my take on cuemakers , case makers and table mechanics.

Allen Brown said:
It came from RKC's keyboard Phil. It's nowhere close to hearsay.
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One of them customers that I made mad, was because I didn't get his charity work done fast enough for his liking, a $1,500 job done for $250 to help the guy out, so I sent his rails and $250 back, but that wasn't good enough for you guys, now was it?!! You, and everyone like you felt I should have not only completed the work, but that I should have done it for free...and sent his money back, yet not one of you offered your help to do the work....figures:rolleyes:
 
realkingcobra said:
One of them customers that I made mad, was because I didn't get his charity work done fast enough for his liking, a $1,500 job done for $250 to help the guy out, so I sent his rails and $250 back, but that wasn't good enough for you guys, now was it?!! You, and everyone like you felt I should have not only completed the work, but that I should have done it for free...and sent his money back, yet not one of you offered your help to do the work....figures:rolleyes:
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And yet it's everyone's fault, but your own, that you cut the guys bill by 75%+ and you didn't want to refund his money or give him his merchandise back. I don't think anyone should work for free, but when they make their own prices and time quotes they should live up to them.

It's good to know that since the guy got a price cut that he was put at the bottom of your list.
 
Allen Brown said:
Would you like me to tell him to not let you leave with any of his stuff for the table and to not pay you up front? Is that the kind of help you want me to give him?
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No, I want you to recommend someone to help him with his broken slate, someone to repair it correctly, so he don't get screwed paying someone to do something that they can't fix right, only to find out later it's a hack job, he has a 10' Cenntennial, because I'm about ready to retract my offer to help, because of people just like you!!! So, I'd suggest you step up and be a man and do your part to help out the OP, rather than spending your time trying to shoot down the only person who can!!!
 
realkingcobra said:
No, I want you to recommend someone to help him with his broken slate, someone to repair it correctly, so he don't get screwed paying someone to do something that they can't fix right, only to find out later it's a hack job, he has a 10' Cenntennial, because I'm about ready to retract my offer to help, because of people just like you!!! So, I'd suggest you step up and be a man and do your part to help out the OP, rather than spending your time trying to shoot down the only person who can!!!
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That's very professional.
 
Allen Brown said:
And yet it's everyone's fault, but your own, that you cut the guys bill by 75%+ and you didn't want to refund his money or give him his merchandise back. I don't think anyone should work for free, but when they make their own prices and time quotes they should live up to them.

It's good to know that since the guy got a price cut that he was put at the bottom of your list.
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As he was told in the first place, that when I get back to the Diamond factory, Diamonds work comes first, and I didn't know what they had for me to do at the time I picked his rails up, BUT had the customer had the room to set up and work at his house, I'd have fixed his rails there before even returning to the factory....I guess you missed that point!!!
 
To JoeyInCali, in response to your pm...

As I've told you already, yes I'm planning on coming back to California as I still have unfinished work down there yet to be finished up, yes I'll fix the rails on your GC for free as I already told you, to back up the mechanic that worked on them last, with whom you're not happy with, but I can't give you a specific date as to when that week will take place, because I can't predict the completion dates of the work I have yet to do, so once again, all I can say is when I get closer to your time frame, I'll let you know...that's the best answer I can give, same as last time, and the time before. If I can't get to your job within the time frame you desire, feel free to send your rails to Mark Gregory, or anyone else you feel can do the job correctly, or keep waiting on me, I know it's been a few years now, but when we started.this conversation about your rails, keep in mind, I wasn't even on the west coast:thumbup:
 
phil dade said:
You missed the entire point. He should not help him because he can not do it and in his opinion the mechanics in the area are not qualified. He can not recomend someone who he does not this is qualified. A business or businessmn,has no obligation to engge in practices that are not directly profitable for his business.

I am done with this thread as it should be rethought by the posters.
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Is this a new kind of English?
 
allen brown said:
that's very professional.
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Because of posters like you Allen Brown, the AZB members are missing out on all the new improvements I've designed tooling to do, like re-cut the frames of pool tables dead flat, which in turn makes it 10 times easier to level the slates and keep them level, as all frames are flawed, Centennials, Anniversaries, GC'S. ...you name it. And as great a table mechanic Mark Gregory is, even this is beyond his level of expertise, but I thank you all for being the critics that you are, makes me miss AZB even less.
 
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realkingcobra said:
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Because of posters like you Allen Brown, the AZB members are missing out on all the new improvements I've designed tooling to do, like re-cut the frames of pool tables dead flat, which in turn makes it 10 times easier to level the slates and keep them level, as all frames are flawed, Centennials, Anniversaries, GC'S. ...you name it. And as great a table mechanic Mark Gregory is, even this is beyond his level of expertise, but I thank you all for being the critics that you are, makes me miss AZB even less.
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Seek help please. It is now my fault that your customers will not get this new way of fixing a table. I guess I'll wear that patch with pride. :grin:
 
Allen Brown said:
Seek help please. It is now my fault that your customers will not get this new way of fixing a table. I guess I'll wear that patch with pride. :grin:
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I think you missed my point, my customers all get this level of work, the difference being, the AZB members just end up being the last to learn about it, instead of being the first, so wear that patch proudly, let everyone know the kind of person you really are:rolleyes:
 
As I am too, who needs these people that judge all others against their own likeness, but the bigger question would be, who in the hell would like to live their life, when we have our own to live:rolleyes:
 
realkingcobra said:
As I've told you already, yes I'm planning on coming back to California as I still have unfinished work down there yet to be finished up, yes I'll fix the rails on your GC for free as I already told you, to back up the mechanic that worked on them last, with whom you're not happy with, but I can't give you a specific date as to when that week will take place, because I can't predict the completion dates of the work I have yet to do, so once again, all I can say is when I get closer to your time frame, I'll let you know...that's the best answer I can give, same as last time, and the time before. If I can't get to your job within the time frame you desire, feel free to send your rails to Mark Gregory, or anyone else you feel can do the job correctly, or keep waiting on me, I know it's been a few years now, but when we started.this conversation about your rails, keep in mind, I wasn't even on the west coast:thumbup:
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as i mentioned before ...i have never disputed your commitment to your quality of work.

i am really not trying to tell you how to do your job but i feel if you told every customer what you are telling joey in this post i do not think you would hear near the amount of negativity that you have regarding your failure to meet time line that you have quoted in the past.

sincerely i wish the best for you.
 
lorider said:
as i mentioned before ...i have never disputed your commitment to your quality of work.

i am really not trying to tell you how to do your job but i feel if you told every customer what you are telling joey in this post i do not think you would hear near the amount of negativity that you have regarding your failure to meet time line that you have quoted in the past.

sincerely i wish the best for you.
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There you go assuming I receive a lot of negativity, when I fact, I receive very little compared to the amount of customers I've done work for over the last 32+ years of working on pool tables, and not once from a customer upon completion of the job I was hired to perform.
 
realkingcobra said:
I look at that example as installing the cloth on a pool table, time frames can be met, but now, if you'd have ask him to build you a cue from scratch in that same time frame, what do you suppose his answer would have been;)
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Over a 15 year span I have had Ernie build me two cues from scratch. You can read about the first one here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=272147&postcount=2

I had it refinished here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=176799

Don't recall writing much about the second Ginacue but do mention it here : http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=242046
In any case, the experience and pre-on time delivery were the same.

Anywhos,on both occasions Ernie beat the promised date. In addition, I know and have spoken to at least a dozen guys who have ordered custom -- from scratch -- cues from Ernie, one of them being one the biggest Ginacue collectors in the world.

Guess what?

To a man, they have all said that one of the hallmarks of ordering a custom Ginacue from Ernie is the hassle free, as promised on time delivery of elaborate, beautiful, custom, from scratch pool cues from this master craftsman.

IMO, it is a standard of professionalism all master craftsmen should aspire to. YMMV.

Lou Figueroa
 
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realkingcobra said:
There you go assuming I receive a lot of negativity, when I fact, I receive very little compared to the amount of customers I've done work for over the last 32+ years of working on pool tables, and not once from a customer upon completion of the job I was hired to perform.
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as a former boss told me one time....one aww shit can take away a whole lotta attaboys.
 
lfigueroa said:
Over a 15 year span I have had Ernie build me two cues from scratch. You can read about the first one here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=272147&postcount=2

And the second one here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=176799

On both occasions Ernie beat the promised date. In addition, I know and have spoken to at least a dozen guys who have ordered custom -- from scratch -- cues from Ernie, one of them being one the biggest Ginacue collectors in the world.

Guess what?

To a man, they have all said that one of the hallmarks of ordering a custom Ginacue from Ernie is the hassle free, as promised on time delivery of elaborate, beautiful, custom, from scratch pool cues from this master craftsman.

IMO, it is a standard of professionalism all master craftsmen should aspire to. YMMV.

Lou Figueroa
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What does something like this run? It's awesome!
 

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lorider said:
as a former boss told me one time....one aww shit can take away a whole lotta attaboys.
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Well then, I guess if there were 10 other true table mechanics on my level in this country, as to take some of this load of work on my back, to free me up to have the option of doing other things that might be fun to do, but until such time, I guess that waiting list is just going to get longer and longer, but I guess I could always price my work at a level that only the select few could afford to pay, and be on time every time, like Ernie:grin:
 
lfigueroa said:
No clue. That much ivory, ebony, leather wrap, two shafts, custom JPs... $40K?

Whatever it cost, Ernie delivered it on time :-)

Lou Figueroa
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The great thing about pool cues, is that you can take them with you to the pool hall and show them off, but if most of you could do the same with your pool tables, you wouldn't, because you be to embarrassed at the condition it's in, after all, it's just a pool table...right? Not much of a conversation piece, until your friends have played on it once, then suggest playing somewhere else the next time you ask them to come over and play some;)
 
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