Another good post. :thumbup2:
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Question about intentional swerve
- Thread starter bdorman
- Start date
Another good post. :thumbup2:
That's 3 good ones ...You're Out! :thumbup2:
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The part you always seem to ignore is that no one is trying to change how the pros play AT ALL! What I, and others, are trying to do is get correct information out to those that want to learn. Not be fed myths that will only hold people back.
There is a BIG difference there that some seem to always want to overlook.
Who on here is aspiring to be a pro anyways? The people that actually read on here that actually want to get better want just that, just to get better. To reach a B or an A status. Even to be a shortstop is pretty much out of the question for 99% of the people on here because they just don't have the time to put in.
Some of the better players keep looking for that "magic pill" that the pros have that they don't have. Well, there isn't one outside of time put in and headwork. Mainly headwork. Rarely will you see the pros even attempt any shot that any A player can't make with regularity.
The only thing that separates the pros from those just below them is consistency. And, if one doesn't have that "naturally", it has to come from hard work on the things that promote consistency.
I keep ignoring what? Where did I say people are trying to change the way they play? That would be fine IMO, they're all big guys and gals who can take what is said to them to heart or choose to ignore it.
What I find offensive is the attempt by some to play on their egos by setting them up and then calling them out, folks trying to make them look stupid to compensate for their own lack of self-worth in the pool world by looking like a hot shot with a bit of knowledge that probably isn't gonna help anybody play better anyway. Do you really think somebody pounding me on the head over and over that the reason I can't draw the ball is because I'm not hitting it low enough is gonna help me actually hit it there?
I'm a science guy, have been since I was a kid. I eat this stuff up like candy. But sometimes it seems more like a religion than anything else, and doing anything that appears to violate the sacred principles of billiards is a mortal sin.
Just hit the effen ball. Pay attention to how you hit it and where you hit it. Did the object ball go where you wanted it to go? Did the cue ball end up where you thought it shoułd end up? If so, keep doing it that way. If not, try something a little different until you get it right. Rinse and repeat, over and over and over again. I'll bet you make a lot more progress doing that than reading a thousand AZ threads will do for you.
This is pretty much what I see this forum turning into. We've accepted the mindset that most pros have no real idea what it takes to play this game from an academic standpoint. And by default, they fill our simple minds with "mythical, magical" nonsense.
There are few pros that post here, anymore. It's not because they're too busy, it's because a handful of posters question every detail of their posting. They lurk and pounce at every opportunity and tag team them because they're trying to protect the average poster from..."mythical, magical" information.
If a poster responds, they're labeled a nut hugger and forever banished from intelligent discussion with the "knowledge guys". I've talked with a pro friend, author, magazine contributor, who knows many other pros. I asked them to start posting and they literally laughed at me because of all the "know it all" posters.
We need the science, every sport does. What we don't need is the handful of petty, self aggrandizing trolls who attack everybody who dares raise an issue with their omniscience. You want to contribute to the knowledge base, EXCELLENT! Like Sloppy says, quit beating people over the head and parroting a bunch of stuff from Dr.Dave's site (kudos to Dave
). We don't need to be saved from certain insanity by listening to top players. Stay out of their threads unless you're in the discussion and don't pop in and set everybody straight. You're actually negatively affecting the growth of knowledge and the possibility of members learning when you disrupt the threads.
Like I said, just a handful and we all know who you are. 50,000 members and 10-15 posters are in charge of who says what in these threads.
Step up and be counted.Best,
Mike
This is pretty much what I see this forum turning into. We've accepted the mindset that most pros have no real idea what it takes to play this game from an academic standpoint. And by default, they fill our simple minds with "mythical, magical" nonsense.
There are few pros that post here, anymore. It's not because they're too busy, it's because a handful of posters question every detail of their posting. They lurk and pounce at every opportunity and tag team them because they're trying to protect the average poster from..."mythical, magical" information.
If a poster responds, they're labeled a nut hugger and forever banished from intelligent discussion with the "knowledge guys". I've talked with a pro friend, author, magazine contributor, who knows many other pros. I asked them to start posting and they literally laughed at me because of all the "know it all" posters.
We need the science, every sport does. What we don't need is the handful of petty, self aggrandizing trolls who attack everybody who dares raise an issue with their omniscience. You want to contribute to the knowledge base, EXCELLENT! Like Sloppy says, quit beating people over the head and parroting a bunch of stuff from Dr.Dave's site (kudos to Dave
We don't need to be saved from certain insanity by listening to top players. Stay out of their threads unless you're in the discussion and don't pop in and set everybody straight. You're actually negatively affecting the growth of knowledge and the possibility of members learning when you disrupt the threads.
Like I said, just a handful and we all know who you are. 50,000 members and 10-15 posters are in charge of who says what in these threads.
Best,
Mike
So, the only opinions that count are the ones you agree with. Figures. You attack every chance you get. Also, start realizes that they aren't "their" threads. They are on a public forum. The only ones negatively affecting knowledge are guys like you that have to attack every bit of knowledge on here that doesn't come from a pro. And, yes, we all know you want to be in charge of what is said on here. You remind us all the time.
So, the only opinions that count are the ones you agree with. Figures. You attack every chance you get. Also, start realizes that they aren't "their" threads. They are on a public forum. The only ones negatively affecting knowledge are guys like you that have to attack every bit of knowledge on here that doesn't come from a pro. And, yes, we all know you want to be in charge of what is said on here. You remind us all the time.
Nice spin. Why does everyone of your posts contain the words magical or mystical when you refer to somebody else's opinion? Remember the CTE wars when other posters used the words in addressing your pro-pivot systems stance and you were quick to try to correct them to no avail? You've switched places and taken on their persona. You are now the one calling other posters clueless. How does it feel?
I don't attack, I actually defend and try to be complimentary when it's due. You oversee the info, bully and condemn without letting a discussion have a chance to run its course. You've accused me more than once of reporting your negative posting. Ask the mods, not once. Ever. Unlike you, who reports people frequently. Am I wrong?
I want no one to be in charge except who pays the bills here. We don't need to do anything more than converse, let people have an opinion and if different than ours, let it be. You're not Bob Jewett or Dr. Dave. We can find their information if we need to find it. Why don't you post a thread once in a while with a fresh idea of your own instead of being the geek police in every thread? Change can be good. Try it.
Best,
Mike
you're right, it is humorous at best
I'm glad you received everything okay....and you're right, it is humorous at best.
I'm glad you received everything okay....and you're right, it is humorous at best.
Mike, you are the one that just can't deal with facts. I post on things that actually work in the real world. I don't change stances dependent on who posts like you and others do. I have only reported a handful of posts in the years I have been on here, unlike your little group that reports just about every post I make on here.
If you don't want anyone to be in charge, then stop following me around and blasting me everytime I post factual information on here. As far as starting threads on here, maybe you should do a little research before you make stuff up.
Oh, if we want a pros take on things, we can simply buy their DVD's. If the pros would act decent on here, instead of just spamming their adds, like John S. and John B. do, they wouldn't have a problem with people. The only reason more pros don't post is because their egos can't handle any one disagreeing with them at all.
The reason I do link to Dr. Dave at times is to show the actual truth from someone besides myself. I'm interested in the truth, and I realize that some may not believe me but will believe it from a tested source with videos to back up my statements. I could just as easily make a bunch of videos myself, but see no need to re-invent the wheel when there is a perfectly good wheel already in use. That is unlike some on here that like to state things with nothing to back up what they say. And way to often, what they say is pure nonsense.
Admit it Mike, you don't care about getting better, you just want to hang out with people that you think are better than you. It gives you some sense of worth for whatever reason. And anytime someone says anything that disagrees with what they say, you take as a personal affront to yourself because you are living your life through them.
Why is it humorous that some would hope that you would change your wording on something when everyone knows what you said is wrong?
This is pretty much what I see this forum turning into. We've accepted the mindset that most pros have no real idea what it takes to play this game from an academic standpoint. And by default, they fill our simple minds with "mythical, magical" nonsense.
There are few pros that post here, anymore. It's not because they're too busy, it's because a handful of posters question every detail of their posting. They lurk and pounce at every opportunity and tag team them because they're trying to protect the average poster from..."mythical, magical" information.
If a poster responds, they're labeled a nut hugger and forever banished from intelligent discussion with the "knowledge guys". I've talked with a pro friend, author, magazine contributor, who knows many other pros. I asked them to start posting and they literally laughed at me because of all the "know it all" posters.
We need the science, every sport does. What we don't need is the handful of petty, self aggrandizing trolls who attack everybody who dares raise an issue with their omniscience. You want to contribute to the knowledge base, EXCELLENT! Like Sloppy says, quit beating people over the head and parroting a bunch of stuff from Dr.Dave's site (kudos to Dave
We don't need to be saved from certain insanity by listening to top players. Stay out of their threads unless you're in the discussion and don't pop in and set everybody straight. You're actually negatively affecting the growth of knowledge and the possibility of members learning when you disrupt the threads.
Like I said, just a handful and we all know who you are. 50,000 members and 10-15 posters are in charge of who says what in these threads.
Best,
Mike
By far the best and most cogent description of what is going on in theses instances. The tag team method of attack is especially deplorable. I found myself drawn into it at times, until I realized some of these guys (the "Dirty Dozen"?) aren't just being forceful, they're playing for keeps.
I've felt it many times here. It feels like being converged upon by a pair of angry pit bulls. Of course, to the pros they probably seem more like angry chihuahuas - no real threat, but certainly annoying enough to make you stay away from them. Lol
This is why there's no way to have a real "Ask the Pro" forum. Each thread would quickly be invaded by a few posters intent upon turning it into a "Question the Pro" forum. If I were a pro and Mike H. PM'd me and asked if I'd be interested in being part of an ask the pro forum, I say, "Thanks for thinking of me... but no thanks."
It's a real pity. Just visit a few top pros Facebook pages and see what they feel about us on AZB. What they usually say ain't too flattering. :/
Watch out, CJ! There's bound to be another angry chihuahua coming along any minute now.
See, this is exactly what I was talking about. You, Mikjary, English, and a few others are constantly trying to stir things up on here. You aren't as interested in the truth as you are in stifling anyone that doesn't agree with your heroes. Even to the point that when I ask CJ to clarify what he said, you have to jump in try and instigate something that isn't even there. Really sad the way some of you act on here.
I agree with every word Mike said, and I have only reported one person one time in the three years I've been on here. Things had gotten so far out of hand with this person that it was simply impossible to sit back and watch. It wasn't you, for sure.
That is an unfair characterization, and opinion-based (i.e. Neil's opinion), not fact-based. Below is a prime example...
Stevie Moore got a terrible reception here, in spite of the fact that Stevie is a first-class gentleman. When I saw he was playing at the last Turning Stone, I contacted him on FB about the possibility of getting a lesson while he was in my area. My assumption was that he would likely be driving right past my town on the way home.
When he responded with his price - which was more than I could afford - I explained my situation and told him thanks anyway, and wished him well at the tourney. He then responded that he was going a different route south than I thought he would, that it was 1 1/2 hours out of his way each way, adding 3 hours to his trip and would likely require him to get a motel room for the night.
I told him that I was a member of the "Host a Pro" group, and that he was welcome to stay here if that helped. He not only agreed, but was willing to modify his proposed fee to accommodate my needs!
Unfortunately, we had to cancel because staying here would have meant he'd have to drive home in a huge winter storm that was coming our way, but we left the door open for the same thing in August before the next TS. What a guy!
My limited experience with pros in real life is nothing like you make them out to be. They have been almost universally cordial and respectful, but they know exactly who they are and where they stand in the pool world. Cross that boundary with rude remarks, and well, you only reap what you sow. Spend some time looking at their FB pages and see if you still feel that way about them all.
Mike has no idea how I play. I've disagreed many times with him, and he's never had that reaction and has always responded like a gentleman. Maybe it's all in the way you word it.
Yes, if you don't know that.
If it keeps being said, it's because posters keep saying things that indicate they don't know it.
pj
chgo
I'm not constantly stirring anything up! Jesus Henry Christ, WTF are you talking about? Because I challenge the High Tribunal of AZB at times on points that I disagree with?
I've been silent about most all of this since the moment I registered as a member here. In fact, I was at times complicit in the same mob mentality that you and a few others seem to enjoy. That is, until I took a hard look at myself and said that's not the way I usually behave, nor is it the way I want others to perceive me.
The very idea that I am someway in cohoots with Rick is a joke at best. He's the guy I reported!!! LOL! (Sorry, Rick, I had to do it)
Anyway, have your forum. I'm getting just sick of this shit, so maybe you won't have to worry about me ganging up with Rick and Mike and "a few others" here. Your bitterness just brings me down, and I'm dead positive it has that effect on many other members who choose to remain silent like I used to.
I come here to have a good time and maybe learn a bit here and there. Same reason I might drop in at the local bar. When the thought of going to the bar puts a knot in my stomach because there's a few thugs in there that always want to get in my face and give me shit, I just stop going.
And no, I will not let the door hit me in the ass on my way out if I do leave. But I am out of this thread for good, and maybe I'll sign out and take a break from AZ for a while. Right now I just need a couple Gavascon.
When I began this thread by asking for some advice about the best way(s) to produce intentional swerve (curve the CB around an interferring OB), I never thought it would go on for 27 pages!
Wow, that's a lot of advice about swerving the CB! Who'd a thunk?
Of course, 24 of the 27 pages have been member-attacking-member...over what, I don't know or care.
But thanks to all who offered advice.
Wow, that's a lot of advice about swerving the CB! Who'd a thunk?
Of course, 24 of the 27 pages have been member-attacking-member...over what, I don't know or care.
But thanks to all who offered advice.
This is pretty much what I see this forum turning into. We've accepted the mindset that most pros have no real idea what it takes to play this game from an academic standpoint. And by default, they fill our simple minds with "mythical, magical" nonsense.
There are few pros that post here, anymore. It's not because they're too busy, it's because a handful of posters question every detail of their posting. They lurk and pounce at every opportunity and tag team them because they're trying to protect the average poster from..."mythical, magical" information.
If a poster responds, they're labeled a nut hugger and forever banished from intelligent discussion with the "knowledge guys". I've talked with a pro friend, author, magazine contributor, who knows many other pros. I asked them to start posting and they literally laughed at me because of all the "know it all" posters.
We need the science, every sport does. What we don't need is the handful of petty, self aggrandizing trolls who attack everybody who dares raise an issue with their omniscience. You want to contribute to the knowledge base, EXCELLENT! Like Sloppy says, quit beating people over the head and parroting a bunch of stuff from Dr.Dave's site (kudos to Dave
We don't need to be saved from certain insanity by listening to top players. Stay out of their threads unless you're in the discussion and don't pop in and set everybody straight. You're actually negatively affecting the growth of knowledge and the possibility of members learning when you disrupt the threads.
Like I said, just a handful and we all know who you are. 50,000 members and 10-15 posters are in charge of who says what in these threads.
Best,
Mike
What a load of hooey.
There's only one pro that gets the mystical/magical label and that's CJ. Look at almost any of his posts you'll find his zen-like memes all over the place.
Other pros? They don't like coming here because they don't like to be questioned. They don't like to be told that there is science-based evidence to contradict some of their most cherished beliefs. They don't like to have to defend what they say and how they say it, preferring blind adulation and respect.
Few are the pros that can be one of the guys here. They are the ones that realize they may not know it all. That offer tips. That are willing to debate in a civilized manner. That don't expect to be greeted with hosannas on high.
If some want to wring their hands because ideas here should stand or fall on their own merits, so be it.
Lou Figueroa
There's an adage in science: "Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." When it's claimed that "something" can be done with the stroke that can change tip/ball contact dynamics, it's absolutely scientific to challenge that idea by asking for evidence (or even a working hypothesis).
I don't think anybody objects to the idea that "there might be something more", especially if there's a coherent idea about what and how that might be - the objections are to claims that there is something more with no coherent idea about what or why.
pj
chgo