One of the craziest shots I have ever seen. What is the call?

sfleinen said:
juggler314:

I agree, unfortunately it is a foul :( (I always love to watch players shoot that from on top of the rail, so in "fun-sey" [non-action/non-tourney] games, the crowd I hang around with likes to rule that a legal shot, and force the player to shoot it where it lies.)

Last I remember, Amsterdam has Gold Crown IIIs, and this situation actually happens more often on GC-IIIs than one would think, due to the way the cushions join the rails. (I've seen the cue ball come to rest on that "flat spot" at the very top of the cushion where it joins the rail more often that I care to remember.) And also, it's common practice in the rooms I play in, to offer a courtesy when one is retrieving the cue ball from a scratch -- to place the cue ball on the cushion on this flat spot, so the opponent knows he/she has ball-in-hand (courtesy = when the player knows the opponent was distracted and wasn't looking when the cue ball scratched).

However, in the pic, that looks to me like a Valley bar-box, and these have a "pyramid" shape where the cushion joins the rail. WOW! That is a very rare situation indeed! It sounds from TheNewSharkster's description that the cue was spinning so fast so as to have a gyroscope effect, fixating it in one position where it came to rest on the rail, and the spinning "drilled" a minute depression deep enough to hold it there after the spinning subsided. Or something like that. In any respect, it's tough enough to place a cue ball by hand like that on a Valley, much less see that be the end result from the cue ball's movement on its own!

Nice pic!
-Sean
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Yes, it is a old Valley 8' barbox. I actually tried to balance a ball (by hand) near where it had landed and I wasn't able to unless it leaned against the wood part of the table and even that wasn't easy. I could have sworn when it had stopped the entire ball was on the felt though.

Its funny, when I try to recreate how this happened it makes no sense. If the ball has enough energy to bounce over the rail and it comes down on the rail the momentum should carry it off the table after a second bounce. The spin must have been what made this possible.
 
A rare moment indeed

TheNewSharkster said:
Yes, it is a old Valley 8' barbox. I actually tried to balance a ball (by hand) near where it had landed and I wasn't able to unless it leaned against the wood part of the table and even that wasn't easy. I could have sworn when it had stopped the entire ball was on the felt though.

Its funny, when I try to recreate how this happened it makes no sense. If the ball has enough energy to bounce over the rail and it comes down on the rail the momentum should carry it off the table after a second bounce. The spin must have been what made this possible.
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Yup, it sounds indeed like the tremendous spin on the cue ball "fixated" it there on the felt, and the spinning had put a deep enough depression (however minute it may look to the naked eye) for the cue ball to rest in after the spinning subsided. I don't think there's a way you can duplicate this by hand, unless you hold the cue ball on top of the cushion's felt by very lightly touching the tip of one finger on the top of the cue ball, and with the other hand try to spin the cue ball -- releasing the finger as soon as you "feel" that the cue ball has enough spin to hold it there on its own, and see what happens when the spin subsides.

There is a good video by trick-shot artist Jason Lynch ("The Michigan Kid") that shows the gyroscope effect of a fast-spinning ball, and in the comments below the video pane, Jason himself describes the phenomenon:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Fhr-0AARuAY

(If you go here and read the 7th comment down from the top, this is where Jason describes the spinning ball "settling" into position.)

In any case, you caught a rare moment on a Valley, that's for sure!

Nice job. :D
-Sean
 
TheNewSharkster said:
I break and the cue ball takes a short bounce like it is going off the table. It hits the rails and just stops. I look at it in disbelief and see it is spinning. It stops a few seconds later and it is balanced on the rail. I have played and seen thousands of games of pool and never once seen this happen.

I am sure the ruling is a foul but my opponent said I had to shoot it. I shot in the next ball from on top of the rail :D
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yeah it's my understanding that that's a foul. did you make the next shot?
 
happend to me once before. but instead of the rail it landed on the metal part of the pockets and stayed there. It was a brunswick medalist. Definately crazy
 
TheNewSharkster said:
I break and the cue ball takes a short bounce like it is going off the table. It hits the rails and just stops. I look at it in disbelief and see it is spinning. It stops a few seconds later and it is balanced on the rail. I have played and seen thousands of games of pool and never once seen this happen.

I am sure the ruling is a foul but my opponent said I had to shoot it. I shot in the next ball from on top of the rail :D
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FYI The shirt is a foul too :)

BVal
 
It's a foul if it 'comes to rest' on the rail...so to avoid the foul...you have to hit the cue ball while it's still spinning...
 
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