Opinions on flaws in a new cue?

gforces1911

gforces1911

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I wanted to gather some opinions on what is acceptable in a new custom cue in regard to flaws.

The cue was made for me- I chose the woods- colors etc. The cue was over 2k but under 2500. I consider myself more of a player than a collector. I would not know a glueline if I saw one.

The first flaw is where the leather wrap meets the buttplate. There is a small lip at one point that I can feel. It is pretty noticable. The lip does not go the entire way around

The second flaw is pretty big. I cannot disclose the entire scene or post a picture because the cuemaker would be identified from the design. Basically there are inlays in a ring above the wrap. There is a matching set below the wrap that is off center from the ring at C. Additionally- below the D ring there are veneered boxes and the inlay in the ring does not match up to the box. It appears that the D ring was offset. Basically, each ring has an inlay and the inlays do not match up for the C and D rings and then the windows in the buttplate area.

The third flaw involves different spacing between the windows. It is pretty minor so I won't get into it.

I must say that the hit of the cue is fantastic. Just great.

Do you think I should say something? I have had the cue for about 2 weeks now. It would seem that the wrap could be fixed, but the alignment issues are there to stay.
 
gforces1911 said:
Do you think I should say something? I have had the cue for about 2 weeks now. It would seem that the wrap could be fixed, but the alignment issues are there to stay.
Click to expand...

After 2 weeks of not hearing from you, your cuemaker is probably under the assumption that you are satisfied with the cue. Don't you think the best thing to do is to at least call and discuss it with him? People make mistakes. The only way they will improve on their work is by being aware of them
 
a chance to make it right

I agree the cue maker deserves a chance to make it right. if he is a reputable maker he will make every attempt to make it right.
 
i would CALL him and discuss your thoughts before posting about it.
posting doesnt do much good anyways without pics to show what you are referring to.

but again, i would get with the MAKER! :)
 
rings and windows not matching each other would be unacceptable to me. this may have passed long ago, but lining up is pretty standard fare today. if you check the cuemaker's other cues and find him to be consistant in lining up, but not on yours, then there is a problem,,,,,,to me. essentially, he was sloppy on your cue.

if the wrap bothers you at the grip, tell the cuemaker it's driving you nuts.

spacing between windows in unacceptable to me because it is almost impossible to screw up. i don't know exactly how a cuemaker's machinery works, but consider that he must surely be able to rotate the cue at 360 one degree increments, therefore creating say,,,,6 windows means dividing his 360 clicks into six 60 degree spacings. how does a cuemaker f*ck that up!!!!!????? the only explanation i can think of is he made bad errors when he routed out the windows(or whatever they do). if you can notice bad spacing on cursory inspection, i think that is a VERY bad mistake on the maker's part.

if this guy is "eyeballing" his work, then MAYBE i would cut him some slack?

what did you buy,,,,,,a schuler?
 
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We have cues from Custom cue makers that the wrap doesn't flow and you can feel a lip(I hate it when a cue doesn't flow from forearm to wrap and wrap to butt sleeve). If you paid over 2K that cue should be perfect you should call the cuemaker and give him a chance to make it right.
 
Thanks

Thanks for the replies. Plus, I know that without photos it is hard to make a call on it so thanks for the frank replies. I really did not know the etiquette in this situation. What was acceptable or not. I have to say that the cue plays great with the exception of the small lip issue. I was wondering about the standards that would be acceptable. But, if there are intricate designs in the inlays then they should probably line up etc.

I was thinking if that I was buying this cue from someone used that I would probably notice these things and would probably really think about them.

I am going to go ahead and contact the cuemaker. I have never done anything like that. I really don't haggle with them either just because I think that the money goes into the "billiard economy" and to support our artisans.
 
Definitely call and talk it over

You should definitely cal and talk it over with the cuemaker. Most cuemakers will fix any problems and/or give you a new cue. I bought a cue on ebay a couple of years ago and the points were way off so I called the cuemaker and he sent a new cue. I won't say what kind it was but it wasn't high end, I only padi $500 for it. It also depends on the cuemaker, I know for a fact that Joel Hercek would not knowingly let a cue out with any flaws in it. There are others that specifically state this as well, look at Searings website (although it is only a couple of statements).. He definitely wants you to be happy. Just my 2 cents.
 
The issues with your cue sound like issues that a newer cuemaker building sub $1000 cue should have, not somebody who charges $2000+. I would definitely have a problem with this cue if I ordered/purchased it from a popular cuemaker. If I was purchasing it from a relative newcomer, I wouldn't be paying that kind of money to start with.

Sean
 
Thanks

Thanks for the additional replies. I know for a fact that Searing wants you to be 100% pleased with a cue as he has a "no matter what" type of guarantee going out. I am on his list and hopefully I will pop up sometime in the future. Just to be clear, we are not dealing with a Searing cue here.

This cuemaker has been around for a long time and is not a new kid on the block.

I contacted the cuemaker of my cue via email and he said it is not his usual practice- the lip will wear away with time, and the inlays not lining up is not his ideal. Basically that people make mistakes and he hope that I will still enjoy the cue.

To be honest, I don't know of another resolution other than remaking it. It does seem like a waste of material- ivory etc. to have to remake it and to push it that far seems harsh. I think the alignment is something that is there- basically etched in stone so to speak. I will keep it and play on. I did wait a long time in ordering this one- years of thinking about it and thinking that I could not afford it.

In the end, it is not perfect but it is mine. Thanks for the posts- the other underlying question was for cue buying in general- are there such things as a flawless specimen or are they like diamonds where you try to get them with the least amount of flaws?

Seems that with the discerning buyers and sellers that we have nowadays that it would be tough not to find something wrong with a cue. A buddy had a high end cue made for a professional player the cue retailed for almost 3k. A second buddy of mine walks up and looks at the cue and says "there is a glueline right there." Go figure.
 
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gforces1911 said:
I contacted the cuemaker of my cue via email and he said it is not his usual practice- the lip will wear away with time, and the inlays not lining up is not his ideal. Basically that people make mistakes and he hope that I will still enjoy the cue.

To be honest, I don't know of another resolution other than remaking it. It does seem like a waste of material- ivory etc. to have to remake it and to push it that far seems harsh. I think the alignment is something that is there- basically etched in stone so to speak. I will keep it and play on. I did wait a long time in ordering this one- years of thinking about it and thinking that I could not afford it.

In the end, it is not perfect but it is mine. Thanks for the posts- the other underlying question was for cue buying in general- are there such things as a flawless specimen or are they like diamonds where you try to get them with the least amount of flaws?

Seems that with the discerning buyers and sellers that we have nowadays that it would be tough not to find something wrong with a cue. A buddy had a high end cue made for a professional player the cue retailed for almost 3k. A second buddy of mine walks up and looks at the cue and says "there is a glueline right there." Go figure.
Click to expand...

I hate it when a cue-maker sends out sloppy work in the hopes that a customer will overlook it. I've seen it too often. For sure he should re-do the wrap. If the alignment is really bad, something on the cue can be re-made I would think.

These flaws probably won't affect the re-sale of your cue. Most people wouldn't notice them. But, what will KILL the value of your cue eventually is if this cue maker continues to ruin his name.

I buy old hand-made cues and there are always little things about them, so I am not looking for perfection, but at least they were trying to do the best they could with what they had to work with. That's always something I respect.

Chris
 
What a nice fella you are. And the cue maker still hopes you enjoy it.
But it obviously bothers you...

Any pro can make a mistake (as they do) but it's how they deal with it
that makes a difference. Sounds like he just brushed you off politely,
not offering anything.

There's nothing wrong in mentioning his name is there??

I sure would like to know.
 
gforces1911 said:
This cuemaker has been around for a long time and is not a new kid on the block.

I contacted the cuemaker of my cue via email and he said it is not his usual practice- the lip will wear away with time, and the inlays not lining up is not his ideal. Basically that people make mistakes and he hope that I will still enjoy the cue.
Click to expand...

Sloppy work followed up by 'sorry but shit happens'. Totally unacceptable. I find it hard to believe that this is a long time well respected custom cue maker. That cue should have never made it out of the shop in that condition.
 
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gforces1911 said:
Thanks for the additional replies. I know for a fact that Searing wants you to be 100% pleased with a cue as he has a "no matter what" type of guarantee going out. I am on his list and hopefully I will pop up sometime in the future. Just to be clear, we are not dealing with a Searing cue here.

This cuemaker has been around for a long time and is not a new kid on the block.

I contacted the cuemaker of my cue via email and he said it is not his usual practice- the lip will wear away with time, and the inlays not lining up is not his ideal. Basically that people make mistakes and he hope that I will still enjoy the cue.

To be honest, I don't know of another resolution other than remaking it. It does seem like a waste of material- ivory etc. to have to remake it and to push it that far seems harsh. I think the alignment is something that is there- basically etched in stone so to speak. I will keep it and play on. I did wait a long time in ordering this one- years of thinking about it and thinking that I could not afford it.

In the end, it is not perfect but it is mine. Thanks for the posts- the other underlying question was for cue buying in general- are there such things as a flawless specimen or are they like diamonds where you try to get them with the least amount of flaws?

Seems that with the discerning buyers and sellers that we have nowadays that it would be tough not to find something wrong with a cue. A buddy had a high end cue made for a professional player the cue retailed for almost 3k. A second buddy of mine walks up and looks at the cue and says "there is a glueline right there." Go figure.
Click to expand...

Sheesh, the builder's taking advantage of you while not taking responsibility for his mistakes. I would contact him and tell him I'm not satisfied and would like the cue repaired, replaced or a full refund. This is normal business practice! If he declined again I'd contact my CC company for a refund.
If that wasn't possible, I'd contact the builder a final time giving him a few days to change his mind before I plastered pics of his work across the internet.
 
I agree I guess....

Fat Ivory said:
Sheesh, the builder's taking advantage of you while not taking responsibility for his mistakes. I would contact him and tell him I'm not satisfied and would like the cue repaired, replaced or a full refund. This is normal business practice! If he declined again I'd contact my CC company for a refund.
If that wasn't possible, I'd contact the builder a final time giving him a few days to change his mind before I plastered pics of his work across the internet.
Click to expand...

1.) I would give the builder the chance to correct.

2.) I think you errored by this posting before doing #1.

3.) I agree with the above posting quote, and the comments made.

4.) I have 1 or 2 cues built for me each year and YOU are the buyer. I have had some issues with the PREMIER cuemakers. It isnt as uncommon as some will lead you to believe.

5.) While this site likes cuemakers and immediately forgives their faults. I have dealt with cuemakers ego's (SOME ARE HUGE), and one on this site that bad mouths ALL except his own. But by and large most will do anything to make it right or at least make you satisfied.

If I can do anything to help or want to speak privately PM me.

Regards
Ken
 
Hi,
I am new to cue making, i just started this April.
I have found that none of my cues are perfect. There allways seems to be some minor imperfection. But as posted before minor is the key word here. I made a cue a few months ago that had d & e rings that did not line up with the reverse points and i just refuse to sell it. Every cue maker has to decide what quality of work is good enough to go out the door with his name on it.
It sound like he dosen't care about his name. If i were him i would do everything i could to make it right with you.
To fix the alignment problem is not easy. He would have to redo the butt sleeve section of the cue. If he used the same piece of wood to make the butt as he did for the forearm the new piece might not match the old forearm. The other option is to make you a new cue. I don't think someone selling $2000+ cues should have problems with aligning windows or rings. If so he souldn't be charging $2000.
Just my opinion,
Owen
 
gforces1911 said:
I wanted to gather some opinions on what is acceptable in a new custom cue in regard to flaws.

The cue was made for me- I chose the woods- colors etc. The cue was over 2k but under 2500. I consider myself more of a player than a collector. I would not know a glueline if I saw one.

The first flaw is where the leather wrap meets the buttplate. There is a small lip at one point that I can feel. It is pretty noticable. The lip does not go the entire way around

The second flaw is pretty big. I cannot disclose the entire scene or post a picture because the cuemaker would be identified from the design. Basically there are inlays in a ring above the wrap. There is a matching set below the wrap that is off center from the ring at C. Additionally- below the D ring there are veneered boxes and the inlay in the ring does not match up to the box. It appears that the D ring was offset. Basically, each ring has an inlay and the inlays do not match up for the C and D rings and then the windows in the buttplate area.

The third flaw involves different spacing between the windows. It is pretty minor so I won't get into it.

I must say that the hit of the cue is fantastic. Just great.

Do you think I should say something? I have had the cue for about 2 weeks now. It would seem that the wrap could be fixed, but the alignment issues are there to stay.
Click to expand...


I believe I read where you contacted the cuemaker, but he did not offer any reworking or refund? If you try further to express your desire to get the cue repaired or replaced with no luck, in my opinion you have more than full right to disclose who the maker is. $2000 is a lot of money in my opinion. Many cuemakers make great cues for much less money. If this person charges $2000 and sends out flawed work knowingly and does not put forth work to fix the situation for you, his potential customer base knowing that would either dip into his pocket seriously, or make him changes his practices.
Kelly
 
gforces1911 said:
Thanks for the additional replies. I know for a fact that Searing wants you to be 100% pleased with a cue as he has a "no matter what" type of guarantee going out. I am on his list and hopefully I will pop up sometime in the future. Just to be clear, we are not dealing with a Searing cue here.

This cuemaker has been around for a long time and is not a new kid on the block.

I contacted the cuemaker of my cue via email and he said it is not his usual practice- the lip will wear away with time, and the inlays not lining up is not his ideal. Basically that people make mistakes and he hope that I will still enjoy the cue.

To be honest, I don't know of another resolution other than remaking it. It does seem like a waste of material- ivory etc. to have to remake it and to push it that far seems harsh. I think the alignment is something that is there- basically etched in stone so to speak. I will keep it and play on. I did wait a long time in ordering this one- years of thinking about it and thinking that I could not afford it.

In the end, it is not perfect but it is mine. Thanks for the posts- the other underlying question was for cue buying in general- are there such things as a flawless specimen or are they like diamonds where you try to get them with the least amount of flaws?

Seems that with the discerning buyers and sellers that we have nowadays that it would be tough not to find something wrong with a cue. A buddy had a high end cue made for a professional player the cue retailed for almost 3k. A second buddy of mine walks up and looks at the cue and says "there is a glueline right there." Go figure.
Click to expand...

In my lifetime, I have yet to see a "flawless specimen". If it is man made it is not going to be perfect, just a fact of life. However, the condition(s) you have described would not be acceptable to the majority of buyers/players.

I seriously doubt the lip will "wear away with time", but it can be corrected by replacing the wrap and doing it properly.

As for alignment of the rings and/or inlays, there is only one way to correct that condition. Build another cue! Whether that seems harsh or not is not the issue at hand. You apparently received a lesser quality of workmanship than what you were entitled to.
 
gforces1911 said:
I wanted to gather some opinions on what is acceptable in a new custom cue in regard to flaws.

The cue was made for me- I chose the woods- colors etc. The cue was over 2k but under 2500. I consider myself more of a player than a collector. I would not know a glueline if I saw one.

The first flaw is where the leather wrap meets the buttplate. There is a small lip at one point that I can feel. It is pretty noticable. The lip does not go the entire way around

The second flaw is pretty big. I cannot disclose the entire scene or post a picture because the cuemaker would be identified from the design. Basically there are inlays in a ring above the wrap. There is a matching set below the wrap that is off center from the ring at C. Additionally- below the D ring there are veneered boxes and the inlay in the ring does not match up to the box. It appears that the D ring was offset. Basically, each ring has an inlay and the inlays do not match up for the C and D rings and then the windows in the buttplate area.

The third flaw involves different spacing between the windows. It is pretty minor so I won't get into it.

I must say that the hit of the cue is fantastic. Just great.

Do you think I should say something? I have had the cue for about 2 weeks now. It would seem that the wrap could be fixed, but the alignment issues are there to stay.
Click to expand...
I have a good friend who ordered a new cue from a well known cue maker a few years ago and when he received his new cue it was terrible. My friend contacted the cue maker about returning the cue and getting a refund and he refused to take the cue back and refund his money (the cue wasn't straight on top of the mistakes that were made in putting it together). He finally decided to contact the Better Business Bureau of the state that the cue maker lived in and he filed a complaint about the poor workmanship and the fact that the cue maker refused to give a refund. The Better Business Bureau contacted the cue maker about the problem and he finally reluctantly took the cue back and gave my friend a refund. I might add that he was quite upset about the Better Business Bureau getting involved and my friend told him that all he had to do was take the unacceptable cue back and they would have never known about the problem. This is an option that might help someone in the future and it definately got my friend out of his problem with a cue that should have been scraped and never sold to anyone!

SCCues
 
gforces1911 said:
This cuemaker has been around for a long time and is not a new kid on the block.

I contacted the cuemaker of my cue via email and he said it is not his usual practice- the lip will wear away with time, and the inlays not lining up is not his ideal. Basically that people make mistakes and he hope that I will still enjoy the cue.
Click to expand...
you waited 2 weeks and then you emailed??? he probably doesnt understand the way you feel about the cue. CALL him on the telephone!!!
if he gives you the same reply then - posts some pics and let us know who it is so we will know his business practices.
 
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