Newbies can say what they want

Diamond69 said:
Nice post Lou. You are completely correct in your analogy. And if it is a newbie with no value to add, or the wrong type of delivery, they will be "that guy". And everyone will know it.
And it goes both ways, you can come in and add value and quickly be accepted into the "party".
I just think they need the opportunity to be either guy. If people don't like their posts, that will speak volumes without having to say "you're new, you're not allowed to have an opinion".
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It's not so much that "your not allowed to have an opinion", as much as it is "who the heck are you that you come here and start complaining right off the bat?"

Now, when someone comes on here with their first post warning others of a scam artist, that is totally different. That is a warning, not just complaining.
 
TommyLee said:
I agree, it takes more self control not to say something you really want to than to say what you think needs to be said. JAM for the most part has been offering nothing but trouble to the forums lately and should keep it to herself if its not pool related. It doesn't make her a bad person at all just seems to be bothering the hell out of most people.
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I appreciate this being said. I am a fairly new member. I mainly just read what's going on and what's being said. MANY times I have wanted to chime in and just tell/ask JAM to STFU. I have no idea who she is or how she fits in the industry. But it's apparent to me she thinks too highly of it.
 
Scherf said:
I appreciate this being said. I am a fairly new member. I mainly just read what's going on and what's being said. MANY times I have wanted to chime in and just tell/ask JAM to STFU. I have no idea who she is or how she fits in the industry. But it's apparent to me she thinks too highly of it.
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well its a good thing you dont "chime" about that stuff. i might not have been on the forum long but i have been in the "industry" for a while we are talking over 20 years. most dont remember me, and i havent been fully active of in almost 10 years. A lot of the ones that have a high post count are either trolls or very RESPECTED in this community. and its apparent you need to respect your elders as it were. im just glad this forum isnt as bad as the Paintball forums with all the 13 year old saying how good they are but in all actuality they hide and pray not to get shot. you must be one of those guys.
 
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DoubleD said:
Seriously, are you not self aware enough to think that just maybe you are causing a lot of these 'attacks' and in actuality they are simply replies in kind?

Take the 'engorged nipple' incident yesterday. You argued against several people about whether the young lady in the avatar had a top on--you were the only person who couldn't see it. You could have easily said that you made a mistake, but still felt it was inappropriate (well, some people could have said that--admitting fault doesn't seem to be within your abilities).

Funny thing is (and I'm a straight male with a job where that kind of avatar wouldn't likely be a problem) I would have, and did in another thread, commented that I agree with you had you said something to that effect.

I've been on the forums for a while...not a decade, but most of the time I have been here you've added very little. I've seen mostly hijacked threads to post photos I don't care about and personal stories traded with people I don't know. Recently your whole posting repertoire seems to be complaining about AZ'ers. Yes, the forum has changed, I get that. You have written too many times about how horrible AZ is to pros...and you are right, but that is to be expected with as many members as we have. In truth, the vast majority of members are either polite to pros or simply don't interact with them any differently (like me--the only pro on here that I care one way or the other about is Ray Martin). Instead of simply complaining, help start changing that.

Finally, and I've debated even saying this--I do so simply to educate, to have 'literally stabbed you in the heart', that post would have had to reach out from your computer screen with a knife and plunged it in your chest. Literally doesn't mean 'like I read it in a book'. Literally means it actually happened. To have something 'in essence' literally happen makes no sense at all.

dld--->evil dog hater :rolleyes:
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Well said. Best post so far
 
Not many posts - but here is my take anyway.

Post count does not equal intelligence, ability for insight, or credibility. In my experience, just the opposite is usually true. You don't create 1000 posts per month by posting useful insights or information. It's almost always from flinging poop at each other.

This is a pseudo-community. Much like a community has elders, a pseudo-community has pseudo-elders. These "elders" may feel a sense of entitlement just because of how long they have been active in the community. If this were an actual community that mattered in the grand scheme of things, you may be right. Unfortunately, in this pseudo-community, you only matter as much as the community can deliver.
 
MoneyBox said:
Post count does not equal intelligence, ability for insight, or credibility.
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Wait ... are you trying to tell me I've wasted my life??! NOOOO!!!!111~1!

JAM, I'm all good with you. I don't agree that because something was made in USA USA USA it's better. We're all stuck on this little blue marble together. I also don't think being a pro player is an entitlement to lie about people. Other than that, we agree on most things.

PS: Lou, thanks for aging me there buddy. I'm skipping my turn to buy beer next time just for that. Oh, and we're playing snooker this time. Sucka!
 
you don't need to type a jillion cwpm anymore

tucson9ball said:
As for saying what you want....if the Mods are good with it, then it's ok. There are rules on the forums.
People giving their opinions is what makes this forum great. As for JAM, she obviously can type ver, very fast (I"m jealous) so she posts more than most of us. Lately there has been a changing of the guard, if you will, on the forum. There seems to be some clashes amongst posters and many disagreements. JAM does not pull too many punches and can post quick. Some posters don't like it, but she does stay within the rules, so........no big deal.
Keep on posting......WOOHOO!!!
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Yep, Jam's lightning on a keyboard- think she posted once she's near 160 cwpm.
but all you need is good talk-to-text software (I think it's Dragon on my work desktop) and you, too, can smoke out lightning fast replies.
The talk-to-text on my android phone isn't nearly as reliable, though
If I'm driving and not looking at the screen to edit, it can make me look like CocoboloCowboy was posting for me. . . .
 
JAM said:
What a way to start my day. :(

I may be on a downward slide for you, but you aren't exactly on my bucket list of people I need to satisfy.

I come to this forum to discuss pool. If people take potshots at me, kind of like what you're doing now, I reply. I have contributed a great deal of pool content to this forum in the past 10 years, as well as contributed funds to pool-worthy causes in an effort to promote pool.

The climate on AzBilliards has changed. It isn't just me, though. It has changed for a lot of folks who have ceased posting. Believe it or not, I used to be one of the good guys, but today not so much, thanks to the recent campaign to post about "JAM" at every turn, at every post I make, all because I stated my disdain for an avatar of a scantily clad woman. For some, this recent Bash JAM Campaign is a game, a pastime during the day. As many posts as I've made, they have made just as many, if not more in my absence. If I don't post, I'm told I must be at a doctor's appointment. If I do post, every word is dissected and twisted to mean something else. If I defend the accusations made against me, if I dare to reply, kind of like I am now with this post, it is said that I am trying to play the "victim." If all else fails, then they go after Keith with mean-spirited comments.

Because I call somebody out for a first post condeming InsidePOOL's commentator, it is an opportunity to condemn me. In my 10 years of being a member here, I have never experienced hate as much as recently, but this time I am on the receiving end. Everything else I have tried to do in the past 10 years to effect a change for the better is forgotten. Of course, most of you weren't even members then, I guess.

AzBilliards used to make me feel good. I enjoyed it, but not so much anymore. And when something doesn't make me feel good anymore, well, it's time to move on. Life is just too short to subject one's self to hurt and/or anger. I have tears going down my face now as I write this, but that's what happens when you get old. You cry at the drop of a hat sometimes. :embarrassed2:

I have a new job that will prevent me from reading AzBilliards as much, so maybe that's a good thing for me and for you. Some of you have chased me down and pummeled me with your posts to let me know exactly what you think of me. In essence, you have literally stabbed my heart. I might be wounded today, but I will survive. :)

Of course, newbies should be encouraged to post. I never said they shouldn't, but I did point out that a brand-new poster joined yesterday for the sole purpose to bash InsidePOOL's commentary of a match. If it was a new member posting about any other pool-related topic under the sun, I would never have pointed it out. The fact that they join to only bash this match to me seemed suspect, and I stated it as such.

I only wish I had known beforehand about this recent turn of events before I paid for my gold membership. :grin-square:
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Wow, what drama. I'm a pretty fair person, and give people a lot of leeway before I come out swinging.

JAM, over the years I've seen you lose your cool and blow a verbal gasket on this forum over the stupidest things. You've come across as intolerant of non-americans, and specifically singled out Canadians as being the reason the billiard business is going to shit in the states. <MASSIVE EYE ROLL>.

To be fair I've enjoyed many of your posts and your pictures are awesome, cmon, give it all a rest and live and let live.

I've been on this board for 8 years now, don't you think it's odd that I've only recently started posting against you? Perhaps it's time to take a look at yourself with fresh eyes. Do you really want to thought of as intolerant?
 
I didn't read the whole thread, coz I don't like any of you.

Is it possible that new folks may not be aware of some of the history, which puts them in a less knowledgeble position- RELATING TO FORUM MATTERS/ DISCUSSIONS/ HISTORY- than AZBros with moe substantial history?

Rhetorical question.

Everybody STFU. Except Stu, Mike, Glen and Mr. Bond.

Murray Tucker can continue typing, as well.
 
lfigueroa said:
Unfortunately, what many newbs fail to acknowledge, or choose to ignore, is the fact that a forum like this is like a long running party. Some of us have known each other for years going back a decade or two, even met at tournaments or when visiting other cities and pool rooms, or at get togethers like the old RSB events or the AZ Room at the DCC.

There are cliques, people who like each other, others that avoid each other. Some people are serious and intellectual, others funny or silly, there are the players, the raconteurs, some are gamblers, others are not, there are players and some who don’t even play much but enjoy the game. There are people from all walks of life and all different incomes and varying degrees of education. And, there are people who, for a wide variety of reasons have earned the respect of most everyone at the party. BUT regardless, it is a long standing gathering of friends. Everyone knows everyone else.

And then a new guy comes into the room.

He doesn’t know who is who, or what is what, and has not made any contribution to the festivities. But he spouts off like he knows everything, insults people that have been around for years and have contributed to the fun, and occasionally disrespects members of the community whom almost everyone knows and likes. And, just like at a real party everyone turns and looks at the new guy and wonders who the loud mouthed, uncouth idiot is.

So yes, just like that guy, you can come into the party, say what you want to whom you want, but you are still being *that guy.* And everyone will know it and label you as the rude bastard that made a spectacle of themselves and forever more discount... pretty much everything you have to say in the future.

Stay a while. Learn who is who and what is what. Contribute to the party, become known without getting out of line, and respect the traditions and relationships that exist within the group.

IOW, don't be "that guy."

Lou Figueroa
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Lou,

I like your party analogy, but at real parties, I don't think it's very often that any of the regular attendees take it upon themselves to put "that guy" in his place. In other words, you rarely have "party police" at real parties. Here, it's different.

Roger
 
bmsclayton said:
I think people should be free to post what they want when they want. I do think it is a good idea for a newbie to get a feel for the members and the context for what they say before engaging. But certainly not a requirement. I travel to pool tournaments across the country for calcuttas and always like to talk and drink with the locals and get to know them before we gamble and insult each other.
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I am one of the newbies you guys are posting about. I disagree to an extent with bmsclayton and this is why.

I have been lurking on this forum for a few years and think I have a feel for quite a few of the members. This is not to say that all newbies are like this, I'm sure some sign up and right away start bashing people and ideas.

The reason I haven't contributed much is simply due to experience and knowledge. I have been doing searches to further my own knowledge, but the majority of you for surpass me. My experience is limited and not getting much better. I have too many things going on right now to gain that experience, so I live vicariously through you guys. Thanks for letting me do that. :)

Anyway, thanks for letting me put my $.02 in.
 
Diamond69 said:
Fooled you! I'm actually from Illinois, but the pool scene is better in Wisconsin. Wisconsin State tourney's get 300+ teams. Illinois gets maybe 50.
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So, when you win a tournament in Wisconsin, do they say "Congratulations, you won the cheese!" and hand you a 20-lb brick of cheddar?
 
Ghosst said:
PS: Lou, thanks for aging me there buddy. I'm skipping my turn to buy beer next time just for that. Oh, and we're playing snooker this time. Sucka!
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eh? Good luck finding a snooker table in Vegas :-)

Lou Figueroa
beer weaseling
Canadians
 
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