Pro Pocket Size TOO Small for 9 Ball

[HawaiianEye]

99% of the people in the world don't play well enough to be requesting that pocket sizes be smaller.

If you can't regularly string racks together, you don't need to be playing on smaller pockets.

Normal pockets should be the standard for regular pool room tables.

 

[maha]

about time.

 

[straightline]

Same ole thing though. The room becomes an entity and maybe it survives on the merits of subcultures and camaraderie. Meanwhile,

Pickle Ball, Cornhole, Internet, and whatever else stands in the way of pool's golden age.

I don't think anybody's advocated eliminating buckets. The reverse on the other hand seems to be doing just that; curbing the competitive growth of the genre for the greater fun - ???? WTF?

 

[HawaiianEye]

Same ole thing though. The room becomes an entity and maybe it survives on the merits of subcultures and camaraderie. Meanwhile,

Pickle Ball, Cornhole, Internet, and whatever else stands in the way of pool's golden age.

I don't think anybody's advocated eliminating buckets. The reverse on the other hand seems to be doing just that; curbing the competitive growth of the genre for the greater fun - ???? WTF?

There aren't enough "good" players to keep a pool room open.

"Normal" players want to make balls and play socially, not struggle in a "pro" environment where they never make a ball.

 

[straightline]

There aren't enough "good" players to keep a pool room open.

"Normal" players want to make balls and play socially, not struggle in a "pro" environment where they never make a ball.

I get this. Still doesn't excuse the MFGers from sleeping on precision equipment. Where's the training facilities? You got Mr. Chamberlain selling large 3 digit numbers. That seems to be it.

 

[HawaiianEye]

I get this. Still doesn't excuse the MFGers from sleeping on precision equipment. Where's the training facilities? You got Mr. Chamberlain selling large 3 digit numbers. That seems to be it.

Who is going to fund a pool training facility?

If you think it is profitable, maybe you should be the first to open one and then start franchising them when you start making money.

Pool will never get a lot of interest or recognition until it is an Olympic event.

 

[straightline]

Who is going to fund a pool training facility?

If you think it is profitable, maybe you should be the first to open one and then start franchising them when you start making money.

Pool will never get a lot of interest or recognition until it is an Olympic event.

If, if, if...
I've long said pool is a bomb. I like pool enough to keep prodding it.

Does everything have to have giant returns?
Guys like maha whose opinion I respect; essentially they took their cut and the inflation that begat keeps tolling the genre.

 

[Frosty]

Same ole thing though. The room becomes an entity and maybe it survives on the merits of subcultures and camaraderie. Meanwhile,

Pickle Ball, Cornhole, Internet, and whatever else stands in the way of pool's golden age.

I don't think anybody's advocated eliminating buckets. The reverse on the other hand seems to be doing just that; curbing the competitive growth of the genre for the greater fun - ???? WTF?

The reason WHY Pickle Ball and Corn Hole thrive is BECAUSE the average idiot can easily become what’s considered good in those 2 newly fabricated games and they have FUN doing it as a result. It’s why most Americans that play pool nowadays play in leagues on Bar Boxes which led to the downfall of actual pool halls with 9’ tables, because it’s EASIER to play on a 7’ box and it’s fun. They don’t want to play on 9’ tables with 4 1/2” pockets, much less 4” pockets.

 

[straightline]

The reason WHY Pickle Ball and Corn Hole thrive is BECAUSE the average idiot can easily become what’s considered good in those 2 newly fabricated games and they have FUN doing it as a result. It’s why most Americans that play pool nowadays play in leagues on Bar Boxes which led to the downfall of actual pool halls with 9’ tables, because it’s EASIER to play on a 7’ box and it’s fun. They don’t want to play on 9’ tables with 4 1/2” pockets, much less 4” pockets.

All known and more. Even Emily figured 4" pockets are cooler or something.

 

[Island Drive]

(Large).... rooms have a little bit of everything.
After 6/7 yrs a real room becomes an eco system, and to be this it must have a huge selection of tables.
Smaller rooms work well.... a shotgun pool room with two or three rows of tables plus the bar/grille seating area paralleling it.
The back bar must have a glass wall, those seated at the bar won't have to turn around.

 

[SEB]

4 inches is too small. Been preaching this for years. Nobody wants to listen. Even Neils has talked about it.

It makes entire families of shots unplayable. There’s some shots that remain unaffected other than simply needing to be more precise but there are a boat load of shots that become simply unplayable. And because of this, it lends itself to favor a certain style of player while completely eliminating other types of players from even competing for titles. Slow rolling position play experts now have such an advantage over a power breaking shot maker. It’s as simple as that. Styles makes fights…and the small pockets have shackled the shot makers because even they can’t overcome the demands of the table. So what do we get from this? No differing styles…Just a bunch of soft hitting fundamental robots because there’s no incentive to play any other way.

you can’t cheat a pocket, you can’t force a ball, you can’t bank at most shots, hell…half the time you can’t even play for the side pockets anymore! Players are literally changing position routes to play for corners so they can hit pocket speed and use the new cloth to soft slide it in. The game is such a joke.

And the worst part about it is that if you don’t play a power game then you won’t be able to relate to anything I’m saying here because what you’re watching the pros do is just a more refined version of your push…push…push…stop shot…push style of game. If you have that Ralph Souquet style of play then it’s going to be hard for you to conceptualize that there is an entirely different way to see, process, and play the game. And as the years go by and more and more juniors are taught this soft play style, the more that the power play/run and gun style will just quietly disappear into obscurity. And no one will even notice because the in the future it will be baked into the cake. Meaning the pocket size will, over time, eliminate the need for the shot maker type player to even exist.

And also at some point we need to address the absurdity of playing on brand new cloth for each tournament. That also takes away a bunch of available shots and waters down the game further.

 

[Lowell]

4 inches is too small. Been preaching this for years. Nobody wants to listen. Even Neils has talked about it.

It makes entire families of shots unplayable. There’s some shots that remain unaffected other than simply needing to be more precise but there are a boat load of shots that become simply unplayable. And because of this, it lends itself to favor a certain style of player while completely eliminating other types of players from even competing for titles. Slow rolling position play experts now have such an advantage over a power breaking shot maker. It’s as simple as that. Styles makes fights…and the small pockets have shackled the shot makers because even they can’t overcome the demands of the table. So what do we get from this? No differing styles…Just a bunch of soft hitting fundamental robots because there’s no incentive to play any other way.

you can’t cheat a pocket, you can’t force a ball, you can’t bank at most shots, hell…half the time you can’t even play for the side pockets anymore! Players are literally changing position routes to play for corners so they can hit pocket speed and use the new cloth to soft slide it in. The game is such a joke.

And the worst part about it is that if you don’t play a power game then you won’t be able to relate to anything I’m saying here because what you’re watching the pros do is just a more refined version of your push…push…push…stop shot…push style of game. If you have that Ralph Souquet style of play then it’s going to be hard for you to conceptualize that there is an entirely different way to see, process, and play the game. And as the years go by and more and more juniors are taught this soft play style, the more that the power play/run and gun style will just quietly disappear into obscurity. And no one will even notice because the in the future it will be baked into the cake. Meaning the pocket size will, over time, eliminate the need for the shot maker type player to even exist.

And also at some point we need to address the absurdity of playing on brand new cloth for each tournament. That also takes away a bunch of available shots and waters down the game further.

The elite players are making all kinds of shots on those 4 inch pockets. Fedor Gorst ran 6s racks in a row not too long ago.

I do agree though, that the extremely fast cloth is unneeded.

 

[straightline]

The elite players are making all kinds of shots on those 4 inch pockets. Fedor Gorst ran 6s racks in a row not too long ago.

I do agree though, that the extremely fast cloth is unneeded.

Roots...
Gorst - pyramid

Filler - snooker

Generic Euro bunch - snooker

3rd world horde - snooker

^^^ That mob knows margins and tolerances.

The 4.5 crowd OTOH seems more concerned with what slops good. Well looky here! Seems pool is thriving and it's the slick American Larceny that's bombing.

Hmmm...

 

[Island Drive]

Roots...
Gorst - pyramid

Filler - snooker

Generic Euro bunch - snooker

3rd world horde - snooker

^^^ That mob knows margins and tolerances.

The 4.5 crowd OTOH seems more concerned with what slops good. Well looky here! Seems pool is thriving and it's the slick American Larceny that's bombing.

Hmmm...

Not being conflicting at all but I wonder if European home table standards are similar to here? Forgiving.

 

[straightline]

Not being conflicting at all but I wonder if European home table standards are similar to here? Forgiving.

Probably. People is people and funz is funz but

the argument here seems to be Murkin fun vs the state of international pool. That's kinda apples and oranges to me.

 

[skogstokig]

Roots...
Gorst - pyramid

Filler - snooker

Generic Euro bunch - snooker

3rd world horde - snooker

^^^ That mob knows margins and tolerances.

filler comes from american pool, as does 95% of euro pool players. some british players like melling, jayson and imran majid started out playing snooker. it's a predominantly british thing.

of the non-european bunch, it's mostly former colonies that play snooker. pakistan, india, hongkong, etc.. also countries like iran and thailand that was under british influence play snooker.

and despite the retarded snooker vs pool debate, successful snooker to pool converts in the men's game are few and far between. fraser patrick and stefan kaspar are two current ones that are having i guess decent results..

 

[straightline]

filler comes from american pool, as does 95% of euro pool players. some british players like melling, jayson and imran majid started out playing snooker. it's a predominantly british thing.

of the non-european bunch, it's mostly former colonies that play snooker. pakistan, india, hongkong, etc.. also countries like iran and thailand that was under british influence play snooker.

and despite the retarded snooker vs pool debate, successful snooker to pool converts in the men's game are few and far between. fraser patrick and stefan kaspar are two current ones that are having i guess decent results..

Filler said he started as a snooker wannabe before he tore up the pool juniors. The point is the marksmanship ethic is endemic to Euro and Asia pool.

 

[skogstokig]

Filler said he started as a snooker wannabe before he tore up the pool juniors. The point is the marksmanship ethic is endemic to Euro and Asia pool.

that was intention rather than any significant play. we were all watching eurosport snooker but playing pool.. at best it had influence on fundamentals

 

[straightline]

that was intention rather than any significant play. we were all watching eurosport snooker but playing pool.. at best it had influence on fundamentals

Which is what I'm saying. Tight pockets makes better pool shooters. Makes more consistent shooters, makes better players, ad infinitum.

Snooker pockets in and of themselves will get you accustomed to shooting with precision but they're are impossible for many regular pool shots; straight back banks for instance. Makes for a really dull game with no particular strategic wit required.

 

[skogstokig]

Which is what I'm saying. Tight pockets makes better pool shooters. Makes more consistent shooters, makes better players, ad infinitum.

majority of euro commercial rooms pool tables range from 4.5" to 5".. and shallower shelves than diamonds. more specialized clubs will have tighter equipment.

taiwan is probably the country that's had tight american pool tables the longest? or japan? just what i've heard.