Meuller's just lost a small customer (long post about a catalog)

Cuebacca

________
Silver Member
OK, I know some might see this as petty, but to each his own. Here is goes. I've been making an effort at home for the last few years, to reduce my junk mail. Every day, Americans get coupons, advertisers, flyers on their front doors, pre-approved credit card offers, etc., etc.. Most of these things have a way to opt out of them, and a couple of minutes worth of effort will eventually save time in the long run, with less things to shread, recycle, or carry to the trash.

Some companies, unfortunately, make opting out of this madness a big pain. The minutes start to add up, and most people give up. Perhaps these companies don't see annoying their customers as a big issue, and that the loss in sales will easily be made up by impulse buys from that same group of annoyed people. Well, not this annoyed person.

This is where Mueller's comes in. It has been over a year now that I've been trying to keep their medium-sized catalog out of my mailbox. I've called in several times to be removed from the list, and each time, I am assured by a friendly customer-service representative, that my request will be taken care of. Well, they never told me the full story until today, when I complained that this is at least the third time I've had to call and that I want to make sure this time that it gets done.

So apparently how it works is that their mailing list will cover 3 catalog drops throughout the year. Since I called in the middle of a cycle, I will receive the remainder of the three catalogs, even though I'm no longer in their system. Obviously I'm in SOMEONE's system, unless all three catalogs are printed at the beginning, but they have no control to prevent me from getting those extra catalogs. I don't think this is uncommon, and I could probably live with that, even though it's annoying.

Now here's the part where they lost my business. I asked next, so what if I want to order something online again... how do I keep from getting the catalog? With honesty that is appreciated, she let me know that there is no way. If you order, you will get the catalog (3 actually). She told me that some folks have tried to add comments when ordering, stating that they do not want a paper catalog. Mueller's is forced to ignore these requests as they have no tool/process for preventing customer names from getting on the catalog list. I did let the lady know that I'd like to provide my feedback that I won't be ordering anything more for the sole reason that that is the only way to avoid receiving their paper catalogs. Unfortunately, I didn't get the feeling that my feedback would be forwarded to the powers that be. I assume that it's just not in the interest of their bottom line to waste their time on fixing the problem. So be it. I guess I'll just have to order my 8-balls with skulls on them from someone else.

Normally, customer service isn't really something I think about when shopping for pool products online. I typically just go with the best price, as long as the company seems legit. As a matter of fact, usually I haven't ordered from Mueller's because someone else typically has a better price when shipping is factored in, but occasionally the Mueller's price is better and I go with them. Well, customer service suddenly jumped up in importance to me on this issue. Long live the little guy!
 
I had the same problem with them. I would always order from my business address, which was a pool hall. I would get catalogs out the kazoo. LOL. I started giving the extras away to some of my customers - which I'm sure helped out Mueller's and got the extras out of my pile of clutter behind the bar. They are too good of a company for me to swear them off, but I understand your decision and your frustration.
 
These companies really need to start sorting their customers by ordering method. How many online shoppers care about paper catalogs? How many unused catalogs do they send me before the profit on my occasional order is spent. How much more could they make or how much cheaper could they sell items if this waste was limited? I agree with you that it is very annoying. So far I guess I have thought of it as stupid on their part and have not considered not doing business with them. You have me thinking about avoiding companies that do business like this in the furture.
 
You have my promise that this will make it to the "power-to-be" but it seems you received excellent customer service. The rep was upfront with you and you were told that there is no way to stop the mailing once its in process. I wish that was different but there isn't an "easy button" on the computer system. We'd rather send an unwanted catalog than not send wanted catalog.

As for receiving multiple catalogs, some people are in the system a few times because of different phone numbers, addresses, businesses, etc. We try to delete multiple accounts each year but, again, some slip through.

Please PM me with your contact info and I will try to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Just for the record, Muellers doe NOT share or sell your info with any other mailing list.
 
Send 'em to me; I can't get enough of them, and would love to have a current '07 Fall catalog in each of my 2 1/2 bathrooms of my house while on the throne!

PM for my address
 
Cuebacca said:
OK, I know some might see this as petty, but to each his own. Here is goes. I've been making an effort at home for the last few years, to reduce my junk mail. Every day, Americans get coupons, advertisers, flyers on their front doors, pre-approved credit card offers, etc., etc.. Most of these things have a way to opt out of them, and a couple of minutes worth of effort will eventually save time in the long run, with less things to shread, recycle, or carry to the trash.

Some companies, unfortunately, make opting out of this madness a big pain. The minutes start to add up, and most people give up. Perhaps these companies don't see annoying their customers as a big issue, and that the loss in sales will easily be made up by impulse buys from that same group of annoyed people. Well, not this annoyed person.

This is where Mueller's comes in. It has been over a year now that I've been trying to keep their medium-sized catalog out of my mailbox. I've called in several times to be removed from the list, and each time, I am assured by a friendly customer-service representative, that my request will be taken care of. Well, they never told me the full story until today, when I complained that this is at least the third time I've had to call and that I want to make sure this time that it gets done.

So apparently how it works is that their mailing list will cover 3 catalog drops throughout the year. Since I called in the middle of a cycle, I will receive the remainder of the three catalogs, even though I'm no longer in their system. Obviously I'm in SOMEONE's system, unless all three catalogs are printed at the beginning, but they have no control to prevent me from getting those extra catalogs. I don't think this is uncommon, and I could probably live with that, even though it's annoying.

Now here's the part where they lost my business. I asked next, so what if I want to order something online again... how do I keep from getting the catalog? With honesty that is appreciated, she let me know that there is no way. If you order, you will get the catalog (3 actually). She told me that some folks have tried to add comments when ordering, stating that they do not want a paper catalog. Mueller's is forced to ignore these requests as they have no tool/process for preventing customer names from getting on the catalog list. I did let the lady know that I'd like to provide my feedback that I won't be ordering anything more for the sole reason that that is the only way to avoid receiving their paper catalogs. Unfortunately, I didn't get the feeling that my feedback would be forwarded to the powers that be. I assume that it's just not in the interest of their bottom line to waste their time on fixing the problem. So be it. I guess I'll just have to order my 8-balls with skulls on them from someone else.

Normally, customer service isn't really something I think about when shopping for pool products online. I typically just go with the best price, as long as the company seems legit. As a matter of fact, usually I haven't ordered from Mueller's because someone else typically has a better price when shipping is factored in, but occasionally the Mueller's price is better and I go with them. Well, customer service suddenly jumped up in importance to me on this issue. Long live the little guy!

I'd am relatively certain that Mueller uses some sort of a catalog vendor/printing service that sends that cycle of catalogs to the lists that Mueller provides.

Not knowing how there software works, the only way to get rid of you if you are in their customer list/database would be an employee literaly looking for your name on a list of thousands and crossing it out.

Perhaps, Mueller actually just emails a spreadsheed periodically; yet again an employee would have to find you and delete you every time that list was sent out.

I can appreciate not wanting crap mail as I have gone through all the opt-outs in the past as well; however there seems to me no way to truely opt out unless you turn Uni-Bomber and live in a shack in the woods with no address.

On a happier note, I'd rather get Mueller catalogs in the mail than 99% of the other stuff that comes. Just my $.02.
 
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teebee said:
These companies really need to start sorting their customers by ordering method. How many online shoppers care about paper catalogs? How many unused catalogs do they send me before the profit on my occasional order is spent. How much more could they make or how much cheaper could they sell items if this waste was limited? I agree with you that it is very annoying. So far I guess I have thought of it as stupid on their part and have not considered not doing business with them. You have me thinking about avoiding companies that do business like this in the furture.


We are a business that has existed for over 50 years. Everyone knows who we are and can trust us. The company was built on paper catalogs and most of our business still comes from the catalog/call-in orders. When you are dealing with an online only "company," you may be dealing with some guy in his basement or garage that will be gone in two months. Where's the customer service there?
 
I received my catalog today also. I've always had good service from Muellers, but I see your frustration. Don't be fooled, there IS a way they can take you off the mailing list, they just don't want to go to the trouble of doing it. Maybe they get some kind of quantity deal from their catalog printer, and if they start taking people off the mailing list they won't get the bulk discount? Maybe you should start sending the catalog back to them, wrap it up all nice, and mail it first class with signature required. It might at least get someone's attention if you do it enough times!
 
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So how often do you get a catolog? 3 or 4 times a year? Once a month? Doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me. Plus I think there are things in the catalog that aren't online. Just a guess though.

BVal
 
BVal said:
So how often do you get a catolog? 3 or 4 times a year? Once a month? Doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me. Plus I think there are things in the catalog that aren't online. Just a guess though.

BVal

Not that it bothers me, but I've gotten 3 in the last 2 months.
 
ratcues said:
You have my promise that this will make it to the "power-to-be" but it seems you received excellent customer service.

Thanks, Ryan. I appreciate your willingness to go the extra mile.

ratcues said:
The rep was upfront with you and you were told that there is no way to stop the mailing once its in process. I wish that was different but there isn't an "easy button" on the computer system. We'd rather send an unwanted catalog than not send wanted catalog.

This is true, and I appreciate her candor. It did, however, take three calls and me complaining about three calls to finally learn that I'd never be able to completely opt out (and still be a customer).

The only complaint I would have about the recent conversation is that, after learning how it is, I expressed to her that I wanted my feedback to be taken into consideration, as something that could be improved about the customer experience. However, instead of telling me that it would be looked into for the future, that someone with the power to look into it would be notified, I was told (nicely) that she has to be honest and that this is just how it is.

ratcues said:
Please PM me with your contact info and I will try to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Thanks, Ryan, I appreciate that. No need to forward my contact info for now as she did assure me that I'm no longer in the system and won't receive a catalog after the X-Mas one. That is, as long as I don't place anymore orders.
 
I did copy your original post and sent it to Mr Mueller so he will be aware. I'll keep you posted on what I find out.
 
CrownCityCorey said:
I'd am relatively certain that Mueller uses some sort of a catalog vendor/printing service that sends that cycle of catalogs to the lists that Mueller provides.

Not knowing how there software works, the only way to get rid of you if you are in their customer list/database would be an employee literaly looking for your name on a list of thousands and crossing it out.

Perhaps, Mueller actually just emails a spreadsheed periodically; yet again an employee would have to find you and delete you every time that list was sent out.

I think you're right that that's probably the way it works now. I just wanted to basically feed back to them my issue, which I was hoping that they could feed back to whatever vendor provides their internet purchasing software, catalog database, etc. Somewhere, someone has the ability to add a checkbox to the order page that says, "Please don't send me a paper catalog". I understand that they can't fix that immediately, but I wanted them to know that some customers would like to see that added in the future.

CrownCityCorey said:
I can appreciate not wanting crap mail as I have gone through all the opt-outs in the past as well; however there seems to me no way to truely opt out unless you turn Uni-Bomber and live in a shack in the woods with no address.

LOL. I'm not at that point yet, but you never know. It would need to be a shack with minimum dimensions of at about 15'x19'.

On a happier note, I'd rather get Mueller catalogs in the mail than 99% of the other stuff that comes. Just my $.02.

Indeed.
 
ratcues said:
You have my promise that this will make it to the "power-to-be" but it seems you received excellent customer service. The rep was upfront with you and you were told that there is no way to stop the mailing once its in process. I wish that was different but there isn't an "easy button" on the computer system. We'd rather send an unwanted catalog than not send wanted catalog.

As for receiving multiple catalogs, some people are in the system a few times because of different phone numbers, addresses, businesses, etc. We try to delete multiple accounts each year but, again, some slip through.

Please PM me with your contact info and I will try to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Just for the record, Muellers doe NOT share or sell your info with any other mailing list.

If we have an oppourtunity to complain about Muellers catalog. You can pass a complain on for me. I hate the way it is organized. I'd say unorganized, but my suspicion is it is the way it is on purpose so people will have to look through the entire catalog to find what they want. That way every now and then somebody buys something unplanned because they saw it in passing.
There should at least be an index generated. Usually I give up before I find it and go find it on Seybert's website. Mueller's website is another pain, unless you know the item number (which means you have to find it in the catalog) the search engine is pretty darn useless.
This complaint is not aimed at you Ryan, but at your employer.
 
Tim5000 said:
Maybe you should start sending the catalog back to them, wrap it up all nice, and mail it first class with signature required. It might at least get someone's attention if you do it enough times!

LOL. Good idea! I could also make my own catalog with my used items that I was planning to put on eBay or donate to charity. If they contact me asking to stop sending it, I can tell them, OK, but you'll be getting two more before it stops. Then, next time I order, I can send more again, because it is my policy that anyone I do business with will receive my catalog and they are welcome to not do business with me if they choose.

(I apologize to Mueller's and reps for making light here. It is done without mal intent.)
 
BVal said:
So how often do you get a catolog? 3 or 4 times a year? Once a month? Doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me. Plus I think there are things in the catalog that aren't online. Just a guess though.

BVal

It is a non-issue to most people. I totally understand that. To me it is a pet peeve, especially when it becomes so difficult to do what "should be" simple.
 
The easiest way (coming from someone who runs an internet payment company) is to just have a checkbox on the checkout form asking the consumer if they want to receive the catalog or not.

It doesn't take much dev time, and you can easily categorize those that do and don't in tables for sending or withholding from the printer/marketing firm. Same goes with email marketing, and it avoids pissing off legitimate customers.
 
catscradle said:
If we have an oppourtunity to complain about Muellers catalog. You can pass a complain on for me. I hate the way it is organized. I'd say unorganized, but my suspicion is it is the way it is on purpose so people will have to look through the entire catalog to find what they want. That way every now and then somebody buys something unplanned because they saw it in passing.
There should at least be an index generated. Usually I give up before I find it and go find it on Seybert's website. Mueller's website is another pain, unless you know the item number (which means you have to find it in the catalog) the search engine is pretty darn useless.
This complaint is not aimed at you Ryan, but at your employer.

I agree completely. The website is difficult for me, as it's hard to browse towards what you're looking for. The "advanced catalog search" is what I usually end up using.
 
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