Re-facing Cue Joint

Pre-Flag Master

Pre-Flag Master

Cue Ball Man
Silver Member
I'm assuming that re-facing the joint of a cue serves the purpose of making sure that the surfaces of the joint are mating perfectly together and that the surfaces are "perpendicular" to the length of the cue so the shaft is straight in relation to the butt. I assume re-facing involves putting the butt and the shaft on a lathe and cutting or sanding a small amount off the joint surfaces. Assuming that's correct, here's my question; when you do this, wouldn't you be increasing the diameter of the joint on the butt and decreasing the diameter of the joint on the shaft, hence making the joint not fit exactly flush on the sides? I think maybe there is something here I'm not getting. If I give my cue to the local repair guy to do this, what do I need to know to make sure he is doing it correctly?

Thanks
Fatz
 
I put the shaft in the lathe & center it within 1/2 1000" (.0005"). Then I spin the shaft in the lathe. I hold a pencil to the joint area. When I cut the surface of the joint. I only take as much as I need to remove the pencil darkened surface. Most of the time we're talking a 1/2 1000" (.0005). to one 1000"(.001). Mind you that a human hair is .003"-.004". most often the most sanding that is needed is a light sanding with 1000 grit paper. I hope this answers your concerns. There are those, that do not have the experience to do this job properly. These people can make a real mess of this simple procedure...JER
 
Pre-Flag Master said:
I'm assuming that re-facing the joint of a cue serves the purpose of making sure that the surfaces of the joint are mating perfectly together and that the surfaces are "perpendicular" to the length of the cue so the shaft is straight in relation to the butt. I assume re-facing involves putting the butt and the shaft on a lathe and cutting or sanding a small amount off the joint surfaces. Assuming that's correct, here's my question; when you do this, wouldn't you be increasing the diameter of the joint on the butt and decreasing the diameter of the joint on the shaft, hence making the joint not fit exactly flush on the sides? I think maybe there is something here I'm not getting. If I give my cue to the local repair guy to do this, what do I need to know to make sure he is doing it correctly?

Thanks
Fatz
Click to expand...

What makes you think you need to reface your joint?
 
"If I give my cue to the local repair guy to do this, what do I need to know to make sure he is doing it correctly?"

What???...........Excuse me??

The very first thing you need to know before you randomly hand over your cue
to the 'local repair guy', is he qualified and do you feel comfortable with him?
Just because a person owns a lathe and some consider him to be the local repair guy,
doesn't mean that he knows what he's doing.
And the fact that you have to ask for guidance to the procedure tells me that you don't either.
Well, your assumption that the joint diameter would change was also a red-flag.
You can't 'assume' anything. About the time you do, you'll be back here telling us
how badly he F-d/up your cue.
Do your homework/research.
Unless you're his very first customer, he's got a history with previous clients.
Talk to them. Get their opinion of his work. See his previous work if possible.
It's not much but it's more than you've got now.

The procedure by itself is not difficult if the person knows what they're doing.
Unfortunately, without checking first, you won't know that until after the fact.
I have to 2nd a previous question to you; What makes you think the jnt. needs re-facing?

KJ
 
Wow, jeez, I just thought it might be a good thing to do, sorry.

KJ Cues said:
"If I give my cue to the local repair guy to do this, what do I need to know to make sure he is doing it correctly?"

What???...........Excuse me??

The very first thing you need to know before you randomly hand over your cue
to the 'local repair guy', is he qualified and do you feel comfortable with him?
Just because a person owns a lathe and some consider him to be the local repair guy,
doesn't mean that he knows what he's doing.
And the fact that you have to ask for guidance to the procedure tells me that you don't either.
Well, your assumption that the joint diameter would change was also a red-flag.
You can't 'assume' anything. About the time you do, you'll be back here telling us
how badly he F-d/up your cue.
Do your homework/research.
Unless you're his very first customer, he's got a history with previous clients.
Talk to them. Get their opinion of his work. See his previous work if possible.
It's not much but it's more than you've got now.

The procedure by itself is not difficult if the person knows what they're doing.
Unfortunately, without checking first, you won't know that until after the fact.
I have to 2nd a previous question to you; What makes you think the jnt. needs re-facing?

KJ
Click to expand...
 
Pre-Flag Master said:
A red flag to what? I was just asking a question. You are saying that the joint diameter wouldn't change?
Click to expand...

I think what he is meaning,the joint diameter will not change if .001 to .002 inches is removed off the joint face. The edges of the joint will most likely have a .003 to ,004 inch radius or even greater.
If the person doing the repair work is going to remove more than 1 or 2 thou,either the joint face is exceptionally bad, or they do not know how to take only a small skim cut on the joint face.
If the pin is neat fitting to the shaft and the pin is slightly bent, the cue can appear to be tightly together, but is infact not.
Taking wild guesses and assumptions is not the way to diagnose a problem.
 
"A red flag to what? I was just asking a question. You are saying that the joint diameter wouldn't change?"

That's exactly what I'm saying.
For every .001" you remove from the face (doesn't matter which one),
you'll change the joint dia. by .0000137".
I'm pretty certain that you'll be unable to measure that.

"Wow, jeez, I just thought it might be a good thing to do, sorry."

Why do you feel that it's a good thing to do?
You've been asked this question 3 times now yet still haven't provided an answer.
What makes you think that the joint needs to be faced?

KJ
 
I have a cheap Chinese import. When I roll the shaft and butt separately they are straight. Over time they are still straight. But over time there is now a slight wobble when together. I guess the pin could be bent or cocked, but the wobble has developed over time. I would think that a bent/cocked pin would have created the wobble from the beginning.

Educate me about refacing. Why is it done? How often should it be done? If you do it too often that would be bad right? I take it from the responses here that it's not something you should do unless you know it needs to be done? I was thinking maybe it couldn't hurt anything (except for the idea about the possibility of diameter change at the joint), so why not do it just to make it perfect? On one hand you guys are saying there is virtually no diameter loss, but at the same time it sounds like you are saying refacing a joint for the wrong reason can be a bad thing? Is it possible that the pin has always been bent or cocked slightly and the need for refacing has ALSO crept in slowly over time? Is refacing a cue with a bent/cocked pin to be avoided? Anything else?

Fatz
 
facing joint

Becareful refacing the cheaper cues,make sure the pin is concentric,or you can get into alot more than just facing the joints.
 
KJ Cues said:
"If I give my cue to the local repair guy to do this, what do I need to know to make sure he is doing it correctly?"

What???...........Excuse me?
?KJ
Click to expand...

i'm with KJ on this,
you really need to get with one of these guys and do it right.
YES, you'll have to send the butt and shaft to ensure shaft is matched to butt 100%.
 
treed said:
Becareful refacing the cheaper cues,make sure the pin is concentric,or you can get into alot more than just facing the joints.
Click to expand...
JoeyInCali said:
I have a cheap Chinese import.
How cheap ?
Click to expand...

Why are you obsessed with the market value of the cue. If the OP is considering having work done on it it is obviously more valuable to him than what he currently has invested in it.

Pre-Flag Master said:
When I roll the shaft and butt separately they are straight. Over time they are still straight. But over time there is now a slight wobble when together. I guess the pin could be bent or cocked, but the wobble has developed over time. I would think that a bent/cocked pin would have created the wobble from the beginning.

Fatz
Click to expand...

First things first. Rolling a cue on a table is not a suitable way to determine if the cue is straight. A warped piece of the cue may look straight when rolled by itself. By doubling the length of that piece when rolling the two together the warp then becomes visible on a table. The pieces need to be turned between centers on a lathe to see if they are straight.

Secondly a bent joint pin is usually caused by some type of abuse. If you are not aware of any event that your cue went through that was outside of what the cue is intended to do, then it is unlikely. Is the joint pin loose? I have seen some lesser quality cues where the adhesive holding the pin in place breaks down over time causing the pin to shift slightly when tightened. The cue needs to be turned on a lathe to determine if the pin is in straight and not the problem.

Last make sure the joint pin, shafts threads and joint faces are clean. Contamination on any of these surfaces can cause a misalignment when the cues is tightened together.

It is entirely possible that refacing the joint of your cue could solve the problem. But that is something for your repairman of choice to determine after proper troubleshooting of the issue.
 
ChampionsRepair said:
Why are you obsessed with the market value of the cue. If the OP is considering having work done on it it is obviously more valuable to him than what he currently has invested in it.
Click to expand...

Since the OP was the one who called it "cheap", I don't think he values it all that much.

I believe Joey is inferring that spending money on the cue may not make fiscal sense.
 
Pre-Flag Master said:
I have a cheap Chinese import. When I roll the shaft and butt separately they are straight. Over time they are still straight. But over time there is now a slight wobble when together. I guess the pin could be bent or cocked, but the wobble has developed over time. I would think that a bent/cocked pin would have created the wobble from the beginning.

Educate me about refacing. Why is it done? How often should it be done? If you do it too often that would be bad right? I take it from the responses here that it's not something you should do unless you know it needs to be done? I was thinking maybe it couldn't hurt anything (except for the idea about the possibility of diameter change at the joint), so why not do it just to make it perfect? On one hand you guys are saying there is virtually no diameter loss, but at the same time it sounds like you are saying refacing a joint for the wrong reason can be a bad thing? Is it possible that the pin has always been bent or cocked slightly and the need for refacing has ALSO crept in slowly over time? Is refacing a cue with a bent/cocked pin to be avoided? Anything else?

Fatz
Click to expand...

OK.. First, look carefully to see if some sort of dirt is on the face of the joint. It only takes a little debris to cause a roll out. Actually you never said where it wobbled. Where exactly does it wobble?

Second, stop leaving you cue in your car:thumbup:

Third, the repair guy SHOULD be able to tell you if the refacing of the joint will help the problem or tell you the root cause otherwise.

Lastly, I think people get a bit caught up in the "roll out". If the joint isn't the problem and easily fixed then I wouldn't worry much about it. It most likely isn't enough to hurt your game unless you let it get into your head.
 
I wanted to point out that noone here is trying to be rude to you. We don't want you to waste money on something that might really not do you much good. We also want to point you in the correct direction.
 
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