Need Help With Harvey Martin/ Bert Schrager -Apprentice/Cuemaker Tree

At this point, I again want to Thank everyone for all the input!!!!

With changing time and new terminology, apprentice might be the wrong term today. With all the internet materials, Cuemaking Books, along with DVD/VHS/CD. Maybe we should let ICA , ACA, and the Cuemakers nonmember come up with a new terminology.

Since Cuemaker today are Student and Teacher!

How much surprised information will be found when I/We do Dan Janes/Bill Stroud [Joss Cues].

A simple man adding information, to whose that collect cues
 
Rich93 said:
It's Mortson according to Mortson.:)
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This is why I added that, I thought it was funny that Stew Mortson was quoted, but when asked, Pat said Mortenson without hesitation. I did see the earlier post. Personally, I have no idea :eek:.
 
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12squared said:
This is why I added that, I thought it was funny that Stew Mortson was quoted, but when asked, Pat said Mortenson without hesitation. I did see the earlier post. Personally, I have no idea :eek:.
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OK.

Here's Stew's card from when he worked at Schuler's.
 

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I post this on page #4 of this thread.

From page 542 of The Blue Book of Pool Cue. See picture below.

Will the Real Stew or Stu step forward!!!!!!!!!! Or Tell us why there two different spelling.

mortenson.jpg

Also newness Update

cuemakers tree.gif
 
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dmgwalsh said:
maybe blue book is wrong
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Dennis maybe you can ask Stew For clarification?? Would Like to hear from DPK on this subject also. Maybe it time to start sending out letter to these Cuemakers to see what I get back!!

Here somthing some might not know about Dieckman and his student/apprentice.

Jason Steinberger from Donnybrook, N. Dakota received a grant from The North Dakota Council On The Arts so he could come study at The Cueniversity. And Jason became his apprentice, spending almost five weeks with Dieckman, 9 Aug 2003 thru 16 Sep 2003.
 
billiardshot said:
Dennis maybe you can ask Stew For clarification??
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It has already been clarified. He wrote what he thought and signed his name. You then questioned whether he knew his own name and he provided you with a business card.

This is getting a little silly, I think. Obviously, Blue Book made a mistake. Ask them.

I think you are getting lost on a tangent. Stick to the main focus of your thread. It is cool to bring all these names together.


billiardshot said:
Would Like to hear from DPK on this subject also.
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Do you speak martian? ;)

Seriously, you are not going to hear from David on anything.
 
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I too have known Bert and Pat for a long time. I've enjoyed following this thread and have a few items of info I'd like to add:

Jimmy Wu spells his last name Woo.

Jerry McWorter worked for Bert for a short time, pantograph inlays and minor cue repairs, I believe.

Bert taught several neighbors/friends to assist him in the shop, Ron Genereax, Frank Austin, Jim Sforza, who made cues for a short time as Castle Cues.

Bert influenced Joe Porper who went on to learn from Jerry Franklin, as did
Jerry McWorter.

Bill Smith, from Chicago, a 3C player may have done some time in the shop also.

I do remember Al Romero would come in to have ferrules put on, but he did his own tips.

That's all for now.
 
jschaefer said:
I too have known Bert and Pat for a long time. I've enjoyed following this thread and have a few items of info I'd like to add:

Jimmy Wu spells his last name Woo.

Jerry McWorter worked for Bert for a short time, pantograph inlays and minor cue repairs, I believe.

Bert taught several neighbors/friends to assist him in the shop, Ron Genereax, Frank Austin, Jim Sforza, who made cues for a short time as Castle Cues.

Bert influenced Joe Porper who went on to learn from Jerry Franklin, as did
Jerry McWorter.

Bill Smith, from Chicago, a 3C player may have done some time in the shop also.

I do remember Al Romero would come in to have ferrules put on, but he did his own tips.

That's all for now.
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jschaefer, Thank for the input. Will add names or made changes tomorrow.

Do you know how much training if any McWorter got from Robinson?
 
dmgwalsh said:
It has already been clarified. He wrote what he thought and signed his name. You then questioned whether he knew his own name and he provided you with a business card.

This is getting a little silly, I think. Obviously, Blue Book made a mistake. Ask them.

I think you are getting lost on a tangent. Stick to the main focus of your thread. It is cool to bring all these names together.
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Dennis, I'm not getting lose on a tangent, just trying to get the correction done right.

Business Card Stated [Stew Mortson]
Your first post Stated [ Ken "Stew" Mortson]
Search come up with [Stew Mortson] and [Stu Mortenson]
and etc on what other have posted.

I'm happy to give him as many alias names as he want, and that should be stated. Whether for searching or collecting cue with inlays done by Stew.

Before this is done. We might see what a big spider web we have woven.

And I do appreciate these input from you Dennis.
 
billiardshot said:
Dennis, I'm not getting lose on a tangent, just trying to get the correction done right.

Business Card Stated [Stew Mortson]
Your first post Stated [ Ken "Stew" Mortson]
Search come up with [Stew Mortson] and [Stu Mortenson]
and etc on what other have posted.
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Here's my guess. Given name: Ken Mortson
nickname Stew. Goes by Stew Mortson.

Later
 
Lil Al Romero name came up again! I wonder if anyone from Hardtime Billiard could ask Al if he received apprentice and to what degree from either Tad or Bert Schrager?

If any AZers' have addition informations or questions. I would very much appreciate receiving them!

Newness Update

cuemakers tree.gif
 
A few more tidbits:

Jerrry McWorter played with a Robinson cue for quite some time, don't know if he learned cuemaking from him.

John Robinson's cuemaking philosophy seems very much removed from Harvey Martin, I don't see any connection at all.

Harvey Martin made some laminated shafts, 4 piece, probably in the 1940s or 50s. I had occasion to see one when he brought it to North Hollywood Billiards to show some 3C players.
 
Good info... DPK made my cue in 1976...and I still have it (with 4 shafts). I lived in Vegas and was watching Dave make many cues. I was at his home about 1973 and he was working with a lathe in his living room . He made about 300 cues total when in Vegas! My cue was in the neighborhood of about # 280. I sold a few billiard supplies out of Daves shop and I made quite a few custom leather cases. He quit and left Vegas shortly after. He assisted Bert during the health crisis time. I know Pat and Dave did not get along well so I figured it wouldn't last long. (I have known Bert since 1968/9 ?, when his shop was across from Universal Studios).
 
jschaefer said:
A few more tidbits:

Jerrry McWorter played with a Robinson cue for quite some time, don't know if he learned cuemaking from him.

John Robinson's cuemaking philosophy seems very much removed from Harvey Martin, I don't see any connection at all.

Harvey Martin made some laminated shafts, 4 piece, probably in the 1940s or 50s. I had occasion to see one when he brought it to North Hollywood Billiards to show some 3C players.
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jschaefer, if you read McWorter and Robinson Bio in The Blue Book of Pool Cue or McWorter's website you might see why I ask that question.

The laminated shaft by Martin have been mention and talk about before. I haven't seen a Martin's Laminated shaft.
 
ajrack said:
Good info... DPK made my cue in 1976...and I still have it (with 4 shafts). I lived in Vegas and was watching Dave make many cues. I was at his home about 1973 and he was working with a lathe in his living room . He made about 300 cues total when in Vegas! My cue was in the neighborhood of about # 280. I sold a few billiard supplies out of Daves shop and I made quite a few custom leather cases. He quit and left Vegas shortly after. He assisted Bert during the health crisis time. I know Pat and Dave did not get along well so I figured it wouldn't last long. (I have known Bert since 1968/9 ?, when his shop was across from Universal Studios).
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ajrack, Thank for the addition information.
 
billiardshot said:
...what did Bert learn from Herman Rambow?? Or did he??
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Ok, since this is winding down, here is my last post. I received this email from Bert about him remembering Rambow and Willie Hoppe - it is pretty fun and touching so I thought I'd share (Warning: many of you will think Fatboy wrote it, if you know what I mean, but I will fix the big pieces and added some punctuation :D):

"in 1946 i met him (Rambow) and bought 2 cues from him, the man who took me there was also a very close friend of both he and hoppe who i played a game with the next day at my dads american legion meeting. i still remember that night i was "the returningg war hero" and hoppe put his hand on my shoulder and said "son, just enjoy" i was so excited i almost wet my pants! by the yhe way both cues were $26.50 apiece.
Dave, in chicago hoppe would play exabitions with Joe Chamaco i watched every game After the game was overmy dad my mother and i went with Hoppe for coffee Dave, that's anoother storry about a 9 rail bank. Hoppe told me how to make it while we were at the coffee shop that's another story."

I hope you enjoyed the excerpt from the man himself, Bert.

And thanks for doing this, it was a blast to follow and contribute.

Dave
 
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