I think they should have spilt the money and played one game to be the winner
Oscar Dominguez and Amar Kang split
- Thread starter Roger Long
- Start date
The only format that makes sense for tv is reality tv and that doesn't require good players just good characters. That could potentially stir something up...
A lot of people get good at a lot of different things that won't make them much of a living. Pool is no different. The game can only grown from the bottom up, not the other way around. Sadly too much greed and too little structure to actually make anything but spinning wheels happen.
There are two quotes from The Color of Money that come to mind on this topic. A lot of people hang their hat on “If you've got an area of excellence - you're good at something; you're the best at something; Anything; Then, rich can be arranged. I mean rich can come fairly easy.” I think that stuck in a lot of peoples heads but it's just not the case. In stead, remember this: "Pool excellence is not about excellent pool. It's about becoming someone."
Lucky for pool, a few reality tv shows are in the works.
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It's because there was history and bad blood. Rivalry games are primetime for a reason.
I guess I'll never agree with this mindset.
I few years back I sat down and watched some of the Mosconi Cup with my brother, who doesn't play pool other than just casually. This is when it was aired by Fox.
He really enjoyed it and mentioned how he had never seen pool like that before on TV.
So while I think it's obvious pool will never compete with the major sports, I still think that there's a potential market for pool if it's produced well.
As far as splitting a regional tournament is concerned -- who cares really? I could easily rail against it, only to find myself in the same predicament in some small time local tourney. Then what would I do? I would probably split.
I don't think changing the format of the game is going to create a market for tv. The game needs a legitimate tour with intriguing plot lines such including a season ending championship points type thing (think Nascar), profiling the players, excellent commentary, etc. etc. etc.
It needs to be polished and marketed with the human angle thrown in. If people can watch golf then they certainly can watch pool. It just needs drama which it has but needs to be exploited. Snooker in England has created such a demand. It's in the presentation. I hate to watch soccer but did watch the last World Cup figured out a few rules and some of the nuances of the game and enjoyed it. Pool is a game/sport that anyone can play which could be it's competitive advantage over other sports.
It needs to be polished and marketed with the human angle thrown in. If people can watch golf then they certainly can watch pool. It just needs drama which it has but needs to be exploited. Snooker in England has created such a demand. It's in the presentation. I hate to watch soccer but did watch the last World Cup figured out a few rules and some of the nuances of the game and enjoyed it. Pool is a game/sport that anyone can play which could be it's competitive advantage over other sports.
You're looking at it backwards. Nascar and golf had a market, it didn't need to be created. Networks weren't gambling on these sports, they saw the popularity and latched on. Meanwhile in pool, if a free stream hits 5,000 viewers at once, it's a massive success. Try selling ad space with those numbers...
This says alot: "It's not for fans to watch, it's for players to play.".
Where does the added money come from?
It's not unfair in that everyone is playing in the same format. Further, when the switch to single elimination is made the undefeated players each get a bye. That's their reward for having gone undefeated up to that point. I think that's sufficient motivation and reward.
Usually the double-to-single transition -- when it's used -- occurs much earlier in the tournament so you get two players out of a group of eight or maybe even four.
There are much better formats than full double elimination. Double-to-single is only one of them.
Nah, we are on the same page. Pool needs to create a legitimate tour supported by the industry. If the pool industry won't even support something that has tangible positive effect for the them then why would an outside sponsor even take a look. It's all about the ROI. It's why running pool tournaments is tough because how does the promoter make money?
Once you have this product (tour), then the marketing of it can create the demand. It's like what Bonus Ball was trying to do. It isn't easy, but pool was hugely popular at certain times in this country. It's a complex issue but it is a great game and I think it could be popular with the right branding. Will we ever get there? Not at this current time.
When pool is on TV it is nearly always single elimination. There's a reason for that.
Yep, time element. The point that I'm trying to make is that the reason pool isn't popular or on TV is in partial due to the presentation of the game. It has much deeper issues. Getting youth involved, etc, etc. It's been rehashed on AZ several times.
This is spot on, Cleary. And it bolsters my point. At least, the point I've been trying to make, but obviously not doing very well at it. We don't currently have a product that we can sell to advertisers. If we want to be successful, we need to create one.
Here's my personal interest: The Mezz West State Tour is scheduled to come to Bull Shooters in Phoenix in January. Bull Shooters is the pool room where my pro shop is located and as I am actively involved in almost every facet of pool/billiard operations there on a daily basis, I'm doing everything I can to help make the Mezz stop a good one, both for the sake of the tour, and for the sake of the room owner. The owner already knows that hosting tournaments is not a money maker, and is in fact a money loser, but he is willing to write it off as an advertising expense so long as he can get some decent advertising out of it. For my part, I'm busy writing pre-tournament promotional articles for our local billiard newspapers, and I'm also talking to our clientele personally and telling them how much they can learn if they will only come out and watch these super players play. I'm also going to try and get some background information on every player expected to play so that I can work up an event program to hand out to the spectators. Now if we can get a decent number to come out and spectate, we will consider the tournament a success regardless of the number in the tournament field. And if those spectators will go out and tell all their friends what a great experience they had by going to Bull Shooters on those days, that's where the pay-back on the advertising dollars will come from. But if we give them a presentation that gets drawn out to the wee hours of the morning with no clear-cut winner; the next tournament we try to host will be a very, very hard sell.
We simply can't afford to build up people's interest and then let them down like that.
Roger
Trust me, I know what you're trying to say I just think you and others are missing the fact that pool has been tried and tried and tried and failed and failed and failed. It's boring to watch, even to those who enjoy pool! The splitting of a tournament or having a clear winner isn't the problem and isn't even part of the problem.
Although having nothing to do with pool on TV or the state of the game, one tournament format I really like is the partial repechage, where the entire B-side of the bracket is only playing for third (and lower) places. And what would normally be the hot seat match is actually the finals.
In this way, the winner is always undefeated but players who have a bad early match still have the ability to place high in the event. And those players who are dead money still get to experience 2 matches.
One other advantage is that the winner's (A) side of the brackets is kept independent of the B side. That is, you avoid having to keep the hot seat winner on ice while you wait for the B side to complete. Instead, you can keep the A side moving along without the typical delays that result from the larger number of B side matches.
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I also understand what you are saying but just disagree, no biggie. Look at the emergence of e-sports. IMO, golf, soccer, darts, snooker to name a few can be boring to watch. But, with the right plan and presentation, they have carved out a nice niche in the sports landscape.
So what do we do? Give up?
I've already talked to the owner of Bull Shooters about splits, and he has a BIG problem with them. And he's one of the guys who is helping to fuel the tour. Without the rooms, there would be no tour.
Roger
Give up what?
Give up this dream that pro pool players will be famous athletes... sure. That might be a good idea. Give up thinking pro pool players should make several hundred thousand dollars or even millions. Yea, i'd stop dreaming about that.
But give up growing the game? No. Give up enjoying the game? No. Give up caring about the game? No. Things are what they are and with how things are structured, nothing will change any time soon. If everyone came together to work together as one, we could see progress one day but that just won't happen.
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Pool players would take a bathroom break and stall when they are up 1 to 0...pretty exciting.
They split the Hopkins 9 ball event last year. They split the straight pool a few years back at SBE. I wouldn't pay splitters if it was my event. Should not be left to the players to decide. Put it right in the rules that splitting is not allowed. If they want to split in the parking lot so be it. If they want to play a 20 minute set and concede to one another fine.