new member of APA & it starts already

oldplayer

oldplayer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
i have been a pool player on and off for more than 35 years and have never been a member of any league. always heard that BCA was better than APA as far as rules. (i don't like "slop" shots either.) i had also heard that there is a lot of "drama" going on every night of league play. however, i just moved to this area about 3 onths ago and have a hard time finding a game (i like 14.1 and 8 ball). at the 14.1 league the other night i was invited to join a team with APA. i joined 2 weeks ago but could not play the first night so, this past monday night was my first night to play. i don't know much about the rules except you get to slop in the shots. like everyone, i have good shooting days and bad shooting days. one day i shoot like a 6 and another day like a strong 4. but i was told that as a new member i would start as a "4" and be adjusted accordingly after. that night was one of my "good" nights, making my 3 rail banks etc......later i played a "6" and we went hill hill and i came out on top. i heard whispers from the members of the opposing team that i was shooting like a "7" etc. it is true that that night was one of my better nights. so this past weds night i have my 14.1 league and the guys who had me join their team with APA. they said that one of the members of the opposing team had sent a complaint to APA about my being a 6 or 7 and coming in as a "4" etc......and our team should have sent me in as a 6. yaddy yaddi yaddi......so tell me, is this how it is in the leagues? i really don't need any more drama in my life at the moment. also, was i supposed to go in rated higher than a "4"? like weds night with the 14.1 match i shot like a "3"!! :angry: do i wear armor next monday night or just tell the other teams to "f" off? at least i do not "sandbag"!
 
Everybody male comes in as a 4. Don't worry about it. You will slowly go up. Just shoot your game. Wear ear plugs for a while. :grin:
 
When I played league my main goal wasn't to win but to annihilate my opponent. Playing APA 9Ball I would be upset if my opponent got more than 11 balls :lol:
 
Sadly this is common in league play. Everyone joins the apa or tap as a 4. You rating is adjusted from there. That is the rule. I had someone I believe to be a strong 6 join my team. I told the lo that he might hear complaints if he is started as a 4. I wanted the lo to know how strong this guy was. The player started as a 4. He won and was moved to a 6. I thought this was fair, and I had no complaints.
I have played in apa and tap for about 6 years. I have captained and team in each league to Vegas. I have never, ever played a week without hearing someone complaining about someone's rating.
I complained last week about an opposing players rating being too HIGH. This guy was a 4. No way. He joined the league as a 4. He played two weeks beating a 3 then a 2. But, he was no 4. He was at best a 3 and that was pushing it.
I want fair rating. This guy was not going to have a fair chance being over rated.
My tap league seems to have a better rating system than the apa. Check out tap if you have one in your area. DON'T listen to the complaints. Play your best and have a good time.
 
Don't sweat the complaints, everyone takes a while to get adjusted. Is that part of the APA? Yes, but its harmless venting, and not directed at you. Most people don't realize it but they are complaining about the league itself. Good business model, poor for sportsmanship and comraderie in my opinion. BCA handicaps do not have a significant effect on the rest of the team while as APA it does (due to that 23 rule).

Don't yell or swear at them, just tell them hey, "when you first started it took a while for your skill level to stabilize" and guess what, every good player who ever played in the APA had a period where they were "underrated" because unless the LO knew your ability before play, you started as a SL4.

Good for you for not sandbagging, and go have fun torturing people while your skill level adjusts itself, because eventually they will get you right and it will become fair and you will enjoy it.

One last statement id like to make, don't get hung up on "slop counts" as the skill level of your opponent increases, the slop decreases. Let's consider slop a "roll" and clump it together with the shots where we bumped a ball and got perfect leave when we didn't intent to do so. Yes, it goes both ways but try to not think degrading about slop, its just a roll where the ball fell into the hole! Eventually the rolls will even out and the better player on that night will win (most of the time).

Welcome to the APA and use it to enjoy the game, and not focus on the match. You are amongst other people who are interested in the game and that is not a bad thing at all.
 
In any group of people, you will get whiners and complainers, and Apa is no exception. Hopefully it isn't the majority in your part of the world....

You are right, many folks don't play consistently one week to the next. This first session in particular, you may see some fluctuations, until you get an established set of matches played. Again, don't sweat it.
To answer your question, every male player starts as a 4. What those guys are complaining.g about is that you could have requested to start at a higher level, if YOU wanted to. If you don't know the system or the level of competition, why would you do that? (Unless the person really is a higher level player, known in the area...)

A good friend of mine joined our league 2 sessions ago. From playing casually with him, I knew he'd be at least a 6 and probably a 7, but he started as a 4, too. We all had fun messing with him about it, and he was a 7 half way through the session. (I played him when he was a 5, heh heh. Razzed the crap out of him. Next session, I beat him when he was a 7. Funny game...)

You're gonna be fine, ignore the loudmouths.
 
I was in a similar position when I first joined APA. I went in as a 4, got bumped up to a 5, then for some reason was dropped to a 3 for 3 weeks. To put this in context, my SL finally leveled off at 6.

So for three weeks, I made people very unhappy. They griped and moaned and were seriously pissed. I did what I could: I shrugged and said "wtf? I didn't ask to be a 3."

So my advice is to try to shrug it off, they're mostly coming up with excuses on why they lost.
 
I just got to Georga my self i joined the VNEA singles divison since i never played in it. I like it better than APA and BCA so far.
 
thanks for all the help. the forum is always there when you need it! :thumbup: i'll grin and bear it and like you said, i will enjoy creaming the 5's and below while i can! everyone have a great w/e and "run the racks"!:clapping:
 
Shaky1 said:
Everybody male comes in as a 4. Don't worry about it. You will slowly go up. Just shoot your game. Wear ear plugs for a while. :grin:
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I don't think my league knows the meaning of "slowly move up" I got moved 3 skill levels after 1 week of play
 
Dannydizzan said:
I don't think my league knows the meaning of "slowly move up" I got moved 3 skill levels after 1 week of play
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The week I started, we had another guy also playing his first match. He won, and basically destroyed his opponent. They moved him to a 7 the next week. Our captain called, and got it lowered to a 6, which in reality is probably about right. (if he plays regularly, that's where he ought to be)

The first few weeks can be interesting, with how the computer crunches the numbers.
 
Dannydizzan said:
Honestly, I like the higher skill level because I get to make more balls!
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Higher the better IMO. Eventually your skill level in league will max out but you will continue to gain skill in the game... you wont have to worry about being raised anymore.
 
As I see it part of the complaining problem is that 3,4,5s feel that they are better than they really are when they win against a higher S/L. So when they lose they are looking at the other guy or gal and not their own play.
 
oldplayer said:
i have been a pool player on and off for more than 35 years and have never been a member of any league. always heard that BCA was better than APA as far as rules. (i don't like "slop" shots either.) i had also heard that there is a lot of "drama" going on every night of league play. however, i just moved to this area about 3 onths ago and have a hard time finding a game (i like 14.1 and 8 ball). at the 14.1 league the other night i was invited to join a team with APA. i joined 2 weeks ago but could not play the first night so, this past monday night was my first night to play. i don't know much about the rules except you get to slop in the shots. like everyone, i have good shooting days and bad shooting days. one day i shoot like a 6 and another day like a strong 4. but i was told that as a new member i would start as a "4" and be adjusted accordingly after. that night was one of my "good" nights, making my 3 rail banks etc......later i played a "6" and we went hill hill and i came out on top. i heard whispers from the members of the opposing team that i was shooting like a "7" etc. it is true that that night was one of my better nights. so this past weds night i have my 14.1 league and the guys who had me join their team with APA. they said that one of the members of the opposing team had sent a complaint to APA about my being a 6 or 7 and coming in as a "4" etc......and our team should have sent me in as a 6. yaddy yaddi yaddi......so tell me, is this how it is in the leagues? i really don't need any more drama in my life at the moment. also, was i supposed to go in rated higher than a "4"? like weds night with the 14.1 match i shot like a "3"!! :angry: do i wear armor next monday night or just tell the other teams to "f" off? at least i do not "sandbag"!
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APA doesn't tell players how they calculate skill levels. You and your team cannot be expected to know what skill level you should enter as. The complaint means nothing. Actually the other team did the right thing. They made a complaint to APA to figure this out. It could be worse they could have started a argument during league play.
 
Dannydizzan said:
I don't think my league knows the meaning of "slowly move up" I got moved 3 skill levels after 1 week of play
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"How do you raise someone three skill levels after one match?" is a question league operators have to answer a lot. The correct answer the vast majority of the time is "We didn't."

"Yes you did, he went from a 4 to a 7!"

"No, he went from 'We know nothing about him' to 'This is all we know about him.'"

The first number is a guess based on zero information, and the second number is a measurement based on very little information. The more information we get, the more accurate the number becomes.

The same phenomenon drives the skill level comments made by opponents. Before they see you play, they know nothing about you. Then they see one match and make a comment if their one-match "measurement" doesn't correlate with the number on the sheet, or the made-up number if you just joined that night.

To the OP, don't take it as drama or an insult if an opponent makes a comment or even complains to the league operator about your skill level. As long as you are honest and they are honest, it's a good thing. It shows that they want the numbers to be right, and are willing to do their part to make sure we have as much information as possible as soon as possible.
 
APA Operator said:
"How do you raise someone three skill levels after one match?" is a question league operators have to answer a lot. The correct answer the vast majority of the time is "We didn't."

"Yes you did, he went from a 4 to a 7!"

"No, he went from 'We know nothing about him' to 'This is all we know about him.'"

The first number is a guess based on zero information, and the second number is a measurement based on very little information. The more information we get, the more accurate the number becomes.

The same phenomenon drives the skill level comments made by opponents. Before they see you play, they know nothing about you. Then they see one match and make a comment if their one-match "measurement" doesn't correlate with the number on the sheet, or the made-up number if you just joined that night.

To the OP, don't take it as drama or an insult if an opponent makes a comment or even complains to the league operator about your skill level. As long as you are honest and they are honest, it's a good thing. It shows that they want the numbers to be right, and are willing to do their part to make sure we have as much information as possible as soon as possible.
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My guess to the reason why he went from a 4 to a 7 is maybe becuse he ran out the rack in one inning ? Sometimes the score keeper can mess things up. If i came in as a 4 and beat someone sensless and running out racks in less than two innings i would my self expect to go up at least a to a 6
 
oldplayer said:
i have been a pool player on and off for more than 35 years and have never been a member of any league. always heard that BCA was better than APA as far as rules. (i don't like "slop" shots either.) i had also heard that there is a lot of "drama" going on every night of league play. however, i just moved to this area about 3 onths ago and have a hard time finding a game (i like 14.1 and 8 ball). at the 14.1 league the other night i was invited to join a team with APA. i joined 2 weeks ago but could not play the first night so, this past monday night was my first night to play. i don't know much about the rules except you get to slop in the shots. like everyone, i have good shooting days and bad shooting days. one day i shoot like a 6 and another day like a strong 4. but i was told that as a new member i would start as a "4" and be adjusted accordingly after. that night was one of my "good" nights, making my 3 rail banks etc......later i played a "6" and we went hill hill and i came out on top. i heard whispers from the members of the opposing team that i was shooting like a "7" etc. it is true that that night was one of my better nights. so this past weds night i have my 14.1 league and the guys who had me join their team with APA. they said that one of the members of the opposing team had sent a complaint to APA about my being a 6 or 7 and coming in as a "4" etc......and our team should have sent me in as a 6. yaddy yaddi yaddi......so tell me, is this how it is in the leagues? i really don't need any more drama in my life at the moment. also, was i supposed to go in rated higher than a "4"? like weds night with the 14.1 match i shot like a "3"!! :angry: do i wear armor next monday night or just tell the other teams to "f" off? at least i do not "sandbag"!
Click to expand...

Dont sweat it and dont judge your whole dision by one team you may really like a lot of the people once you get to know them.
 
Leagues..and specifically APA always has some kind of drama. People will feel cheated if they see an under ranked player and players feel cheated if they are over ranked. It's part of the dealings with APA. Just something that you need to be aware of and deal with it. A good percentage of the time the APA league operator's job is to simply babysit adults complaints.
 
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