately hit on a woman in league (without harassing her) yet the woman may still be sick of such attention and choose a league where it doesn't happen.

If they are not being protected, why is it OK to have a women's only anything, but any men only anything gets protested by every liberal and is all over the news about how unfair and mean that is? Protected = special treatment. Men certainty want to hang out with each other at times and make dirty jokes about vaginas without worrying that a woman may take offence.

The reason women join women's leagues is because the like to hang out together, and truthfully at the core of it, 95% do not enjoy playing against men that are clearly better than them and make them look like idiots at the table. You go up, shoot a ball, miss a ball, and some guy runs out the rack while you sit there. Difference is that this protected group is allowed to do that, the only way to make a men only group is to have some seedy place that women don't want to even be in, not actually be not allowed in. Some people want their cake and eat it too, equality, but still allowances for being "special".

 

[haystj]

So do you have a point?

There is a set of people called women. There are subsets of Women: mothers, smokers, women who used to be men, and all sorts of other subets, including subsets of subsets such as women who smoke who used to be men.

I don't have to or can choose to date any of them. That doesn't IN ANY WAY affect how their gender is classified.

I don't think you will get my point. We are looking at this in such a different way we won't reach an understanding.

This is evident in your first sentence.... I don't believe there are "sets of people called women." (I don't even know what sets of people are)

You are either a woman or a man.

Yes, you can be a woman that smokes. You can be a woman that has had a child.

My point was you cannot be a woman if you were born male. That would make you a trans woman.

If a person believes that a trans woman is really a woman,,, I would be interested in knowing if they are in their "dating pool of women".

This isn't an issue of baggage like kids, biting your nails, smoking or being a slob.

 

[billiardthought]

If a person believes that a trans woman is really a woman,,, I would be interested in knowing if they are in their "dating pool of women".

This isn't an issue of baggage like kids, biting your nails, smoking or being a slob.

Ok let me answer your question and let's see if we can get somewhere. No, a woman who used to be a man is not in my dating pool.

My question to you is whether my decision to date a woman who used to be a man makes that person less of a woman? And that is my point about the cigarettes, the children, and any other attribute a person can have. How does my decision to date someone influence their gender? If I choose to not date someone, HOW does that detract from what gender they identify as?

I am all for exploring further the definition of what a woman is, but you have a very weak argument saying if I am not willing to date a woman that used to be a man, they are therefore not a woman.

 

[Neil]

Ok let me answer your question and let's see if we can get somewhere. No, a woman who used to be a man is not in my dating pool.

My question to you is whether my decision to date a woman who used to be a man makes that person less of a woman? And that is my point about the cigarettes, the children, and any other attribute a person can have. How does my decision to date someone influence their gender? If I choose to not date someone, HOW does that detract from what gender they identify as?

I am all for exploring further the definition of what a woman is, but you have a very weak argument saying if I am not willing to date a woman that used to be a man, they are therefore not a woman.

Actually, it's a very strong argument. But, one that you are not willing to admit to because it then proves the point and you don't want that to happen. If a transgender woman is all woman in your world, then you should have no reason to omit them from your dating pool.

Bottom line is, you actually know what reality is, you just don't want to accept reality because for some twisted reason you think it makes you less of a person.

 

[puma122]

I wish I would not have spent the time reading this thread. At least I had coffee.

I wonder why the APA has a womans only event? If it's handicapped, is it really a leveling of the field, or is it more to give the ladies a competition where they are not surround by ass hole guys either hitting on them or belittling them? (Not saying all guys do this, or that women cannot be vicious to each other too...) If it's something along those lines, I'd say that an 82 year old person who's been dressing up and acting like a lady for many a years, fits into that woman's only event very well.

Anyway...I only read this because I was asked to be on a mixed scotch team with someone I was unsure of what their past looked like. They sure dress and talk like a lady, but I'd put money on the fact that was not always the case. To me, in a mixed scotch tournament that is not handicapped other than division, that would not be fair. I'm not going to enter, travel, and then be potentially booted from a tournament at worst, or at best looked down upon for trying to get an advantage...

 

[btown]

Ok let me answer your question and let's see if we can get somewhere. No, a woman who used to be a man is not in my dating pool.

My question to you is whether my decision to date a woman who used to be a man makes that person less of a woman? And that is my point about the cigarettes, the children, and any other attribute a person can have. How does my decision to date someone influence their gender? If I choose to not date someone, HOW does that detract from what gender they identify as?

I am all for exploring further the definition of what a woman is, but you have a very weak argument saying if I am not willing to date a woman that used to be a man, they are therefore not a woman.

You don't know what a woman is? :sorry:

 

[GideonF]

I find it interesting that, as near as I can tell, all of the negative comments by posters in this thread about whether this player should have been allowed to play come from men, not women.

I note again, as I did earlier, that the WPBA has a specific policy allowing transgender women to compete (under certain circumstances). In other words, the governing body of women's professional pool - the members of whom a very direct interest in the issue - seem far more accepting of who should be allowed to compete as women than some of our male posters. As far as I am concerned, if the WPBA is okay with transgender competitors, who am I to say they are wrong?

This issue involved the APA, of course, not the WPBA, and if the APA doesn't have a rule with how to deal with this situation, they should. And so should every other league that has a separate women's division. Let them formulate a rule and discuss it with their women players - they are the ones who have a real interest.

 

[billiardthought]

Actually, it's a very strong argument. But, one that you are not willing to admit to because it then proves the point and you don't want that to happen. If a transgender woman is all woman in your world, then you should have no reason to omit them from your dating pool.

Bottom line is, you actually know what reality is, you just don't want to accept reality because for some twisted reason you think it makes you less of a person.

You don't know what a woman is? :sorry:

No one has answered my question.

Neil, all you said is that I should have no reason to omit them.

SOMEONE explain to me why my choice to not date someone dictates their gender.

 

[Rhea]

Here is an average looking post op transsexual in 2016. If she didn't tell you, how would you even know?

 

[Neil]

No one has answered my question.

Neil, all you said is that I should have no reason to omit them.

SOMEONE explain to me why my choice to not date someone dictates their gender.

I'll answer with a question- WHY would you not include them in your dating pool? And, really think about your answer, and be perfectly honest with it.