Push Out

Biloxi Boy

Biloxi Boy

Man With A Golden Arm
I cut my 9 Ball teeth playing Push Out. Frankly, I liked the game and was disappointed as I watched it disappear. When I questioned the reason for the change, I was told that "TV demanded it" so that the game could be sped up. Of course, no one I played with was ever on TV. Also, TV has never treated pool properly. The older I get, the more certain I am that faster is not always better. Any thoughts?
 
Last edited:
have been thinking same thing for years. playing 9 ball old way had more strategy, fast way replaced the strategy with marginal if not idiotic rules. less interesting to play and watch.
 
it was much better for the non pro,s as each player got to play his own strategy game rather than just a game of running balls.

it made gambling at rotation games extinct for the most part and made one pocket supreme for gambling when pushout stopped.
 
when I started playing at the pool room on 85, pushout was the game. But as best I can recall express or Texas express came along about a year later-seems like about the time COM hit the movie theater. I’m not linking push & COM I think that was a coincidence.

The Reno tourney was express as far as I can recall, June 85 was the first time I went to that. We need to pull a Accustats video and verify.

My memory on this is a bit foggy, I just know it changed when I first started playing and some guys liked it, some didn’t. That I do remember. I didn’t play good enough at the time to really care-I just wanted to play.

Best
Fatboy
 
Go back to roll-out, ban the jump sticks and no handicaps. Winner breaks. You don't need a couple points on the wire, you need testicles larger than raisins. Dress appropriately means you can't wear your baggy shorts during the tournament, go barefoot and store your skateboard under the table.
 
Screenshot_20210806-112132__01.jpg
 
dquarasr said:
For those of us who don’t know, what was the “old way”? How does it differ from today’s game?
Click to expand...
Just do a search. Please. Its been covered a BUNCH on here. It was how 9b was designed to be played. Far better than TE which was invented to speed up tournaments. Had nothing to do with making a better game.
 
Biloxi Boy said:
I cut my 9 Ball teeth playing Push Out. Frankly, I liked the game and was disappointed as I watched it disappear. When I questioned the reason for the change, I was told that "TV demanded it" so that the game could be sped up. Of course, no one I played with was ever on TV. Also, TV has never treated pool properly. The older I get, the more certain I am that faster is not always better. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Debated here, HOTLY, many, many times. A lot of people today have never even seen the game played that way and have absolutely no understanding of it. I'm in favor of the old way, hence, my screen name here.
 
I enjoy both games, and rather play TE, although I think push out is easier to learn for new players (eg, kids). A 10 year old isn't going to be able to run many balls or make difficult shots (including safeties), so he or she in TE will often resort to banging and hoping something goes in. That's fun when riding the nine works, but it's rare and eventually leads to frustration.

In push out, that 10 year old can at least think "I can't make this so I should push the ball down table for a shot I might be able to make" which leads to more fun and a better understanding of Billiards.
 
kling&allen said:
I enjoy both games, and rather play TE, although I think push out is easier to learn for new players (eg, kids). A 10 year old isn't going to be able to run many balls or make difficult shots (including safeties), so he or she in TE will often resort to banging and hoping something goes in. That's fun when riding the nine works, but it's rare and eventually leads to frustration.

In push out, that 10 year old can at least think "I can't make this so I should push the ball down table for a shot I might be able to make" which leads to more fun and a better understanding of Billiards.
Click to expand...
Anecdotal! Lol. That is a fine use of the push.

Claiming the push should exist as an option for competitive gameplay is weak and ignores one of the cornerstones of pool.: Your shot- shoot it.
 
Black-Balled said:
Anecdotal! Lol. That is a fine use of the push.

Claiming the push should exist as an option for competitive gameplay is weak and ignores one of the cornerstones of pool.: Your shot- shoot it.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, I don't think there have been peer reviewed studies on this topic. I personally prefer express as I noted, but the push gives another option for new players to think about if they have no chance for a legal shot.

Keith McCready talked about the rise of express and the impact on pool (and his game) on the pool player podcast. I don't have a link handy but it was a good listen. I think CJ has a video somewhere as well talking about the differences in strategy.
 
kling&allen said:
Fair enough, I don't think there have been peer reviewed studies on this topic. I personally prefer express as I noted, but the push gives another option for new players to think about if they have no chance for a legal shot.

Keith McCready talked about the rise of express and the impact on pool (and his game) on the pool player podcast. I don't have a link handy but it was a good listen. I think CJ has a video somewhere as well talking about the differences in strategy.
Click to expand...
I don't expect either kmc or cj to be wholly objective on the matter, good grief.

Of course there is a different set of 'moves'...much like using a gas motor for a bike race.
 
There were several major variations even of pushout. Any two fouls or two fouls by one player to get ball in hand was a big difference.

Earl's ability to jump with a full cue helped make him. When he needed to push out, he often pushed out to a jump. He could make it, the other player couldn't, so they were usually had either way! Naturally he objected to jump cues, they largely offset his advantage.

I think they should bring pushout back along with TE. There is room for both games.

Hu
 
There were two ways to play push-out….any two fouls…two fouls by the same player
I would only play…two fouls by the same player.
 
garczar said:
Just do a search. Please. Its been covered a BUNCH on here. It was how 9b was designed to be played. Far better than TE which was invented to speed up tournaments. Had nothing to do with making a better game.
Click to expand...
I was going to do a search, but I figured "Push Out" would return an unmanageable amount of hits. I don't know what I'd ask for to narrow the search down. That said, I will try it. . . . .
 
dquarasr said:
I was going to do a search, but I figured "Push Out" would return an unmanageable amount of hits. I don't know what I'd ask for to narrow the search down. That said, I will try it. . . . .
Click to expand...

CJ Wiley discusses 2-foul 9 ball (aka roll-out or push out)

A lot of folks on here seem to have never heard of 2-foul 9 ball every time it comes up. In the below video CJ Wiley gives a pretty good run-down on what made it special compared to the express version we play today. Sent from my iPad using...
forums.azbilliards.com
 
Playing push out during the 70's we played any two fouls resulted in ball in hand. Meaning I push out and my opponent gives the shot back to me or he decides to make a try at the shot, the first push is 1 foul and then on the next shot any foul by a player gives the ball in hand to his opponent. Now here is a bigger thing, if a player scratches and that is only the first foul the cue ball is shot from the kitchen and if the object ball
is behind the line , that ball is spotted up. If that is the case the player that has the cueball behind the line and can demand the player that scratched shoot the shot, or he can shoot the shot himself. I played this way where ever I went through the south during the 70's and early 80's. We didn't kick at balls when gambling for our money. When playing tournaments in everything was one shot foul, but when it came to playing for the cash , it was all two shot foul. The one shot foul rules really did away with the spot shot when playing 9 ball and I always thought that was a bad thing. Used to practice spot shots for quite awhile working different ways to move the cue ball after making the object ball. There was a reason that Toby Sweet and others players of his caliber would only play this way, it took a lot of the luck factor out of the game. My two cents issued.
 
Chip Roberson said:
Playing push out ...others players of his caliber would only play this way, it took a lot of the luck factor out of the game. My two cents issued.
Click to expand...
That's not the only consequence...and the 'better' players have been noted as attempting to gain any advantage they could over opponents so their sense of right carries little weight, imo.

As noted elsewhere, "players" hypocritically complained about being ratted out by the rail when they're trying to sneak in, yet they had the little black book of action
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top