New Bridseye Plain Jane

MINDSEYE153

MINDSEYE153

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Some shots of a recent plain jane with some highly figured Birdseye.
Comments and critique?s are welcome and appreciated..

Paul


Joint polited 3/8-11:
cue-09.jpg


Forearm:
cue-05.jpg


Forearm with wrap groove cut:
cue-13.jpg


Forearm after wrap is installed, this wouldn't have been my choice of leather for this cue, but the customer gets what the customer wants:
cue-27.jpg


Wrap seem:
cue-28.jpg


Butt sleeve:
cue-20.jpg


Big Thanks to Chris Hightower for some excellent Leather Skins!
 
It doesn't look like there is any clear finish over the handle area, before the wrap was put on. Right or wrong? Also I'm curious about the joint. Are you just tyiing to be different or is there a good reason, for the very thin wall, at the collar area?
It doesn't seem to be very strong or have much contact area. I'm not being over critical, but triing to help...JER
 
almer said:
Nice looking cue,where did you get the birdseye
Click to expand...


A few years ago a local (Brooklyn, NY) guitar maker was kind enough to part with about 20 Board Feet. Some with more figure than this! This is the first piece to make it into a cue.

Paul
 
MINDSEYE153 said:
Some shots of a recent plain jane with some highly figured Birdseye.
Comments and critique?s are welcome and appreciated..

Paul


Joint polited 3/8-11:
cue-09.jpg


Forearm:
cue-05.jpg


Forearm with wrap groove cut:
cue-13.jpg


Forearm after wrap is installed, this wouldn't have been my choice of leather for this cue, but the customer gets what the customer wants:
cue-27.jpg


Wrap seem:
cue-28.jpg


Butt sleeve:
cue-20.jpg


Big Thanks to Chris Hightower for some excellent Leather Skins!
Click to expand...



is it for sale?
 
The figure of the Birdseye is really nice. I would think you will have some serious problems with the joint. It looks like from the photos that you have a wood to wood connection on the butt and the shaft? If so whats gonna happen when the wood swells a little. I think the fit of these two areas is gonna cause problems not to mention 2 pieces of wood rubbing together literally hundreds if not thousands of times as it screwed together and apart.You might have wanted to sleeve that joint with phenolic (If its Ivory?) instead of gluing it straight to the wood. As posted previously thats a pretty thin wall around the joint as well Just MHO....................Dave
 
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MINDSEYE153 said:
Some shots of a recent plain jane with some highly figured Birdseye.
Comments and critique?s are welcome and appreciated..

Paul


Big Thanks to Chris Hightower for some excellent Leather Skins!
Click to expand...

I like it. I did the piloted big pin for a while. People thought I was nuts (probably still do). Lambros does it and they think he's a genius.
 
BLACKHEARTCUES said:
It doesn't look like there is any clear finish over the handle area, before the wrap was put on. Right or wrong? Also I'm curious about the joint. Are you just tyiing to be different or is there a good reason, for the very thin wall, at the collar area?
It doesn't seem to be very strong or have much contact area. I'm not being over critical, but triing to help...JER
Click to expand...


nbll01 said:
The figure of the Birdseye is really nice. I would think you will have some serious problems with the joint. It looks like from the photos that you have a wood to wood connection on the butt and the shaft? If so whats gonna happen when the wood swells a little. I think the fit of these two areas is gonna cause problems not to mention 2 pieces of wood rubbing together literally hundreds if not thousands of times as it screwed together and apart.You might have wanted to sleeve that joint with phenolic (If its Ivory?) instead of gluing it straight to the wood. As posted previously thats a pretty thin wall around the joint as well Just MHO....................Dave
Click to expand...


Hey Jer ~ Dave

No there is no finish on the handle area (wrap section). I finish a cue and then cut the groove for the wrap so any finish that would have been on the handle gets cut off. I put the brown dye on the ends by the forearm and butt sleeve so I get a nice clean look when the wrap goes on.

The joint wall looks thin in the photos but its only .025" thinner than normal. For cues with this joint design I core the forearm in steps, .750" half way up then .650" up to the joint. The id of the pilot area is .550". So instead of a wall thickness of .125" on the joint, I end up with a wall thickness of .100". The shaft pilot is, .547" od. and after it is sealed and waxed there doesn't seem to be any problems with swelling (at least none have come up yet, and I've been using this joint design for over 7 years).

As most of my cues are used in the Northeast, where weather changes can be harsh to say the least, they have been through several expansion and contraction cycles without showing any adverse effects. One of my personal cues (4 years old) gets used 5-6 days a week by anyone and everyone who wants to try it out, from finesse players to ball bangers to newbees who have no clue and I still haven't seen any weakening of the joint of that cue (yet).

Thanks for the Comments and critiques and please keep them coming!

Paul
 
for all those who dont know paul or myself i can say this its not his first try at that joint(its not a try)it works perfectly (my break cue has it)
his cues dont warp,break rattle or loosten i have played with his stuff
since he started (over 10 yrs ago)and trust me if he is willing to show you something..its perfect
his standards are alot higher than he lets on
im sure its a gun too!
 
If you seal the forearm, to keep it from being effeted by moisture & temperature changes, why wouldn't you do the same for the handle area, which consists of about 1/2 of the Q? I'm just curious about your methods & why...JER
 
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The joint wall looks thin in the photos but its only .025" thinner than normal. For cues with this joint design I core the forearm in steps, .750" half way up then .650" up to the joint. The id of the pilot area is .550". So instead of a wall thickness of .125" on the joint, I end up with a wall thickness of .100". The shaft pilot is, .547" od. and after it is sealed and waxed there doesn't seem to be any problems with swelling (at least none have come up yet, and I've been using this joint design for over 7 years).



It could just be the picture but the joint doesn't appear to be sealed. Thats the reason for the comments I made....I still think the joint if Ivory should be sleeved over phenolic IMO ..............Dave
 
BLACKHEARTCUES said:
If you seal the forearm, to keep it from being effeted by moisture & temperature changes, why wouldn't you do the same for the handle area, which consists of about 1/2 of the Q? I'm just curious about your methods & why...JER
Click to expand...


nbll01 said:
It could just be the picture but the joint doesn't appear to be sealed. Thats the reason for the comments I made....I still think the joint if Ivory should be sleeved over phenolic IMO ..............Dave
Click to expand...

scttybee said:
for all those who dont know paul or myself i can say this its not his first try at that joint(its not a try)it works perfectly (my break cue has it)
his cues dont warp,break rattle or loosten i have played with his stuff
since he started (over 10 yrs ago)and trust me if he is willing to show you something..its perfect
his standards are alot higher than he lets on
im sure its a gun too!
Click to expand...

Hey Jer,
The handle of this cue (as are all of my cues) are either flat or radial laminates (this one is a flat laminate) that start out between 1.350" -1.400". By the time the handle is ready to get pieced into a cue it's had 10-12 passes over 10-12 months with a dunking in Resolute after each pass. Once it's been pieced into a cue it gets another 10 passes over 6-8 months until the cue is at finish dimensions, again with a dunking in Resolute after each pass. For as long as I've been working with and stabilizing them I haven't seen one turn once it's been put in a cue. That's not to say that it's not possible or that they don?t, I just haven't seen it yet.

I think that the reason I don?t seal the handle after the wrap groove is cut comes from my repair business. I?ve seen to many wraps come loose of sealed handles, but mostly on production cues and mostly from cues that come from the East (imports).


Dave,
If you look at the color balance of the photo with the joint you?ll notice that it wasn?t taken at the same time as the others. That photo was taken while the cue was still in production. You have a good eye! Yes, at the time that photo was taken the pin was only test fitted and neither the cues mortise nor the shafts tenon had been sealed or waxed. Rest assured before the cue left the shop they had been.

The joint is not Ivory but MP Ivory Substitute which seems to hold up very nicely. While it?s not as strong as phenolic, it was chosen for its softer hit.


Scott
While I do very much appreciate you words and your support over the years you know I can?t let you get away with that. Perfection DOESN?T exist and there?s ALWAYS room for improvement.

I?m always willing to listen to others and always willing to explain my thinking, that?s how we learn. At least that?s how I do!


Again, thanks for the Comments and critiques and please keep them coming, that's what it?s all about!

Paul
 
I like the cue, but I like rings...slotted woods/ebony/phenolic and bordered by silver. What would you charge for a similar cue (with that outrageous birdseye) with a different wrap and rings at all the places...abcde?? If you prefer, PM me a price. Thanks!
:p
 
i also dont seal the wrap area with finish. ive also taken wraps off of a few top cue makers and i dont think they do either
 
MINDSEYE153 said:
Some shots of a recent plain jane with some highly figured Birdseye.
Comments and critique?s are welcome and appreciated..

Big Thanks to Chris Hightower for some excellent Leather Skins!
Click to expand...

That joint looks very similar to the joint in the Brunswick and Dufferin Trophy snooker cues. They have only been using it for 40 or 50 years. I think it will hold up just fine.
 
Paul,
I talked to a few and read different articles about the pros/cons in a polited joint system. Seems like a lot of extra work but you must have your theories on why you would use it with a big pin.

Nice BE........sez it all.
 
Paul,

What type/color of stain was used on the birdseye before clearcoating? Whatever it is, it sure brings out the beautiful figuring in the wood.

Thanks,

Mark
 
ragbug74 said:
Paul,

What type/color of stain was used on the birdseye before clearcoating? Whatever it is, it sure brings out the beautiful figuring in the wood.

Thanks,

Mark
Click to expand...

Mark,
I used Minwax Natural #209. Hit it once and let it sit for a day then 0000 steelwool it. Then the same thing the next day but no steelwool, just get any excess of with a clean rag and it's ready for clear-coat.

Paul
 
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