Need Guidance for First Cue + Tip Purchase

I heard from a here that Schmelke is the better value/quality than Players for even less price, win win?

But I am enamored by this presented to me by Kimmo:

https://www.seyberts.com/jump/break-cues/hxtp1-pure-x-jump/break-cue-with-free-hxt-play-shaft/

I'm going to call them tomorrow and see whats what with the free shaft, see what we can do with that. I love getting good value for a decent stick with all the extras I want right now and not worry about 5 different processes, unless I am planning on going pro or something.
 
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JMASTERJ said:
Hey guys... first a little background... I used to play a lot, maybe I was like a 4 then (on the equalizer APA rating), and then I played maybe once a year for about 20 years, and now I am getting back into it. I am working hard to get to a 5 and then 6+.
There are so many cues out there, it is mind boggling, between length, weight, tip size, etc... My goal is to be able to work the ball while hitting it softer, but my ball striking isn't the best because I dont get to practice much but I am planning on it in the next 6-12 months, and I want to start solid.

I do realize that at my level there is almost no difference between certain $100-$300 cues, but my purpose in asking these questions is to simply narrow down/eliminate certain groups of cues so I dont have to choose from 2000 of them I see all over that fit that pricing. When I try different cues, I DO feel the difference, and I hate the stick bar cues, way too flimsy feeling all over.

My understanding and what I think I need: (Just need a starting point, I hope you know what I mean)

CUE LENGTH: I am 6'2 with average wingspan I think for my height, so I assume standard length is ok? (My choice: 59"?)

CUE WEIGHT: I definitely don't like light shafts, but I think that's just my personal preference. I have no idea what I need for better performance. I don't believe I need more speed, I rather have a slow smoother stroke and have power when I need it, which means a heavier cue. I think that's ok as long as I put on a well chalked good tip? So I guess my point would be, why does anyone need a very light cue? (My choice: 20 oz?)

CUE QUALITY: I think this can be directly related to price correct? One thing I dont understand is, the only preference I know I have is I like the more solid heavy sound... I hate the light tinny sound. Otherwise, how does a $1000 stick make you hit balls better than a $150 stick? (My choice: $100-$190?)

CUE DESIGN: With most things being equal I think a great looking cue is nice to give you more confidence and also less likely to be stolen right? Or is it the opposite LOL.

TIP: Because I really like to work the ball, I am thinking a soft good tip but then again some cues come with an ok tip so not sure if its worth the extra $20 for a new great one and then go through the trouble of learning how to replace it and get all the other glue and equipment and stuff. So If I get like a Le Pro, I might want to just keep it but I heard it is like medium hard, and for my shooting cute, I think I prefer something like Kamui Black (soft)? Is the tip wearing out that much of a pain?

BREAK CUE: Is there much different quality in a break cue? I mean can I just get like a $70 one thats like 25-27 oz and have like a Le Pro medium/hard tip on it? I usually like to put a little underspin on the break but I dont think I need a Kamui for that.

CHALK: I heard it makes a difference, any suggestions welcome. For a few bucks I would definitely get my own chalk.

GLOVE: I usually use a lot of powder to smoothen my bridge hand near the thumb. Is a glove really useful/better? I see Shane use it all the time.

Some I like I saw on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FB733P...UTF8&colid=2X2YDD7TL960N&coliid=IQYOIIT13LPAO
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00140FYO...lid=2X2YDD7TL960N&coliid=I2JEAOLYMUXDNZ&psc=1

ANY other tips, most appreciated! Cheers!
Click to expand...

You're tall, so a longer cue might be in order. I'd suggest getting one of those extensions that go in the middle (between butt and shaft). That way you can experiment a bit. It would not be outlandish for you to play with a 60 inch cue, btw.

Players HXT often get suggested on the forum, but it is a bit flimsy feeling, so I'd not suggest that for you.

I think a cuetec might be a good choice, IF you can get a midline extension for it. I know some of them can be fitted with a butt extension, but you definitely don't want to play with that on all the time. Otherwise I'd suggest a used McDermott. When you are tall and have the grip more to the rear of the cue, I don't think having a weight forward cue is a good idea. If you find it too butt heavy, the midline extension will pull the weight forward. The "Star" line (made in Asia) has a steel joint and the weight more forward than a normal McDermott, but is cheaper. Oh, that reminds me, get the 3/8*10 joint, not the speed joint. It's important. The speed joint is utter crap!

If you know exactly what you want, have a Schmelke made to your specs or a cue from Cuesdirectly (haven't tried but hear good things). The Schmelke is the best value that can be had, although certainly NOT the best cue. Your budget is not large enough to get something much better, though.

If money is not a big limitation, I suggest you try a Mezz before you try anything else. The Mezz cues have the best hit in the business and are great quality cues. I play with one myself, with a Wd700 shaft. Best money I ever spent. Everything else feels like complete crap to me, compared to that. You will need to spend about 400 dollars for a new (basic) Mezz, but then you may be set for a long time.

Break cue, I'd get one of these:http://www.ebay.com/itm/J-J-Natural...198749?hash=item41ae015b5d:g:56MAAOSwEjFXfWiy

I'd stay away from the Heavy ones. I don't know anybody that use a super heavy break cue. Most use something the same weight or close to it, that they play with. I prefer 19.5 ounces myself.

I wouldn't buy Kamui chalk. Apart from that they are all pretty good: Predator, Blue Diamond, etc.
 
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You will grow tired of a heavy cue as you improve. 19oz. That's the sweet spot. The standard tip option will be fine until it wears out. I would get a McDermott. Good dealer support. Solid warranty. Made in USA. Most joints are 3/8x10 wood to wood which offers a solid, stiff hit and can easily be paired with aftermarket shafts of most brands if you go down that road later. Skip the break cue for now. Grab a Balance Rite extension and you have a 62" cue. Take it off and you have a 58" cue. Here are my recommendations.

https://www.seyberts.com/gs-series-cues/mcdermott-cue-gs13/

https://www.seyberts.com/cue-extensions/balance-rite-3/8-x-10-thread-pool-cue-extension/
 
Buy a 58" cue. It's easier to sell later on when you improve. And if possible get used cue (not brand new), cause they're cheaper and you will eventually changed them as you improve.

Meet up with the seller and try the cue for yourself.
 
Cues can be divided in to subcategories:
The really cheap cues sold on places like ebay for $50 or so, they are utter rubish, don't get those.
Then it's the cheap cues, if it's a players, Cuetec etc. Does not really matter, tjey are made with cheap wood or plastic, the design is just printed on and the shafts are usually quite basic.
The next category is where you find cues made of real wood, with a good finish and quality maple shafts.
This is a good starting place.
Next stage you'll get the same quality butt as in the previous category, but you pay more for a decent Low Deflection shaft.
The next category is the same as previous, but more bling on your cue means more $$
After that there is really no improvement in playability it's all about quality of the work, inlays, woods used etc.
The plain Joss models costing about $300 is hard to beat, well constructed and with good maple shafts, for about $80 extra you can trade up to their LD shaft wich is really nice and has a good feel to it.
As for break cues, yes there are differences and very heavy or very light break cues bums me out, I like mine close to the weight of my playing cue.
If you can try before you buy, that would be a good thing.
A soft tip is more forgiving for user errors, but you loose some energy compared to a harder tip.
If you have a good stroke go for a medium hard tip.
 
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Straightpool_99 said:
Players HXT often get suggested on the forum, but it is a bit flimsy feeling, so I'd not suggest that for you.

I think a cuetec might be a good choice, IF you can get a midline extension for it. I know some of them can be fitted with a butt extension, but you definitely don't want to play with that on all the time. Otherwise I'd suggest a used McDermott. When you are tall and have the grip more to the rear of the cue, I don't think having a weight forward cue is a good idea. If you find it too butt heavy, the midline extension will pull the weight forward. The "Star" line (made in Asia) has a steel joint and the weight more forward than a normal McDermott, but is cheaper. Oh, that reminds me, get the 3/8*10 joint, not the speed joint. It's important. The speed joint is utter crap!

If you know exactly what you want, have a Schmelke made to your specs or a cue from Cuesdirectly (haven't tried but hear good things). The Schmelke is the best value that can be had, although certainly NOT the best cue. Your budget is not large enough to get something much better, though.

Break cue, I'd get one of these:http://www.ebay.com/itm/J-J-Natural...198749?hash=item41ae015b5d:g:56MAAOSwEjFXfWiy

I wouldn't buy Kamui chalk. Apart from that they are all pretty good: Predator, Blue Diamond, etc.
Click to expand...

Since the McDermott stick Nine Miler below gave me the link for is about the same price, I guess I can just make life easier on myself and get that. I think I know what I want but if Schmelke is NOT better than McD in quality and feel of a solid hit then... or are they about the same?

I assume the 3/8 joint is the screw in?

That JJ break/jump cue seems way too good of a value LOL, is it comparable or even better than the HXTP1 Pure X Jump / Break Cue? For $77 heck yea, I'll get it if it will save my players stick from some wear and tear and give me a little more oomph on the break... the jump part is just a little bonus, since I do love jumping when I practice on full tables.

Whats wrong with Kamui? Dont most pros play with them, and I heard it mushrooms less than Elk for softer tips.


Nine Miler said:
You will grow tired of a heavy cue as you improve. 19oz. That's the sweet spot. The standard tip option will be fine until it wears out. I would get a McDermott. Good dealer support. Solid warranty. Made in USA. Most joints are 3/8x10 wood to wood which offers a solid, stiff hit and can easily be paired with aftermarket shafts of most brands if you go down that road later. Skip the break cue for now. Grab a Balance Rite extension and you have a 62" cue. Take it off and you have a 58" cue. Here are my recommendations.

https://www.seyberts.com/gs-series-cues/mcdermott-cue-gs13/
https://www.seyberts.com/cue-extensions/balance-rite-3/8-x-10-thread-pool-cue-extension/
Click to expand...

So you also agree the McDermott is clearly better than any Players HXT model? I was about to pull the trigger on one of them but since the McD is the same price as the higher Players' cues, it wouldn't be much more of a financial sacrifice.


timothysoong said:
Buy a 58" cue. It's easier to sell later on when you improve. And if possible get used cue (not brand new), cause they're cheaper and you will eventually changed them as you improve.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the advice!


Kim Bye said:
Cues can be divided in to subcategories:
The really cheap cues sold on places like ebay for $50 or so, they are utter rubish, don't get those.
Then it's the cheap cues, if it's a players, Cuetec etc. Does not really matter, tjey are made with cheap wood or plastic, the design is just printed on and the shafts are usually quite basic.
The next category is where you find cues made of real wood, with a good finish and quality maple shafts.
This is a good starting place.
Next stage you'll get the same quality butt as in the previous category, but you pay more for a decent Low Deflection shaft.
The next category is the same as previous, but more bling on your cue means more $$
After that there is really no improvement in playability it's all about quality of the work, inlays, woods used etc.
The plain Joss models costing about $300 is hard to beat, well constructed and with good maple shafts, for about $80 extra you can trade up to their LD shaft wich is really nice and has a good feel to it.
As for break cues, yes there are differences and very heavy or very light break cues bums me out, I like mine close to the weight of my playing cue.
If you can try before you buy, that would be a good thing.
A soft tip is more forgiving for user errors, but you loose some energy compared to a harder tip.
If you have a good stroke go for a medium hard tip.
Click to expand...
 
JMASTERJ said:
Since the McDermott stick Nine Miler below gave me the link for is about the same price, I guess I can just make life easier on myself and get that. I think I know what I want but if Schmelke is NOT better than McD in quality and feel of a solid hit then... or are they about the same?

I assume the 3/8 joint is the screw in?

So you also agree the McDermott is clearly better than any Players HXT model? I was about to pull the trigger on one of them but since the McD is the same price as the higher Players' cues, it wouldn't be much more of a financial sacrifice.

Thanks for the advice!
Click to expand...

It's hard to go wrong with McDermott. They have been doing this a long time and have great dealer and customer support. Yes the 3/8x10 is the pin or screw. 3/8 inch diameter screw, 10 threads/inch. This is commonly called a "big pin" and is one of the readily available and standard size joint screws, meaning you can find most all aftermarket shafts and extensions to fit this cue.
 
JMASTERJ said:
How do they compare with the HXT's in quality/value? About the same? I dont mind supporting smaller companies if its all the same.

And the Elkmaster is comparable to the Kamui black soft? I dont know anything about the Elkmasters.
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Best solid leather tip I have tried so far was the Ki-tech. I tried a soft, it started soft, it stayed soft and it never mushroomed or flattened. The Kamui tips are great feeling and consistent, but the ones I tried have hardened to a level over what they were rated at in several months. Very good tips though.

Ki-Tech: http://outsville-com.3dcartstores.com/Ki-Tech-Tips_c_11.html Just make sure the installer knows what he is doing, you need a bit of a special handling to install them without shredding up the tip a bit.

People say good things about ultra skin tips, but then others don't like them at all.
 
Nine Miler said:
It's hard to go wrong with McDermott. They have been doing this a long time and have great dealer and customer support. Yes the 3/8x10 is the pin or screw. 3/8 inch diameter screw, 10 threads/inch. This is commonly called a "big pin" and is one of the readily available and standard size joint screws, meaning you can find most all aftermarket shafts and extensions to fit this cue.
Click to expand...

Thanks... so in your opinion McDermott is in the same class as Schmelke? Just trying to get a bearing on all the better manufactures and sellers so I dont have to go through this process again next time. I kinda like the variety of the Schmelke, although I am sure McDermott also has some variety but then I have to deal with all the different models they might have.


hang-the-9 said:
Best solid leather tip I have tried so far was the Ki-tech. I tried a soft, it started soft, it stayed soft and it never mushroomed or flattened. The Kamui tips are great feeling and consistent, but the ones I tried have hardened to a level over what they were rated at in several months. Very good tips though.

Ki-Tech: http://outsville-com.3dcartstores.com/Ki-Tech-Tips_c_11.html Just make sure the installer knows what he is doing, you need a bit of a special handling to install them without shredding up the tip a bit.

People say good things about ultra skin tips, but then others don't like them at all.
Click to expand...

It seems from all the comments I been getting that Kamui Black soft is great for someone who replaces their tips like every 1000 hits or something... I see the Ki-tech is catered towards not hardening and mushrooming for longer lasting quality play. If I see that in one of the choices, I'll take it I guess, if not, I'll go with Kamui since I barely play once a week for a couple of hours, I am sure even the Kamui will last me over a year, so if I just replace them once a year, I'll be ok.

Does this sound like a fair assessment for me?
 
You know there are other really good soft tips out there that are more user friendly than Kamui blacks :embarrassed2:
Zan Premium soft is a really good soft tip that requires very little maintenance or scuffing as it doesnt glaze over as fast Kamui black tends to. Even the Kamui original (brown tips) are longer lasting as they dont have to be scuffed it as often. Holds chalk better than the black aswell in my opinion :)
Tips are an endless swamp to dig through for their huge variety and because everyone has their own preference to what makes a tip good for their stroke :thumbup:
 
Kimmo H. said:
You know there are other really good soft tips out there that are more user friendly than Kamui blacks :embarrassed2:
Zan Premium soft is a really good soft tip that requires very little maintenance or scuffing as it doesnt glaze over as fast Kamui black tends to. Even the Kamui original (brown tips) are longer lasting as they dont have to be scuffed it as often. Holds chalk better than the black aswell in my opinion :)
Tips are an endless swamp to dig through for their huge variety and because everyone has their own preference to what makes a tip good for their stroke :thumbup:
Click to expand...

LOL great... just what I need, hundreds to choose from... Maybe I'll just try Elk which seems most say are the softest and go from there. I really dont wanna make it a habit to keep changing tips but heck, I might as well invest a little time getting this done huh.

BTW congrats being in Finland... rated like #1 in so many stats for the country, and love the way you guys do school education, I'd love to open schools like that here in the USA, I agree its the best way to educate kids! (And u guys make Clash of Clans bahahaha)
 
JMASTERJ said:
Hey guys... first a little background... I used to play a lot, maybe I was like a 4 then (on the equalizer APA rating), and then I played maybe once a year for about 20 years, and now I am getting back into it. I am working hard to get to a 5 and then 6+.
There are so many cues out there, it is mind boggling, between length, weight, tip size, etc... My goal is to be able to work the ball while hitting it softer, but my ball striking isn't the best because I dont get to practice much but I am planning on it in the next 6-12 months, and I want to start solid.

I do realize that at my level there is almost no difference between certain $100-$300 cues, but my purpose in asking these questions is to simply narrow down/eliminate certain groups of cues so I dont have to choose from 2000 of them I see all over that fit that pricing. When I try different cues, I DO feel the difference, and I hate the stick bar cues, way too flimsy feeling all over.

My understanding and what I think I need: (Just need a starting point, I hope you know what I mean)

CUE LENGTH: I am 6'2 with average wingspan I think for my height, so I assume standard length is ok? (My choice: 59"?)

CUE WEIGHT: I definitely don't like light shafts, but I think that's just my personal preference. I have no idea what I need for better performance. I don't believe I need more speed, I rather have a slow smoother stroke and have power when I need it, which means a heavier cue. I think that's ok as long as I put on a well chalked good tip? So I guess my point would be, why does anyone need a very light cue? (My choice: 20 oz?)

CUE QUALITY: I think this can be directly related to price correct? One thing I dont understand is, the only preference I know I have is I like the more solid heavy sound... I hate the light tinny sound. Otherwise, how does a $1000 stick make you hit balls better than a $150 stick? (My choice: $100-$190?)

CUE DESIGN: With most things being equal I think a great looking cue is nice to give you more confidence and also less likely to be stolen right? Or is it the opposite LOL.

TIP: Because I really like to work the ball, I am thinking a soft good tip but then again some cues come with an ok tip so not sure if its worth the extra $20 for a new great one and then go through the trouble of learning how to replace it and get all the other glue and equipment and stuff. So If I get like a Le Pro, I might want to just keep it but I heard it is like medium hard, and for my shooting cute, I think I prefer something like Kamui Black (soft)? Is the tip wearing out that much of a pain?

BREAK CUE: Is there much different quality in a break cue? I mean can I just get like a $70 one thats like 25-27 oz and have like a Le Pro medium/hard tip on it? I usually like to put a little underspin on the break but I dont think I need a Kamui for that.

CHALK: I heard it makes a difference, any suggestions welcome. For a few bucks I would definitely get my own chalk.

GLOVE: I usually use a lot of powder to smoothen my bridge hand near the thumb. Is a glove really useful/better? I see Shane use it all the time.

Some I like I saw on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FB733P...UTF8&colid=2X2YDD7TL960N&coliid=IQYOIIT13LPAO
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00140FYO...lid=2X2YDD7TL960N&coliid=I2JEAOLYMUXDNZ&psc=1

ANY other tips, most appreciated! Cheers!
Click to expand...

If you can increase your budget to around 250.00 or 300.00, I would suggest a Pechauer sneaky. They make a really solid cue, that will last you a very long time. As others here have said, look around a try out a few. :cool:
Good luck.
j2
 
Spend a little more and buy a Bob Frey sneaky. Best hitting cue IMO. Plus least amount of effort to pocket balls and get cue ball action. I had one but sold it to a friend. Will be buying another.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 
JMASTERJ said:
Thanks... so in your opinion McDermott is in the same class as Schmelke? Just trying to get a bearing on all the better manufactures and sellers so I dont have to go through this process again next time. I kinda like the variety of the Schmelke, although I am sure McDermott also has some variety but then I have to deal with all the different models they have.
Click to expand...

In my opinion, Schmelke is not in the same class as McDermott. Try to go to your local home gaming store, you know like one that sells dart boards and shuffleboard tables and pool table and stuff. Ask them for a replacement weight bolt or a bumper for a schmelke. Then ask for one for a McDermott. They probably even sell mcDermotts and have some you could test.
 
Nine Miler said:
In my opinion, Schmelke is not in the same class as McDermott. Try to go to your local home gaming store, you know like one that sells dart boards and shuffleboard tables and pool table and stuff. Ask them for a replacement weight bolt or a bumper for a schmelke. Then ask for one for a McDermott. They probably even sell mcDermotts and have some you could test.
Click to expand...

Sorry LOL so which is better... Do you mean McD is much better?
 
2twoball said:
Schmelke is BETTER than players. It is also made here in USA,(Rice Lake,Wisconsin). The Kamuii is an expensive tip to 'learn' if soft is for you. Elkmaster has been 'the' soft tip forever. If it is too soft,after a while move to a Triangle or LePro. All 3 of these are very inexpensive tips that have been a mainstay in the pool game for years. Good Luck with your choices !!!
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Schmelke would be my choice in a inexpensive great playing cue.

Break cues, I personally like a lighter one. I use a j/j that was lightened up a bit, works really well and is inexpensive.

I'm not a fan of gloves personally.
 
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