Questionable/shady dealings here on az opinions wanted

[kvinbrwr]

kevin i had a few people telling me different things.

the negative things that were mentioned were from a few years ago??

guy i got the cue from is telling me cue has been refinished?

wouldnt you believe the guy who currently has the cue?

cue appeared to have no issues to me but i am no expert.

when i made the deal for the cue and posted it i relayed all info via pm that i received to the person i got the cue from.

I hate when that happens to me (getting questionable info about what I'm selling). You never know.

I'm sure Brian doesn't need me to speak for him but were I him, I'd be asking if you thought it was worth mentioning to the guy that sold it to you what about the guy who bought (sorta bought it) it from you.

The cue is back to the hub for your local PO. They've scanned it out, its either on the way to your PO in which case its all over, or wrongly back to Brian, in which case its the Twilight Zone.

 

[blacklab9ball]

Since you are a corrections officer, would finding this individual and shooting him be out of the question? lol

In truth I have not had a similar situation but feel bad for you. I have read many times where people say you are taking a chance when buying/trading cues and cue products online. I still don't think that means people should have to deal with such unpleasantness. Nor do i think that makes it ok.

Perhaps a castration law should be implemented for beguiling fellow AZers. But i digress. Hope this incident resolves itself soon.

Ivan

 

[kvinbrwr]

Hello To all
Here is the story about the cue from Mr. Scruggs at the 2014 Expo
The cue was redone and a new shaft was added by him in the passed but he did not give me the year when that was done ......
he also told me he built the cue for him self a wile back when the thin vaneers became popular.....
he told me the he had the cue back in his shop and it needed a new handle so he did that and a new shaft was added but once more I did not ask when that was

here I was told all of this by him and I have no reason NOT to believe him because I heard all the stories your all talking about and I was the most resent owner and wanted to know it all .....

Ron is NOT miss representing the cue at all .....

it is all original by Scruggs as per him
there was a shaft and a refinish done by Mr Phillipe but that was prior to Mr Scruggs making it all original once more

if you guys have any questions please PM me about the cue that Ron had gotten from me

all the best Ron

your a honest and trust worthy guy dealing here on AZ

hope this clarifies some here

Swiss Chris

Chris

I agree that the Phillipe refinish is out the window when Scruggs redoes it. The fact that Phillipe made a shaft is meaningless if its not one of the shafts included.

That replaced handle. I think that's a disclosure even if the original maker does it (and without a doubt if not the original guy).

Kevin

 

[SwissChris]

Well that's what he has told me ( Mr. Scruggs)
And I know it is not the Phillipe shaft. .....because he told me that there are both his

 

[nick serdula]

Hay guys

I had the Cue a few years ago. It was after Tim had closed for business. It needed a handle at that time. So I refused the Cue. It was in the last 3 years maybe 2. The second shaft was not Scruggs. The phenolic was way off and put together wrong. That is what is for sure. I explained all this the owner of the Cue when I returned it and he disclosed everything when selling it.
How any of this has changed or not because of a lack of omission is queer. Also I have to add the seller had Phillipi make the second shaft because he had only one when he bought it.
Nick

 

[kvinbrwr]

Did Scruggs unretire? Nick are you saying when you saw the cue it needed work and Scruggs was already retired and could never have done the work if the cue is fixed now?

Or did you refuse the cue because Scruggs was retired.

Then later Scruggs unretired and fixed this cue?

 

[nick serdula]

Tim was closed

I offered Mike Webb or Cory Barnhart or Rick Howard were best for the repairs. Bob Frey hates handle work as Tim and Mike did. They would say to send it to Mike Webb if they didn't have time which was the last 5 years in business at least. Michael did offer a handle repair once to me but I declined and he was glad. That is when I learned about his friend Mike Webb.
Nick

 

[SwissChris]

I can only tell you what Mr. Scruggs has told me this passed 2014 that he redid the cue as a favor to someone
so that being told
I go by Mr Scruggs and no one else because I know by the previous owner that it sat for about 11/2 years
I think it was right before he closed his shop and did this as a favor ?????

 

[SwissChris]

as to the joint collars
the match perfect imo
Did Mr. Sruggs only build one of this cue ?
I don't think so imo

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

as to the joint collars
the match perfect imo
Did Mr. Sruggs only build one of this cue ?
I don't think so imo

Chris;

they don't match - take another look.

how's the taper? like a normal TS or not? :wink:

if that's not it in the picture then where did the phillipi made shaft go? :wink:

I think you were also made aware of these issues.

best,
brian kc

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

kevin i had a few people telling me different things.

the negative things that were mentioned were from a few years ago??

guy i got the cue from is telling me cue has been refinished?

wouldnt you believe the guy who currently has the cue?

cue appeared to have no issues to me but i am no expert.

when i made the deal for the cue and posted it i relayed all info via pm that i received to the person i got the cue from.

"the guy who currently has a cue" if trying to make a sale is completely biased with everything to gain, or lose.

previous owners don't have any skin in it - they, by default, would be much more believeable.

ask yourself the same question next time you're at a car lot. who's info is more credible, the used car salesman or the guy who traded it in? :wink:

best,
brian kc

 

[SwissChris]

Chris;

they don't match - take another look.

how's the taper? like a normal TS or not? :wink:

if that's not it in the picture then where did the phillipi made shaft go? :wink:

I think you were also made aware of these issues.

best,
brian kc

Hey Brian
Yes I know one is fatter then the other look at the weight of them. ....
The third shaft with the same collar is in my garage because it is so bent (not a taper roll) I did some experience on
I changed the collar because I wanted to know how they do that and I drilled out the inset because I wanted to see what he used
I can take a picture of it if you want
But the real question is
Why would MR. Scruggs lie to me about the cue?
Why would I take any ones word over the maker of a cue?

I was told this at the nj expo 2014

Brian you and me go back a long time just like a lot of guys on here .....

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

kevin i had a few people telling me different things.

the negative things that were mentioned were from a few years ago??

guy i got the cue from is telling me cue has been refinished?

wouldnt you believe the guy who currently has the cue?

cue appeared to have no issues to me but i am no expert.

when i made the deal for the cue and posted it i relayed all info via pm that i received to the person i got the cue from.

and just to be clear, the negative things people were telling you about this cue were told to you recently. It was what they knew about the cue from a couple of years ago,right?

you are carefully wording things to minimize your failure to disclose possible issues with this cue.

What negative things were these people telling you about the cue Ron?

best,
brian kc

 

[Tro]

To put all the bullshit to bed about the travels of this cue:

I got the cue from Don Sherman with full disclosure.

I sold this cue 1 year and 4 months ago without a refinish, a slight roll in the butt, one original shaft, and one non original shaft. Full disclosure.

Thread here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=301509

The buyer had it refinished a year ago at Proficient billiards.

Thread here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=314050

Somewhere along the line, the details that were disclosed about the cue were "forgotten".

Did Tim Scruggs refinished the cue and add a shaft AFTER Scott Sherbine did a refinish and rewrap? I have no idea.

All I know is I've watched this cue be passed around and actually contacted the various people that had it in their possession to give them the details of the cue. Whether or not anyone gave a **** to relay that information on to the next buyer was their choice.

I wasn't going to say anything as I watched this thread unfold, but as time went on and Chicken continued to get BBQ'd, I figured I'd at least point out the following:

Not everyone here is exempt from fault and people should take a good look in the mirror before they decide to drag someone's name through the mud.
-
Now, if someone wants to call me a liar, they can call me at 815-212-9764 and we can have a nice long talk about this cue. If it's someone..and there are a NUMBER of people on this thread that I "enlightened" about this cue as they had in their possession, wants to call me and *****..please do. What my response will be: If you were honest in the first place, you wouldn't be pissed at me right now."

Am I perfect? No.

Why am I writing this? To show everyone that we all have faults, we all slip at one point or another, and none of use deserve to sit on an ivory throne and cast stones on the heathens below.

Enjoy.

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

Hey Brian
Yes I know one is fatter then the other look at the weight of them. ....
The third shaft with the same collar is in my garage because it is so bent (not a taper roll) I did some experience on
I changed the collar because I wanted to know how they do that and I drilled out the inset because I wanted to see what he used
I can take a picture of it if you want
But the real question is
Why would MR. Scruggs lie to me about the cue?
Why would I take any ones word over the maker of a cue?

I was told this at the nj expo 2014

Brian you and me go back a long time just like a lot of guys on here .....

the 2nd shaft is a phillipi that was made to replace the badly warped orig shaft that may now be in your garage.

this current 2nd shaft is not Tim's taper.

none of it matters to me any more, really.

It's not my problem.

I just want the usps to get their shit together and reunite Ron with his cue.

I messed up and have been raked over the coals.

I resent being taken to task and having my balls broken by people who really should be way more ashamed and apologetic of how they conducted themselves than me.

notice I'm speaking in plurals, not by accident.

enough.

best,
brian kc

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

To put all the bullshit to bed about the travels of this cue:

I got the cue from Don Sherman with full disclosure.

I sold this cue 1 year and 4 months ago without a refinish, a slight roll in the butt, one original shaft, and one non original shaft. Full disclosure.

Thread here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=301509

The buyer had it refinished a year ago at Proficient billiards.

Thread here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=314050

Somewhere along the line, the details that were disclosed about the cue were "forgotten".

Did Tim Scruggs refinished the cue and add a shaft AFTER Scott Sherbine did a refinish and rewrap? I have no idea.

All I know is I've watched this cue be passed around and actually contacted the various people that had it in their possession to give them the details of the cue. Whether or not anyone gave a **** to relay that information on to the next buyer was their choice.

I wasn't going to say anything as I watched this thread unfold, but as time went on and Chicken continued to get BBQ'd, I figured I'd at least point out the following:

Not everyone here is exempt from fault and people should take a good look in the mirror before they decide to drag someone's name through the mud.
-
Now, if someone wants to call me a liar, they can call me at 815-212-9764 and we can have a nice long talk about this cue. If it's someone..and there are a NUMBER of people on this thread that I "enlightened" about this cue as they had in their possession, wants to call me and *****..please do. What my response will be: If you were honest in the first place, you wouldn't be pissed at me right now."

Am I perfect? No.

Why am I writing this? To show everyone that we all have faults, we all slip at one point or another, and none of use deserve to sit on an ivory throne and cast stones on the heathens below.

Enjoy.

for the record, Tim was not in business one year and 4 months ago to do another refinish after Proficient's refinish.

I owe you a beer, Tro.

or a keg.

thank you, Sir.

best,,
brian kc

 

[SwissChris]

I would never dream of pulling someone's name through the mud.....I am a immigrant and no better or worse then others. .....imo
So tell me why Tim tells me he redid the cue and put a handle and a new shaft with it?
This is beyond me
If I'm wrong please tell me
I had the verified by him at the expo and now this......wtf
Why would he tell me one thing when it is not true? ??
I would trade this cue for a. Chris Nitti. .....
At least he and I can see eye to eye. .....

 

[SwissChris]

Brian
The shaft that is in my garage is most definitely NOT a Scruggs shaft
The bras insert was completely wrong just a fyi
And how do you know it was not a favor that he. 're did the cue?
Why would he say that to me?
Any case I know what he told me and I believe him
Idk
Thanks Brian

 

[cueaddicts]

This is all very enlightening about the cue....but not sure how any of it has to do with the subject of this "bad deal" that the OP wrote about. It's really just a distraction. Let's call this all water under the bridge when Ron gets his cue back, shall we. You guys are both too good for this.

 

[Tro]

I would never dream of pulling someone's name through the mud.....I am a immigrant and no better or worse then others. .....imo
So tell me why Tim tells me he redid the cue and put a handle and a new shaft with it?
This is beyond me
If I'm wrong please tell me
I had the verified by him at the expo and now this......wtf
Why would he tell me one thing when it is not true? ??
I would trade this cue for a. Chris Nitti. .....
At least he and I can see eye to eye. .....

I'll give my opinion, and I could be wrong, but I believe that a few things may have happened since the cue left my hands.

1. Someone decided, at some point, there was no need to disclose the true details of the cue because they thought it would hurt the value.
2. Although I informed a number of people that acquired the cue of the shaft and roll, they may have been too deep into the cue and, even though they now had the correct details, failed to bring them to light because they may have thought they wouldn't get their money back out of the cue if they did.
3. People figured that I would never say anything because I usually keep my conversations very private.
4. Tim Scruggs did come out of retirement, make a new shaft for the cue, and redid the Proficient refinish.

Do I think anyone involved in this entire ordeal is a bad person? No. Not even close.

I do think people have full knowledge of the cue and are playing the "I didn't know" card, but they aren't bad people. The cue, at one point, was sold under a false description. After that point, everyone that got the cue wanted to get out from under it once they were made aware of the truth. Times are tough and good people will bend the truth at times. I would do business with anyone involved here without hesitation because I really believe the cue had a lot to do with this situation.

I never met Chicken and never did a deal with him, but he was getting roasted here and I felt that someone had to stand up and point out that none of us are perfect and he didn't deserve to get this type of treatment.

If I've stepped on anyone's toes, and I'm sure I have, we're all big boys and that's just the way it is.

It's sad that it came to this, because that cue was just fine the way it was. There was no need for anyone to start lying about it.