Non-Gambling Pool Players

garczar said:
In my neck of the woods, Midwest, bars were THE thing in the 70's thru the 90's. Only big table play was 1p and that didn't get big til later on. If you could play a lick bars were like having your own ATM machine.
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I was in central ca and there were loads of 1-2 table bars everywhere. Nobody could play

I liked big table pool much better.

But when I needed $ I went into the bars and did the “play for a beer and $5” thing and always got the money. If I lost I can’t recall , I’m sure I must have here and there. I was super careful not to get in a bad game-was a stone locksmith as I didn’t have $ to lose if I was downgraded to bar pool. ATM pool on small town bars!! Is spot on right.

Joe Villapondo and I did that together as well, he played much better than me. So we took all action and we didn’t lose either. Joe taught me a lot. And nobody could ever put him and I together we’d enter the bar at separate times/ that was fun and profitable. Joe moved and played better than me. I learned a lot.

In Vegas it was a different story. Not all ATM pool. I ran around with John Morton and he could really play. In Vegas I wasn’t the lock I was in central Ca, in Vegas there was plenty of bar players who I couldn’t beat. None John couldn’t beat. So again that worked out very well for me/ I leaned joe to pick my spots

All that’s a lost art now. Learning how to find ATM games. Which the better you play there more there was. I played good enough to find them when I needed to. But not everywhere like John Morton or Joe could as they played much stronger (only when necessary of course)

I wasn’t the best player, but I did learn how to move good in the pool world. That’s the part of pool I miss. Playing just good enough to win and keeping the customers happy.

Best
Fatboy 😃😃
 
Fatboy said:
and keeping the customers happy.
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That's key! Different places had customers with different entertainment budgets. The Mustard Seed II had a large Vietnamese contingency that loved to gamble. I was amazed and happy that they would always let me in the one and two ring games. Then I discovered the method. They took what I taught them to the hilltop in Tacoma, where the owner played at their level for $50 a game. Well with them. One of my students took me and introduced me but he was cautious with a foreign player such as myself. I couldn't get him off of 10 a game. 🤷‍♂️ Still a hundred dollar score and my sponsor enjoyed it so much he declined his cut.
 
Biloxi Boy said:
Do they exist?
What I am trying to determine is if a new breed is here. Are the new folks the same as the old? What can y'all tell me?
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We've always been here, you just don't hear that much about us. I remember, back when I was playing all the time and traveling all over the country, I was at Jamaica Joe's in OKC and was playing with Sean King. We were playing sets of 10 ball and I think I was running out about 60% of the racks we played and then we were talking and I remember making the statement, "I'm a nobody in the world of pool." He gave me a look of incredulity that I'll never foget. I then continued "Well, I don't gamble and I don't play any major tourneys".

Then he responded, "Yeah, that's true I guess".

Now I'm probably too old to do anything in pool, although I could probably still play at that level if I was practicing and competing as much as I used to. Another funny story from back around that time is that I was at MBC in Georgia practicing one night and Johnny Archer calls me over and says "Jaden, you practice more than anyone I've ever seen". I responded, "What about Shane?" and he said "True".

What I'm saying I guess is that there have always been great players that haven't gambled, you just usually hear about the big matchups and those playing for big money. Back when I had first started playing seriously I remember hearing about Johnny Archer matching up with Francisco Galindo at Gold Ball Billiards in San Bernardino and going over and watching. This was when Johnny was just getting known. You hear about the players that are matching up. At least that has been the case.

I think it's a good thing for pool that the better players are starting to not gamble that much. Pool may start to be seen as a more respectable sport and people won't limit their games trying to sand bag all the time. What we need to do is get rid of the fargo handicapped tournaments and force people to play better if they want to win. Instead of handicapping tournaments setup prize funds for rating levels, top 400 player, top 500 player etc. That way you're not discouraging lesser players from playing, but you are encouraging them to play better.

Jaden
 
Jaden said:
I think it's a good thing for pool that the better players are starting to not gamble that much. Pool may start to be seen as a more respectable sport and people won't limit their games trying to sand bag all the time. What we need to do is get rid of the fargo handicapped tournaments and force people to play better if they want to win. Instead of handicapping tournaments setup prize funds for rating levels, top 400 player, top 500 player etc. That way you're not discouraging lesser players from playing, but you are encouraging them to play better.

Jade
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I agree with that. I think a big part of pro’s gambling was trying to just pay the bills and still be a pro. As prize money rises and sponsors increase I expect to see less and less gambling coming from the pro’s . It just won’t be necessary.
 
W
vintagecollectibles831 said:
Pool players play for money, not for the thrill of it, and not because they are Gambling Addicts, but because it is good competition to play for something. The Pros play for money because it is their living, and again, I do not see it as Addictive Gambling, because they are not doing it for the thrill of it, or because they are addicts.
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We could always start a 12 step support group like PPA. Pool Players Anonymous.
Hi, I'm Mensa and I'm a pool player!!🤣🤣
 
gregcantrall said:
Okay I lied 🤷‍♂️.
When working at Fort McMurray refinery, with pool tables in the on site recreation room, I had a found a $20 game with an electrician. As a carpenter, electrician money was sweet to win. When I won the first game he pulled out a roll of hundreds. We were making big bucks on a turn around, 7 day 12 hour schedule. I showed him my roll of hundreds and told him, "I can match it but not break it. We can just keep score on the rail." All was good with him and we were set to go for at least a hundred dollar score. Then The Dummy showed up. He insisted that he had the next quarter and had the right to one just for fun. Grrrr, "okay fine." Was my reply as Canadian customs were foreign to me. 🤷‍♂️ Wouldn't you know the one game intermission gave the electrician time to go to the bar and break a bill. It also gave him a chance to observe my pool playing skill. He returned and paid the 20 and he was done. Grrrr sometimes playing for fun ain't really fun. Pluss a damn beer was 8 bucks! The up side was the overtime schedule for 6 weeks netted a half years pay for a typical carpenters wage in the USA.
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Oh yeah. We loved those guys!!! 😂
 
Fatboy said:
I was in central ca and there were loads of 1-2 table bars everywhere. Nobody could play

I liked big table pool much better.

But when I needed $ I went into the bars and did the “play for a beer and $5” thing and always got the money. If I lost I can’t recall , I’m sure I must have here and there. I was super careful not to get in a bad game-was a stone locksmith as I didn’t have $ to lose if I was downgraded to bar pool. ATM pool on small town bars!! Is spot on right.

Joe Villapondo and I did that together as well, he played much better than me. So we took all action and we didn’t lose either. Joe taught me a lot. And nobody could ever put him and I together we’d enter the bar at separate times/ that was fun and profitable. Joe moved and played better than me. I learned a lot.

In Vegas it was a different story. Not all ATM pool. I ran around with John Morton and he could really play. In Vegas I wasn’t the lock I was in central Ca, in Vegas there was plenty of bar players who I couldn’t beat. None John couldn’t beat. So again that worked out very well for me/ I leaned joe to pick my spots

All that’s a lost art now. Learning how to find ATM games. Which the better you play there more there was. I played good enough to find them when I needed to. But not everywhere like John Morton or Joe could as they played much stronger (only when necessary of course)

I wasn’t the best player, but I did learn how to move good in the pool world. That’s the part of pool I miss. Playing just good enough to win and keeping the customers happy.

Best
Fatboy 😃😃
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Well said.
 
Reading all of these stories reassures me that if I were transplanted back in time I would not fit in at all, like a college yuppie in the police force. I have trouble relating. None the less I am glad that I am able to add some positive value to the pool world today.
 
I want to pose this as delicately as possible lest I cause offense. Does the new breed actually have what it takes to gamble in the manner previously associated with pool, a la McCready and Roberts? It is one thing to have capacity and decline as opposed to decline when one lacks capacity.
 
Biloxi Boy said:
I want to pose this as delicately as possible lest I cause offense. Does the new breed actually have what it takes to have gamble at the level previously associated with pool? It is one thing to have capacity and decline as opposed to decline when one lacks capacity.
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Speaking for someone who doesn't gamble, I don't personally consider putting up $50 or $60 a couple times a month during the course of the night as much more than the cost of friendly entertainment. I am talking about people who play $300 or $500, or a couple grand per match as gambling.

For the former, I used to win more than half of the time when I played $20 per game in one pocket, and there are a few players/friends whom I can never beat and end up donating $100, though I have time to play them rarely. In rotation games, I am about 50% winning or losing. I've come into the money a few times in tournaments. People consider me an OK player, but not dedicated enough to be considered "good". I'd say 650 or high is considered good in my area. I am a bit better at billiards than pool now, maybe because I find it less stressful? Maybe I'd even feel more comfortable gambling with that instead.

The the latter, no. I would not be able to put up $500 on a game and handle the pressure of such a financial loss. I do not have that capacity. $500 is a month worth of food for myself and my wife, or the heating/electric bill, etc. I think the gain of $500 is irrelevant to the loss of $500, and I wouldn't be able to focus clearly.
 
gregcantrall said:
One of my students took me and introduced me
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Oh that place had character. The table looked like a battle field with the slate visible in a couple of craters. Multiple stains and hopefully none were blood. Loose spots on the rails.....and the antique cash register that rang the bell when the drawer opened. So guaranteed when I get to the 7 ball the till will be opened. You know well timed.
 
The point of gambling is that in almost all pool games there are two ways to win. Offensive or defensive.

For the money, you're going to play a lot more carefully. It doesn't mean you won't go for the run out but if you do it will be at the right time. which takes experience to know when that is.

For free it doesn't matter what you do. Sure maybe you play for pride but when a better player is playing a lesser player the better player gets bored knowing he can win all the time. And there is no loss because he has nothing to prove to the lesser player.

This is where giving up weight and handicaps come into play.

imo those who don't gamble are just scared. and that's okay. There are definitely people I won't play without the right weight given.
 
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