Nice shot Rocket!

Vinnie

pool is cool.
Silver Member
I was watching the latest match on ProPoolVideo of Rodney Morris Vs. Helena Thornfeldt and right at 30:39 in the video, the rocket gets onto the wrong side of the 7 almost straight in. He then shoots a monster draw shot to get onto the 8 as diagrammed. I would have never seen that shot!

CueTable Help

 
"Circus shots" are cool and all, but I learn a lot more from watching someone like Shane, Mika, Thorsten, etc..

Always on the right side of the ball..... Simple runouts.....Oh yeahhhhhhhh!

Russ
 
Russ Chewning said:
"Circus shots" are cool and all, but I learn a lot more from watching someone like Shane, Mika, Thorsten, etc..

Always on the right side of the ball..... Simple runouts.....Oh yeahhhhhhhh!

Russ

Yeah, watching those guys I learn how I would like to play if I had the speed control to always get on the right side of the ball. Unfortunately, shots like this "circus shot" are much more likely to be necessary in one of my runouts than in one of theirs.

-Andrew
 
Andrew Manning said:
Yeah, watching those guys I learn how I would like to play if I had the speed control to always get on the right side of the ball. Unfortunately, shots like this "circus shot" are much more likely to be necessary in one of my runouts than in one of theirs.

-Andrew

Lol, touche.

But, have heart, speed control can be learned!

Some Accu-Stats matches are better for this than others. Billy and his co-commentator have gotten better about predicting "I would hit this one-rail speed, one and a half-rail speed, etc.."

I have noticed that on certain common shots such as a shot near a rail, it's more about developing the ability to hit the shot, and go exactly one rail + 6 inches. This comes up over and over and over, and as such, should be practiced heavily. If you get this this one speed of hit down, you might see your game jump a ball!

I think a lot of players do not realize that there really are something like 20-25 basic shot types in 9 ball, and that is all that is really needed. The "in-between" angles and speeds are totally unnecessary in most situations, and in fact, much harder to execute.

For years, I found myself trying to hit certain shot types off-speed, and as a result, I found myself out of line much more than necessary. When I started watching a crapload of professional matches, I realized that whereas I was selecting an "off" speed to try to control certain shots, the pros where hitting much firmer, and taking sometimes two or three natural rails to get to the same spot.

Russ
 
Russ Chewning said:
"Circus shots" are cool and all, but I learn a lot more from watching someone like Shane, Mika, Thorsten, etc..

Always on the right side of the ball..... Simple runouts.....Oh yeahhhhhhhh!

Russ


So what do you do when you end up on the wrong side of the ball? Quit? Rodney got bad position and had to move the ball a little more than he wanted to and he did it well, but the way you make it sound is that you can't learn from him because he missed position on this shot.
 
I can't see the shot, and can't access the video, being in Iraq, so I just assumed from his description that it was a circus shot, sorry.

And on the speed issue, I wasn't really talking about compensating for table changes.. I was talking more about having a baseline set of shots that you have the speed down cold on. When you take that baseline to a slower table, of course you should be able to hit the shot a little firmer and still get the same cue balls paths, etc.

I'm talking about the players who do things like cutting a thin cut up the rail slowly with only outside english, and attempting to come back across table and back to center table.

The proper way (IMHO) to hit that shot is to adjust the angle with more draw, rather than spinning it unecessarily. This allows for a much more consistent hit. And this method easily adjusts to most any table.

So what I was saying to Andrew is that players need to work more on identifying the most consistent stroke/english combination for certain common shots, and GET THAT DOWN COLD, and then, and ONLY then, work on the other ways of hitting the shot.

Example: Hitting a 45 degree cut shot into a corner pocket, and letting the ball travel around the table naturally, and getting the speed down COLD to get to any point on that position route.

Then, after this is done, when you have to "stretch" the natural path with a little outside english, you are much more consistent, because you have built your game off of natural paths.

I know we say this a lot, and it "seems" to be common knowledge, but I see a lot of players who favor certain inconsistent ways of doing things.. I.e., the person who "englishes in" cut shots. This throws off all aspects of the shot. English reacts differently on different tables, but a stun shot reacts virtually the same on every table, (assuming equal ball weights :D) at least until (on a slow table) the cloth friction puts forward roll on the CB.

Russ
 
Fart sniffer said:
So what do you do when you end up on the wrong side of the ball? Quit? Rodney got bad position and had to move the ball a little more than he wanted to and he did it well, but the way you make it sound is that you can't learn from him because he missed position on this shot.

No man, I'm not saying that at all.. I am just saying that I prefer to watch players that don't "juice" the ball so much

I don't think you can argue the point that Rodney uses his stroke to get around the table a LOT. Spins the ball a LOT. He's a TERRIFIC player. I just think he relies on his stroke more than some other players.
Russ
 
Russ Chewning said:
No man, I'm not saying that at all.. I am just saying that I prefer to watch players that don't "juice" the ball so much

I don't think you can argue the point that Rodney uses his stroke to get around the table a LOT. Spins the ball a LOT. He's a TERRIFIC player. I just think he relies on his stroke more than some other players.
Russ
I think we all like to see 'great escapes' by the pros. They have all the shots, otherwise they wouldn't be successful pros. I think Russ is talking about appreciating the efficiency (and success) of the apparently 'simple' approach most of the pros display in creating simple patterns based upon reliable cue ball positioning. Circus shots are fun to watch and hit. But I agree that watching and studying those pros that use a lot of natural routes is a good study guide. I know I get out of line all the time-and can't make 7 career shots every game. I lose alot.

A local sporty player once told me that 'every shot is the same'. Of course they are not. Did he mean - all shots should be approached with the same focus or possibly did he mean- hit them basically all the same speed - and allow where on the CB you hit dictate travel direction and pace and spin into rails to better predict where the cueball ends up. /this is probably not too clear-I guess I'm wondering if he mean't =just try to keep one variable constant.

No answers/just questions

3railkick
 
I was definitely caught by suprise with that shot. It was pretty, but looked like he was just having fun. I thought high inside was the way to go...for me at least. But hey, to each his own. :)
 
Russ Chewning said:
No man, I'm not saying that at all.. I am just saying that I prefer to watch players that don't "juice" the ball so much

I don't think you can argue the point that Rodney uses his stroke to get around the table a LOT. Spins the ball a LOT. He's a TERRIFIC player. I just think he relies on his stroke more than some other players.
Russ

You've got a valid point, Rodney's style on and off the table does have a certain amount of splash to it. Colorful players for a colorful game.
 
Sometime guys also do this type of shot to loosen up. Rodney was struggling the first half the match. He missed some very simple shots (given his level). I've been known to break behind the back if I'm in a slump mid-set. Perhaps this is the rationale.
 
StevenPWaldon said:
Sometime guys also do this type of shot to loosen up. Rodney was struggling the first half the match. He missed some very simple shots (given his level). I've been known to break behind the back if I'm in a slump mid-set. Perhaps this is the rationale.

Meh. I could have done that at one time. Nowadays, I'm too FAT to break behind my back.

Russ
 
Vinnie said:
I was watching the latest match on ProPoolVideo of Rodney Morris Vs. Helena Thornfeldt and right at 30:39 in the video, the rocket gets onto the wrong side of the 7 almost straight in. He then shoots a monster draw shot to get onto the 8 as diagrammed. I would have never seen that shot!

CueTable Help



circus shot is right... what ever happened to smart pool? he can attain almost same angle on the 8 with a little soft follow.. the resulting shot would be slightly longer... but very makable.. and you don't need to rely on the unpredictability of both backspin and spin off of a rail to get there.

he was showing off... plain and simple..
 
softshot said:
circus shot is right... what ever happened to smart pool? he can attain almost same angle on the 8 with a little soft follow.. the resulting shot would be slightly longer... but very makable.. and you don't need to rely on the unpredictability of both backspin and spin off of a rail to get there.

he was showing off... plain and simple..


It is possible that he was a little farther on the wrong side and I drew the diagram wrong. I like to learn about these shots because sometimes I mess up my position and sometimes my opponent misses and leaves tough position. I wonder if Rodney plays any 3-cushion because he seems to have a knack for precise routes around the table.
 
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