Even using a new tube of Duro Quick Gel I have been unable to adhere a Moori S tip to one ferrule. If I use the same tube of glue, a Le Pro will adhere to the same ferrule perfectly. This has me baffled. Can anyone please suggest a solution?
Moori only will not adhere - Perplexed?
- Thread starter BlindWizard
- Start date
Thanks, I will give that a try but the duro QG adhers the Le Pro without breathing on it. I am thinking the leather of my Moori might be oily inside.
I found if you sand the bottom of the tip as you would before installing, then coat the bottom of the tip with your super glue, and let sit for a minute or so, and then wipe it off. After that, wait at least a half hour. Re-sand the bottom of the tip, and install. I've never had a moori come since.
Dennis
Dennis
Dennis, Thanks for the advice. I will try this on my next Moori install. I should have thought of this myself. Once I had a Moori that fell off and it had a hardened glue base. After sanding the hardened glue base it adhered.
glue tip
I take all my tips, [even the ones I have made to my spec's,the blud tip] I use my razor knife to cut a graft on the back of all tips. Even with some of those cheap ferrules from over "there" the tips stay on.
I have found with a build up of glue as some have mentioned here, is not the way to go. If it works for them good, but remember you want a thin coat of glue. The glue is much stronger thin than thick with one or two layers of glue. I now use loctite pro, for my tips.Try keeping your glue in the freg, until needed.Works for me.
blud
Wizard,BlindWizard said:
I take all my tips, [even the ones I have made to my spec's,the blud tip] I use my razor knife to cut a graft on the back of all tips. Even with some of those cheap ferrules from over "there" the tips stay on.
I have found with a build up of glue as some have mentioned here, is not the way to go. If it works for them good, but remember you want a thin coat of glue. The glue is much stronger thin than thick with one or two layers of glue. I now use loctite pro, for my tips.Try keeping your glue in the freg, until needed.Works for me.
blud
searingcue said:
Tap, Tap. Tap
Michael Webb said:
Well, the cat's out of the bag now guys
why did I have to learn that the hard way, when you'all could have helped Me there LOL. J/KYep it is true, I usually don't have to do that because I really lay the glue on now, so that it soaks in real good, and not usually a problem for the most part anymore, but still will come up every once in a while If I don't do something like what was mentioned, and found that out Myself, by the fact that they always stay on easily the second time around, and never seemed to pop off. Rats, One of you guys could have repackaged some thin, and called it a primer for tips.
I've also tic tacked or figure 8'ed the ferrule & tip with a knife, and it works also, but the results were'nt as good for me everytime, altough seems like they should have been IMO.
I have a few questions on a related topic for anyone willing to jump in, if you fellows would be so Kind as to help Me out here-
I hav'nt really messed with them much in the past, but been starting to do a few jump/break ferrules that I make Myself. they are one piece units, and I thread them on. I have recently cut out a few tips from the material, and put a radius on them.
My question Is- do most people use the same glue as they do for regular tips with the linen resin type tips, or do you use a longer setting glue like a epoxy or polyurethane based?
Another Question is- what's about the softest ferrule type you can get away with, on a tip like this, and the average person, without an instant breakdown?
I know that some people can even mushroom a phenolic ferrule and tip, but I have seen the tips cut out of it, and used with standard looking ferrule materials. not sure how they hold up though.
I have also seen capped ferrules with hole in it, and the tip of the same material glued on top.
What is the advantages of this, as opposed to a solid tip/ferrule combo? The glue relief being a possibility, is a gimme, so I'm more wondering If there's any other reasons to do them that way?
Thanks guys, Greg
Wish I could help on that one, The only method I use is the ferrule tip combo we discussed on the jump cue topic, which I inlay the tip .203 into the top of the phenalic, .160 deep finish size. I only use black phenalic 1.2 long.
blud said:
According to some makers of cyanoacrylates, this is not a good idea.
1) STORAGE:
New, Unopened containers of any instant glue may be stored in the freezer (at or below
32 F) to double shelf life. Always allow the container to warm to room temperature before opening. Once opened, never return an opened bottle to cold storage. Why ? -- Moisture is one of the catalysts. Opening a cold bottle or placing a previously opened bottle back in cold storage causes the warm air that has entered the bottle, (carrying moisture with it), to condense the moisture into water. This has a negative effect on shelf life causing the contents of the bottle to thicken and eventually harden and causes the spout to clog very frequently.
http://www.woodfinishsupply.com/SolvingCloggedSpouts.html
http://ajh-knives.com/adhesive-1.html
3. When storing in refrigerator, allow the adhesive to gradually warm up to room temperature before use.
Sheldon said:
A number of years ago I called Lock-Tite corporation asking about their 454. They transfered my call to whom I thought was a chemist. At any rate I asked him if 454 was their best glue for tips explaining about the hardness of the ferrule, glueing to leather, having to stand up to shock and so forth. He told me that the 454 was probably their best glue for that task and then went on to explain the exact same thing that you just stated. To refrigerate until open and once open to not put back in refrigerater. The only difference was that he said to refrigerate but said nothing, to me, about freezing.
Dick
Thoughts on rubberized CA?
As far as gluing on Phenolic tips. What has proven to hold up the best is Lord contact cement. The down side is that you have to let it dry over night and the shelf life is really short unless kept in the fridge. It is also hard to come by and is expensive. The locktite 454 has proven to be the best among the fast glues, but I have heard of some tips popping off with it.Cue Crazy said:Well, the cat's out of the bag now guys
Yep it is true, I usually don't have to do that because I really lay the glue on now, so that it soaks in real good, and not usually a problem for the most part anymore, but still will come up every once in a while If I don't do something like what was mentioned, and found that out Myself, by the fact that they always stay on easily the second time around, and never seemed to pop off. Rats, One of you guys could have repackaged some thin, and called it a primer for tips.
I've also tic tacked or figure 8'ed the ferrule & tip with a knife, and it works also, but the results were'nt as good for me everytime, altough seems like they should have been IMO.
I have a few questions on a related topic for anyone willing to jump in, if you fellows would be so Kind as to help Me out here-
I hav'nt really messed with them much in the past, but been starting to do a few jump/break ferrules that I make Myself. they are one piece units, and I thread them on. I have recently cut out a few tips from the material, and put a radius on them.
My question Is- do most people use the same glue as they do for regular tips with the linen resin type tips, or do you use a longer setting glue like a epoxy or polyurethane based?
Another Question is- what's about the softest ferrule type you can get away with, on a tip like this, and the average person, without an instant breakdown?
I know that some people can even mushroom a phenolic ferrule and tip, but I have seen the tips cut out of it, and used with standard looking ferrule materials. not sure how they hold up though.
I have also seen capped ferrules with hole in it, and the tip of the same material glued on top.
What is the advantages of this, as opposed to a solid tip/ferrule combo? The glue relief being a possibility, is a gimme, so I'm more wondering If there's any other reasons to do them that way?
Thanks guys, Greg
The softer the ferrule the less well the phenolic tip will jump.
The advantage to gluing a tip of phenolic on top of phenolic ferrule is that if you break something it will likely be the tip instead of the ferrule. If doing a one piece combo you should still put a glue relief hole in it to allow glue to escape and eliminate the internal pressure that will cause it to crack later. Just make sure the glue builds up on top of the ferrule so as not to sink back down leaving a empty hole. Just take the excess glue off when shaping tip.
Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com
cueman said:
I've got about 40 phenolic tips in a couple of different brands. Haven't put one on in probably a year. Everyone who wants a phenolic tip gets a phenolic ferrule instead. Don't have to worry about tip ever comeing of and if the ferrule chunks out I just replace it free. I've only had one come back and I asked him if I put it on and he said yes. I put one on, no charge, because he's a good customer but I know that I never put on the original as I've never used the type of phenolic he had on the shaft.
When making my ferrules I of coarse use a bleed hole in the end but I take a tooth pick and clean it out a little bit, after shaping the front, tip part, I take leather shavings from my tip lathe, mix with 454 and fill the hole. A few seconds later I just reshape slightly and now there is leather in the tip making it a leagal playing cue.
Dick
cueman said:
Thanks for the suggestions Chris, I'll give em a try. I had thought about drilling a relief in the combo also, but was'nt for sure if It was a good idea or not, so It does help knowing I can go that way. Seems like I've seen them drilled like you mentioned for relief also, so I'll probably give that one a try. I did one on a personal shaft of mine without the relief, and had to screw it on alittle, and let the glue seep through the threads as the pressure built up, then alittle more, and so on until I reached the bottom. It worked, and breaks well, but no telling what kind voids it may create up in there like you mentioned. My thinking was With The ferrule material being made the way it is, It should be fine drilling a relief, without It creating a weak spot, but I just did'nt know for sure. Now My only issue is how small a hole to go with, and still get enough relief from it. A couple of tests can give Me that answer.
Thanks again, Greg
Just a thought, I have never done a phenolic tip, but how would a phenolic ferrule/ phenolic tip combo with a tip pad do? Would it kill the jumpabillity? I was thinking it may get a better bond with 454, plus it may make removing it if you need to later on, a little easier.cueman said:
Tracy
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When gluing two identical types of materials together like phenolic, super glue likes that. So I think the pad would not help any. I used some thin super glue to glue a phenolic tip on the end of a piece of phenolic rod and beat that thing anyway I could. I slammed it on its side hit it up against a steel pole and could not get it to pop off. Tried the same glue on a plastic ferrule and phenolic tip and it stayed on for a few break shots and came off.RSB-Refugee said:
Chris
Dennis, how do you sand them after the glue has dried?searingcue said:
Fully with a 60-80 grit or just enough to scratch the hard glue with line a 320 grit?
Thnx