Overreacting?
- Thread starter CreeDo
- Start date
while we are on the subject of overreacting..... I'm in a tournement match last night and I have to play a guy that does not speak english... ok... whatever... his friend tells me this and I reply before the match even starts "thats fine with me as long as he knows the rules I dont care if he does not speak at all. but I dont want you to tell him what to do either."
I say this because I already know whats going to happen based on past experiences, the language barrier gets played upon because they know you dont understand them. anyways I push out after the break and he does not know what that means so he asks his friend. the friend asks me if he can explain and i'm fine with that as long as he dosent coach him.
so what happens? after about a minute of discussion my opponent says to me in perfect english "go ahead and shoot" so now im a little pissed because if he did not even know what a push was in the first place how would he know to give it back?
don't get me wrong i'm all about being fair but I paid my entry fee just like everyone else and i'm "in it to win it" so I got a little miffed that the discussion in thier language took a minute or so which seemed longer than it should have to be explained.
this is for money right? so I complained to the tournement director that I felt he was "coached" and that I did not want them talking to each other during the match. he obliged me and told them not to talk during the match. that lasted about 10 minutes then they started to talk again between innings at the table.
I also notice that his shot selection and manner of play is different than when we first started our match and now he is firing at the 9 ball all the time which results in three 9 ball combos. but thats just part of the game right. anyway I lose the match 8-6 (had to give three on the wire race to eight to start).
I'm not mad that I lost the match I'm mad about them taking advantage of the language barrier. so who is the worse offender here? was I overreacting to the coaching of the shots between innings and a bad sport? or were they the bad sports taking advantage of the language barrier? would love to get some feedback from the az'ers
I say this because I already know whats going to happen based on past experiences, the language barrier gets played upon because they know you dont understand them. anyways I push out after the break and he does not know what that means so he asks his friend. the friend asks me if he can explain and i'm fine with that as long as he dosent coach him.
so what happens? after about a minute of discussion my opponent says to me in perfect english "go ahead and shoot" so now im a little pissed because if he did not even know what a push was in the first place how would he know to give it back?
don't get me wrong i'm all about being fair but I paid my entry fee just like everyone else and i'm "in it to win it" so I got a little miffed that the discussion in thier language took a minute or so which seemed longer than it should have to be explained.
this is for money right? so I complained to the tournement director that I felt he was "coached" and that I did not want them talking to each other during the match. he obliged me and told them not to talk during the match. that lasted about 10 minutes then they started to talk again between innings at the table.
I also notice that his shot selection and manner of play is different than when we first started our match and now he is firing at the 9 ball all the time which results in three 9 ball combos. but thats just part of the game right. anyway I lose the match 8-6 (had to give three on the wire race to eight to start).
I'm not mad that I lost the match I'm mad about them taking advantage of the language barrier. so who is the worse offender here? was I overreacting to the coaching of the shots between innings and a bad sport? or were they the bad sports taking advantage of the language barrier? would love to get some feedback from the az'ers
The problem with some of the leagues (especially handicap leagues) is that players of lower caliber are mostly there for the social aspect. They can't shoot very well and never will. The only time that they play is league night. They think that the only reason some players are better is because they get lucky with the rolls, get easier shots, get lucky making some shots and have a better cue stick.
There are a couple of younger players on our team that always bring in a entourage of friends. They get very loud and have no pool etiquette at all. There have been many nights that I have asked them to keep it down when I was shooting. They don't get upset and will apologize because they don't realize how loud they were getting.
I have found that an angry hostile shout out usually results in a challenge because they feel that they are being "dissed".
There are a couple of younger players on our team that always bring in a entourage of friends. They get very loud and have no pool etiquette at all. There have been many nights that I have asked them to keep it down when I was shooting. They don't get upset and will apologize because they don't realize how loud they were getting.
I have found that an angry hostile shout out usually results in a challenge because they feel that they are being "dissed".
I've been wanting to get an Ipod, but money has been tight. Last night during a tourney I was playing in, I used ear plugs because the pool room I was playing in had a basketball game on the TV with the volume at 11 (spinal tap) and also some crazy guy in the corner was yelling at some dude who didn't speak english about being coached on a push-out (oiled)....so I popped in the ear plugs and played some of the best pool I have played in a couple of years. Ended up splitting 1st and 2nd place money, while giving up some pretty healthy spots.tigerseye said:
lol@farley
I personally can't do the ipod thing. I like some music but mostly I prefer not to have it while I shoot. I think it might distract me and bring my game down a little. Maybe it's the style of music I like. I also hate earbuds and find most headphones to be uncomfortable. The only ones I liked were the giant kind that wrap around your ears but I'll be damned if I'm gonna shoot with those in public =)
I think I will just have to learn to tune out the mild stuff and politely hint at the bad stuff. I can always start dropping Fbombs later if hinting isn't working.
Re: coaching experience and foreign language -
My feeling is that coaching is a very very mild offense, even if it can have an impact on the outcome... and on top of that, you can't say beyond all doubt that coaching happened without speaking the language. You could just be paranoid. You said he told you to go ahead after a minute of discussion. I would assume that discussion is when he learned how push outs worked. It doesn't necessarily mean he got advice on whether or not giving it back is the right play.
Maybe I'm the wrong guy to comment on it because I don't really care so much about coaching. If a guy beats me because he got talked out of playing the wrong shot, then I don't feel mad. I can't count on the other guy being dumb to win, I know I must beat him on pure shooting. He still has to execute properly even if he knows the right play.
You lost because a lesser player got some rolls and make-able combos, not because he got wise, useful advice to go firing at every early nine he sees. If anything that's shitty advice. And even then he only won with the spot. If you played that guy 50 times with the same spot I'd bet you're winning at least 40 of them (and 48 of them if there's no spot).
Curse your bad luck and get him next time.
I personally can't do the ipod thing. I like some music but mostly I prefer not to have it while I shoot. I think it might distract me and bring my game down a little. Maybe it's the style of music I like. I also hate earbuds and find most headphones to be uncomfortable. The only ones I liked were the giant kind that wrap around your ears but I'll be damned if I'm gonna shoot with those in public =)
I think I will just have to learn to tune out the mild stuff and politely hint at the bad stuff. I can always start dropping Fbombs later if hinting isn't working.
Re: coaching experience and foreign language -
My feeling is that coaching is a very very mild offense, even if it can have an impact on the outcome... and on top of that, you can't say beyond all doubt that coaching happened without speaking the language. You could just be paranoid. You said he told you to go ahead after a minute of discussion. I would assume that discussion is when he learned how push outs worked. It doesn't necessarily mean he got advice on whether or not giving it back is the right play.
Maybe I'm the wrong guy to comment on it because I don't really care so much about coaching. If a guy beats me because he got talked out of playing the wrong shot, then I don't feel mad. I can't count on the other guy being dumb to win, I know I must beat him on pure shooting. He still has to execute properly even if he knows the right play.
You lost because a lesser player got some rolls and make-able combos, not because he got wise, useful advice to go firing at every early nine he sees. If anything that's shitty advice. And even then he only won with the spot. If you played that guy 50 times with the same spot I'd bet you're winning at least 40 of them (and 48 of them if there's no spot).
Curse your bad luck and get him next time.
I would have said the same. As long as you know them They shouldnt give it a second thought. If you just say it to a couple of guys you dont know, then it may be overreacting a little bit but still cool to me. Im with you, Im more into the pool than the social part. when Im at a pool hall Im there for pool, Ill go to a good bar or restaurant with friends and Ill be social there.
Burns...your avatar makes me happy in my pants. Who the hell is that???!!
charlesufarley you probably know that OILED guy pretty well.... I know him too and he has a big mouth, a short fuse and is loud as hell even when he is just talking. I think he has TOURETTS/A.D.D./SYNDROME OF A DOWN. and he's a hyper SOB.....
all kidding aside I am good with the coaching thing in a league setting if its not abused, but in tournement play with money at stake it should not be tolerated, if a friend or other player wants to pep talk you to calm you down or get you to refocus I see nothing wrong with that, but discussing shot choices and strategy of play while the match is going on? I just feel its not cool.
I dont know maybe its my inexperience at regular tournement play but I feel there is a pool etiquette/sportsmanship that should be at work while a match is going on. If your just hanging with the guys "bangin some" then it don't matter its all in fun...but If I or any one of the players I regularly play with were watching a match in a tournement setting we would try to be as quiet and respectful to the players in the match that we could.
all kidding aside I am good with the coaching thing in a league setting if its not abused, but in tournement play with money at stake it should not be tolerated, if a friend or other player wants to pep talk you to calm you down or get you to refocus I see nothing wrong with that, but discussing shot choices and strategy of play while the match is going on? I just feel its not cool.
I dont know maybe its my inexperience at regular tournement play but I feel there is a pool etiquette/sportsmanship that should be at work while a match is going on. If your just hanging with the guys "bangin some" then it don't matter its all in fun...but If I or any one of the players I regularly play with were watching a match in a tournement setting we would try to be as quiet and respectful to the players in the match that we could.
CreeDo said:
But it's not. It is a social league where you are clearly in the minority and there are people there just to have a good time on one of their nights after work. They were talking 30% louder then what "you" would consider normal, not yelling, about sports, and you go off on them like that?
Keep being the same person you are and you wont get asked to play with them next year because they want to have fun and you acted like a jerk to them when they were just relaxing having a good time in what they see as a hobby, problem solved. Because you clearly cannot just relax and have a good time with them and they clearly cannot relax and just have a good time with you around, so what do you think is going to happen?
Celtic said:
eh, well, let's not be hasty here. I know I was rude but I wouldn't have said it if I felt it was fistfight material or would lead to ruined friendships. For the record I apologized to the guy from the other team and we shook and he said it was long forgotten.
I think you are jumping to conclusious about their character (if not my own). I shot with the teammate last year and the other guy I've been playing with for 10+ years. They're both more about the pool than the socializing, tho my comment might have made it sound like they weren't. Let's just say they're 60/40 pool vs socializing, and I wish it could be 90/10 =)
That's part of what makes it upsetting: it's coming from 2 guys who know better and are actual serious players, not two bangers who can't shoot anything but the breeze. Anyone who has played for decades should know pool etiquette inside and out, and teammates especially should be aware of the effect they have on each other's shooting.
Loud people on league night? NEVER! All kidding aside, this is a part of leagues. I don't think you were wrong, in fact congrats. But this won't be the last time, so you have to evaluate how to approach it with your team. I like to stand up off my shot and stare at the idiot(s) who's making the racket. If they don't notice, the person i'm playing does and they usually tell the morons to shut up. I then let them know i'd be happy to repay them when they're up. Some people don't get it, especially in leagues. Good luck!