my schon is currently 19.5 oz and i would like it lighter, around 18.5-18.75 oz. What would the weight be if i took out the weight bolt? also, would taking out the bolt cause it to be severely unbalanced?
thanks
thanks
removing weight bolt in schon
- Thread starter forty6and2
- Start date
forty6and2 said:
You will get different opinions on removing the weight bolt.
But if you contact the cuemaker, he will tell you the weight bolt needs to stay in. It is part of what holds the butt section together.
That being said...(Some) of the Schon cues use only an assembly bolt, and removing it will make a net change of almost nothing. like .01
IF it has a heavier bolt (some modles) you can change it out for a lighter one.
changing the weight bolt will change the balance of the cue....probably very noticably
removing the weight bolt will decrease it by the amount the bolt weighs.
the balance point will generally move about 1" per 1 oz, so if you take once ounce out of the back, the balance will move 1" forward, etc...
i've never heard of schon using the weight bolt to hold on the butt cap, i've only heard of meucci doing this with thier earlie designs signified by the block letter meucci originals logo. though i do belive, not positive, that schon generally epoxy thier weight bolts into place.
i've actually doing the same thing, sorta, with a 90's model meucci. here is the thread in regards to the proccess.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=86449
you could also try posing the same question in the ask the cue maker section as those guys are significantly more knowladgeable in regards to cue construction.
the balance point will generally move about 1" per 1 oz, so if you take once ounce out of the back, the balance will move 1" forward, etc...
i've never heard of schon using the weight bolt to hold on the butt cap, i've only heard of meucci doing this with thier earlie designs signified by the block letter meucci originals logo. though i do belive, not positive, that schon generally epoxy thier weight bolts into place.
i've actually doing the same thing, sorta, with a 90's model meucci. here is the thread in regards to the proccess.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=86449
you could also try posing the same question in the ask the cue maker section as those guys are significantly more knowladgeable in regards to cue construction.
What socks already said ...
In my experience also, 1 oz change by weight bot resulted in about an inch change in balance point.
One of my Schon had weight bolts with a big flat head that required a fairly large size screw driver. It was about .5 oz weight bolt.
In my experience also, 1 oz change by weight bot resulted in about an inch change in balance point.
One of my Schon had weight bolts with a big flat head that required a fairly large size screw driver. It was about .5 oz weight bolt.
Try switching the weight bolt out for an Aluminum bolt !!
BOOSTjunkie
Registered
i too have wondered this... i can take out the small bolt but then i cant get the bumper off
As I said you will get different opinions on the weight bolt.
I have owned 3 different Schons.
1 had a heavier weight bolt in it that I changed out to a lighter bolt.
1 I made no change at all.
1 had a .01 (yes .01) aluminum "assembly" bolt in it. It weight nothing.
That third cue was 19.5oz and I wanted to get it to 19 even.
I contacted Evan Clarke and he told me that (at least for the Schon cue I had) that the bolt was not a weight bolt it was an assembly bolt... and it was designed to help hold the butt cap in place.
You will get opinions that removing the bolt will do nothing...(and they may be right)...I am just giving you reference to my past experience with Schon cues.
I will tell you there is no harm in takin the rubber piece off and checking to see what type of bolt you have...If you have not weighed it, you may find that the bolt you have is only .01 (aluminum) and it would do you no good to remove.
I even went from a linen wrap to a leather wrap...(acutally lightens the cue) The origonal cue weight was at 20oz when I bought it. Changing the wrap broght it down to 19.5...(That may be another option for you)
I actually went so far as to look into drilling out the core of the cue to lighten it....(I opted against that as well and just sold the cue and got a different cue)
Schon cues are not that hard to sell.
I have owned 3 different Schons.
1 had a heavier weight bolt in it that I changed out to a lighter bolt.
1 I made no change at all.
1 had a .01 (yes .01) aluminum "assembly" bolt in it. It weight nothing.
That third cue was 19.5oz and I wanted to get it to 19 even.
I contacted Evan Clarke and he told me that (at least for the Schon cue I had) that the bolt was not a weight bolt it was an assembly bolt... and it was designed to help hold the butt cap in place.
You will get opinions that removing the bolt will do nothing...(and they may be right)...I am just giving you reference to my past experience with Schon cues.
I will tell you there is no harm in takin the rubber piece off and checking to see what type of bolt you have...If you have not weighed it, you may find that the bolt you have is only .01 (aluminum) and it would do you no good to remove.
I even went from a linen wrap to a leather wrap...(acutally lightens the cue) The origonal cue weight was at 20oz when I bought it. Changing the wrap broght it down to 19.5...(That may be another option for you)
I actually went so far as to look into drilling out the core of the cue to lighten it....(I opted against that as well and just sold the cue and got a different cue)
Schon cues are not that hard to sell.
WheatCues
Banned
forty6and2 said:
If you have access to a scale, you should weigh the bolt to determine just how much you need to remove to aquire your target weight... alot of times with Schon cues you find the counter-balance weight bolt to be made of aluminum and that's just to hold the butt-plate in place securely and has virtually no weight to it at all, so here's where it gets sticky....
I wouldn't recommend altering the counter balance weight bolt no more than 1 ounce at most becasue this will cause a noticeable change in your existing balance point and change the feel of the cue completely !
My advice to you, is to have your local "professional" cuesmith to perform the operation, becasue there is more involved with the end result than just cutting off part of the bolt, and if it's aluminum than you have to pull the weight from somewhere else !
Schon's in my opinion are the best "production" cue on the market, Evian does one hell of a job with the assembly and quality control of his work and you can always expect consistancy and resale value to be much higher than any other production cue... so on that note, it means his cues target weights are achieved through the wood densities and also at the joining of the forearm and handle, so there is little need for a huge counter-balance bolt in the rear end, so this can introduce a couple more variables in the equation.
I hope my insight and extensive experience helps you with your plight !
Sincerely, Eddie Wheat
WheatCues
Banned
BOOSTjunkie said:
Yes that is the only bad thing about Schon bumpers... They are quite large and very snug in the buttplate and hard to remove and theres not much wall of the buttplate left so a common problem with this is that when players bounce their cue the rubber has no where to expand and the flex blows out the buttplate cracking it severely !
I have seen this numerous times and to rectify this problem I slightly bore out the I.D. of the schon buttplate before it happens to allow breathing room.
And when I replace the buttplates I allow for the same room with the bumper...
This is something I strongly recommend to any Schon owner to have done, the operation is quick and virtually undetectable, and about 5.00 and will save your monogrammed buttplate and 40-60.00 in repair costs...
This is very useful info. !
- Eddie Wheat
BOOSTjunkie
Registered
WheatCues said:
how do you get the bumper off?
Schon weight bolts are glued in and removing it yourself will void the warrantee. See this thread in Seybert's forum:
http://www.seyberts.com/phpBB2/showthread.php?t=1950
http://www.seyberts.com/phpBB2/showthread.php?t=1950
Good luck getting the screw out!
I Have contacted shon on this matter, and they said that they glue them in. Stupid if you ask me! They said they need the cue to get the screw out.
Mike Webb told me that if you get the screw out, you can you a plastic screw. the one that is used to hold a toilet seat on the bowl, the only thing is that you will have to have the end tapped for the screw that hold on the bumper.
I Tried everything i could to get the screw out, and was affraid of snapping upart the wood at the bottom of the cue above the cap.
I Thought maybe accidentaly the were glued in when they put the screw in the glue wasnt dry on the butt cao, but apparently i was wrong
Good Luck Again
Steve
I Have contacted shon on this matter, and they said that they glue them in. Stupid if you ask me! They said they need the cue to get the screw out.
Mike Webb told me that if you get the screw out, you can you a plastic screw. the one that is used to hold a toilet seat on the bowl, the only thing is that you will have to have the end tapped for the screw that hold on the bumper.
I Tried everything i could to get the screw out, and was affraid of snapping upart the wood at the bottom of the cue above the cap.
I Thought maybe accidentaly the were glued in when they put the screw in the glue wasnt dry on the butt cao, but apparently i was wrong
Good Luck Again
Steve
WheatCues
Banned
stevekur1 said:
I have never had a problem removing the factory weight bolt in a Schon cue and I have repaired atleast over 4 dozen of them in the last 10yrs alone...
You must use a t-handle hex wrench so that you have leverage to avoid slipping... and to my experience I have never found glue securing the weight bolt so far.... only torque !
-Eddie Wheat
WheatCues said:
You are exactly right!! I have a Schon that I ordered via the net and it was sent to me heavier than what I wanted. I had no problem removing the bumper that does in fact have a small screw that threads into the weight bolt. I inquired about having it lightened at DCC and Joe Blackburn verified my thoughts by telling me that the weight was aluminum. ARGH!! So I could not lighten it to the point that I wanted.
And after trying some other cues I wasn't really impressed with my Schon anyway so it found its way to the trash can. Just joking!!!!! Actually it is in a spare case and will probably remain there for a long time. I wouldn't mind selling it but I have hardly used it and I would be giving it away I'm sure. So does that make me a collector of cues I don't like?
Gary
How I get my bolt out of my Schon is I put a chissel in a vise, put the bolt up to the chissel, using the chissel like a screw driver and twist the butt. This has worked for me in the past. I have always been told it is not worth changing the weight of the Schon, just sell it and buy a Schon that is weighted the way you like.
I Tried the chisel technique already, without any luck. i do have the aliminum bolt in there, so how much weight would i be able to loose by taking it out. .04 oz decided it wasnt worth it so i adapted to the weight, for that much of a differance its really not worth it!
Steve
Steve
I wonder if the bolt not wanting to come out has something to do with the area you live in...
I have removed the bolt in 5 different Schons (3 were my own) and every single one came out with and allen wrench and then a long large scew driver.
No vice, no tork lever, no nothing.....(and I have bad wrists)
NOTE: I live in the dry desert.
I have removed the bolt in 5 different Schons (3 were my own) and every single one came out with and allen wrench and then a long large scew driver.
No vice, no tork lever, no nothing.....(and I have bad wrists)
NOTE: I live in the dry desert.
I just have to join on this; When I received my LTD1111 1,5 years back or so, I just grabbed it and started playing. Some months later I was playing in a pub with a house stick and it felt like a truck.
I then found my stock weight on the Scon to be around 16,....something which was to light for me. The transition when playing with a house stick was to big.
However, changing the bolt was for the first time in 16 years playing pool a problem. It was dead stuck. I did all the tricks I knew and in the process I ended up making a dent in the but. Frustrated I called the friendly boys at Schon and I got the feed back that there might have been glue which had got in to the chamber. I did not get the feedback that this was the usual way of producing cues. I shipped it to Schon, they changed the weight bolt to make it 19 and shipped the stock bolt with the cue when they sent it back. They had to heat the but in some way to loosen any glue, and then change.
The stock bolt was a small Aluminum one.
The boys at Schon has given me some of the best service I have had, so just give them a call if you find you're bolt to be stuck. They fixed mine free of charge, including the dent/nic in the finnish I did however cost me close to $18o in shipping ...
So then there is at least two of us which had a glued bolt.
N
I then found my stock weight on the Scon to be around 16,....something which was to light for me. The transition when playing with a house stick was to big.
However, changing the bolt was for the first time in 16 years playing pool a problem. It was dead stuck. I did all the tricks I knew and in the process I ended up making a dent in the but. Frustrated I called the friendly boys at Schon and I got the feed back that there might have been glue which had got in to the chamber. I did not get the feedback that this was the usual way of producing cues. I shipped it to Schon, they changed the weight bolt to make it 19 and shipped the stock bolt with the cue when they sent it back. They had to heat the but in some way to loosen any glue, and then change.
The stock bolt was a small Aluminum one.
The boys at Schon has given me some of the best service I have had, so just give them a call if you find you're bolt to be stuck. They fixed mine free of charge, including the dent/nic in the finnish
I did however cost me close to $18o in shipping ...So then there is at least two of us which had a glued bolt.
N
WheatCues
Banned
Newton said:I just have to join on this; When I received my LTD1111 1,5 years back or so, I just grabbed it and started playing. Some months later I was playing in a pub with a house stick and it felt like a truck.
I then found my stock weight on the Scon to be around 16,....something which was to light for me. The transition when playing with a house stick was to big.
However, changing the bolt was for the first time in 16 years playing pool a problem. It was dead stuck. I did all the tricks I knew and in the process I ended up making a dent in the but. Frustrated I called the friendly boys at Schon and I got the feed back that there might have been glue which had got in to the chamber. I did not get the feedback that this was the usual way of producing cues. I shipped it to Schon, they changed the weight bolt to make it 19 and shipped the stock bolt with the cue when they sent it back. They had to heat the but in some way to loosen any glue, and then change.
The stock bolt was a small Aluminum one.
The boys at Schon has given me some of the best service I have had, so just give them a call if you find you're bolt to be stuck. They fixed mine free of charge, including the dent/nic in the finnish
So then there is at least two of us which had a glued bolt.
N
Here's a trick of the trade us "Professional Cuesmiths" use to remove glued in counter-weight bolts from the bottom of the any cue !
Take a 100w soldering gun such as a "weller" namebrand these are the guns that have a trigger and a light mounted just under the barrel, they reach max temperature almost immediately when trigger is depressed... hold the gun to the head of the weightbolt carefully for about 45 sec to 90 sec "depending on the composition of the weight bolt" and this process will breakdown the structural integrety of the glue and allow you to remove it with little effort...
Of course, you must immediately back the bolt out after applying the heat to it, so have everything ready to go and this should rectify any problem you guys are having removing glued in counter-weight bolts !
If you have any questions or problems regarding the execution of this process please give me a call anytime and I'll be more than happy to answer any questions or walk you through the operation myself....
Sincerely, Eddie Wheat (East Coast Cue Repair 321-631-1827)
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