Ron V aiming system video and diagrams

SpiderWebComm said:
If the cue rotates on an axis from where the V is on your bridge, you miss the ball. Of course it's accurate--- THAT'S WHY I WANNA MEET AND BAN THIS GUY. Read this thread very carefully from the very beginning - I have not said different things. I'm not welching at all.

Post 241 says it all. The intent of both PJ and myself. His diagram is wrong, I called him on it-- he said my video was a hoax and stood by his diagram. I got tired of the "matter of fact" smart-talk. I called him out and asked him to bet something (friendly I might add). PJ strutted around like a peacock, responding with a $5000 bet (which isn't friendly for anyone). I called it for $1000 and the value of my cue. Now, as I see it, people are acting like they don't know what the bet is and nobody speka-no-eeeenglish.

Anything other than what 241 says and what I'm saying here is twisted and word-smithing.

I have his G in my pocket and I'm ready to meet. PJ, responded by SAYING WE'RE NOT MEETING!! Are you kidding me?

The bet is simple no matter how anyone twists it: setup a 59" shot, 10" bridge, not move the bridge at all, if I hit/make the ball I win.... pure and simple. If anyone reading this thread doesn't think that's the bet you're a moron.

YOU GOT ACTION ON POST 133!!!! MY CUE WILL ROTATE AROUND MY BRIDGE, IT'S NOT THE PIVOT POINT--- IF IT WERE, PER YOUR DIAGRAM, I MISS THE BALL. DO YOU NOT AGREE???????
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Count me in as a moron-the original bet that you agreed to was not about hitting the ball at all. However if you rotate to the same 'center ball' as to make that first shot in the diagram by Patrick, you will indeed miss that last ball. Just one morons opinion.
 
eezbank said:
there were more names on his website. looks like you've made your mind up already. that's fine with me. use what works for you.
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EEZBank...this is what SJDinPHX (DicK) wrote on 9/2/08...Yes, his mind was already made up! Stan

ALL "aiming systems" are a joke. whether you give them away, (as Houlie does)
or charge for them. If they worked, everyone would be a champion.
If you don't know where to hit the ball, it ain't going...
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Why stop now?

pj <- so outta here...
chgo
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YOU'RE SOOO A NIT. You know exactly what our disagreement is about, you know exactly what the bet is, you know I called it, you refuse to meet to settle it (earlier post somewhere above), and now you refer to one post and you're so outta here.

You nitbag-- you can't win this bet, and you're running. Anyone reading this thread knows you can't win it-- which is why no one is PMing me for side action and why different instructors PMed me (not Ron, btw) telling me to keep the heat on, agreeing you can't win.

If I was Mr. Wilson, I'd ban your ass for cocking for a big bet and slithering out of it when called.

Our disagreement was very specific....your diagram is wrong. You said any pivot from your bridge is congruent (hip or BHE)...read the thread. Ron couldn't wait to bet with you, I couldn't wait to bet with you, you refused to meet-- now you're running.

You make me sick.

Learn to play pool before you make diagrams about sh1t you don't understand.

I would have LOVED to win your gay little $200 cue. Would have been the nuts. Whenever you wanna meet, I'm "perma-in". Your cash is in my pocket, little girl.
 
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JoeyInCali said:
SEMANTICS!

Where the cue pivots is what you define Pivot Point.

Dave, defines Pivot Point as where you pivot FROM.

????
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Right on Joey! The term "pivot point" has a generally accepted and specific meaning when applied to a cue. Dave, unfortunately, didn't understand that, and assigned his own meaning to the term - hence the confusion. I feel he should simply admit that, accept responsibility for the confusion, and this matter will disappear.
 
SpiderWebComm said:
YOU'RE SOOO A NIT. You know exactly what our disagreement is about, you know exactly what the bet is, you know I called it, you refuse to meet to settle it (earlier post somewhere above), and now you refer to one post and you're so outta here.

You nitbag-- you can't win this bet, and you're running. Anyone reading this thread knows you can't win it-- which is why no one is PMing me for side action and why different instructors PMed me (not Ron, btw) telling me to keep the heat on, agreeing you can't win.

If I was Mr. Wilson, I'd ban your ass for cocking for a big bet and slithering out of it when called.

Our disagreement was very specific....your diagram is wrong. You said any pivot from your bridge is congruent (hip or BHE)...read the thread. Ron couldn't wait to bet with you, I couldn't wait to bet with you, you refused to meet-- now you're running.

You make me sick.

Learn to play pool before you make diagrams about sh1t you don't understand.

I would have LOVED to win your gay little $200 cue. Would have been the nuts. Whenever you wanna meet, I'm "perma-in". Your cash is in my pocket, little girl.
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Did PJ quote you accurately in his post #235? If so, can't you admit that you did not understand the meaning of the term "pivot point"?
 
SpiderWebComm said:
YOU'RE SOOO A NIT. You know exactly what our disagreement is about, you know exactly what the bet is, you know I called it, you refuse to meet to settle it (earlier post somewhere above), and now you refer to one post and you're so outta here.

You nitbag-- you can't win this bet, and you're running. Anyone reading this thread knows you can't win it-- which is why no one is PMing me for side action and why different instructors PMed me (not Ron, btw) telling me to keep the heat on, agreeing you can't win.

If I was Mr. Wilson, I'd ban your ass for cocking for a big bet and slithering out of it when called.

Our disagreement was very specific....your diagram is wrong. You said any pivot from your bridge is congruent (hip or BHE)...read the thread. Ron couldn't wait to bet with you, I couldn't wait to bet with you, you refused to meet-- now you're running.

You make me sick.

Learn to play pool before you make diagrams about sh1t you don't understand.

I would have LOVED to win your gay little $200 cue. Would have been the nuts. Whenever you wanna meet, I'm "perma-in". Your cash is in my pocket, little girl.
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Ill bet im not the only one to lose all respect for you after this thread. I thought you were a good guy- better to learn late than never.
 
Nostroke said:
Ill bet im not the only one to lose all respect for you after this thread. I thought you were a good guy- better to learn late than never.
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I know exactly what a pivot point is-- which is why I bet. Don't like the way I handled the thread.... "that's nice."

This thread is the beginning of a new era. I'm not letting PJ get away with his smart-mouth when he's outta line again. I was a total gentleman until after I posted the video and he lipped off, underlining his stupid points.

Don't like it? Don't mouth off and get cocky with me when you don't know what you're talking about.

For the record... I'm still in on this bet. I'm not out. When PJ wants to meet face/face, I'm in. I'll keep an eye on this thread and my PM box for where/when he wants to prove his side of the bet.
 
stan shuffett said:
EEZBank...this is what SJDinPHX (DicK) wrote on 9/2/08...Yes, his mind was already made up! Stan

ALL "aiming systems" are a joke. whether you give them away, (as Houlie does)
or charge for them. If they worked, everyone would be a champion.
If you don't know where to hit the ball, it ain't going...
Click to expand...

Stan,

Apologies for mis-spelling your name in my previous post. You may not know that I was born prior to pool being invented. :wink:
If you find people who go for aiming "systems", more power to you. I just can't understand how all the past champions (and even shortstops like me)
ever survived without all these gems of engineering wisdom. Next you'll be saying Eddie Taylor used the "diamond system", and Willie used the light system. :boring2: :boring2: :boring2:

Dick
 
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stan shuffett said:
EEZBank...this is what SJDinPHX (DicK) wrote on 9/2/08...Yes, his mind was already made up! Stan

ALL "aiming systems" are a joke. whether you give them away, (as Houlie does)
or charge for them. If they worked, everyone would be a champion.
If you don't know where to hit the ball, it ain't going...
Click to expand...

i caught that. there are alot of folks that agree with that on here but my guess is they haven't tried the system or someone hasn't shown them the system correctly. cleary had good intentions by posting this thread to try to shed some light on rons system. it's a shame that he couldn't get all the information about the adjustments before it was attacked by the same person that has done this in the hal houle threads without understanding the system. it would be nice to have all the info first then let the debate start. JMO
 
SJDinPHX said:
Stan,

Apologies for mis-spelling your name in my previous post. You may not know that I was born prior to pool being invented. :wink:
If you find people who go for aiming "systems", more power to you. I just can't understand how all the past champions (and even shortstops like me)
ever survived without all these gems of engineering. Next you'll be saying Eddie Taylor used the "diamond system" :boring2: :boring2: :boring2:

Dick
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Dick, So, you know for a fact that Eddie Taylor was never exposed to any diamond systems.
I do not know what Eddie did.......Someone may chime in with a fact or 2 about Eddie's play.
Most bank players are aware of systems.....Diamond systems are references......Your premise is that Eddie had zero references as far as the diamonds are concerned......
Stan
 
cleary said:
I tried :( Looks like I created a monster.
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I believe every aiming thread has manifested itself into some kind of children's playground fight. It gets people pretty heated, which is understandable.

Besides threads on politics (which just gets plain dumb in the NPR section), I believe threads on aiming divides people the best.
 
Bottom line is that if they(AIMING SYSTEMS) work you would NEVER miss a ball. If the cue pivots on the bridge 1mm left or right IT STILL PIVOTS ON THE BRIDGE!!! NOT THE HIPS OR BACKHAND OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT. If it pivoted at the backhand or hips you would have to slide your bridge hand left or right keeping your backhand still.
 
Ok, in hopes to clear up this whole pivot thing, I went ahead and made a little animation of what (I think happends) Sorry for the 8 bit graphics, I literally made it in like 7 min.

http://www.andrewcleary.com/PIVOT_SM.mov
sorry, its quicktime 7+... hope you have it!

Basically, it shows two balls and a cue lined up in 90/90. The blue square is your hand (bridge). There is a white reference spot on the cue. It is there to help illustrate what happends to you're cue as it pivots. Really, im saying that the pivot/anchor point is moving during the pivot. This happends because when you shift your weight (pivot with your hips), your cue slides slightly away from the cueball.

during the video, you will see the the white reference dot (which is also the anchor point) is at the bridge before the pivot. During the pivot, you will see the reference line move slightly back behind the bridge. Maybe two Inches or so. This is from the shift in body position. If you just move your back hand, the anchor point will stay the same and therefor, you will miss the ball. But by moving your hip, you are also bringing your cue slightly away from the cueball.

Hopefully this clears up the proper pivot point/bridge deal. Im not an expert, Im only creating what I believe logically happens.
 
jasonlaus said:
Bottom line is that if they(AIMING SYSTEMS) work you would NEVER miss a ball.
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WRONG! knowing your target and hitting your target are two different things. Just like a straight in shot. You dont need a system to know where to aim, but its still one of the most missed balls ive seen. Because its the stroke. No aiming system in the world will cure a bad stroke.
 
Cleary's Talent as a diagram drawer. :wink:

cleary said:
Ok, in hopes to clear up this whole pivot thing, I went ahead and made a little animation of what (I think happends) Sorry for the 8 bit graphics, I literally made it in like 7 min.

http://www.andrewcleary.com/PIVOT_SM.mov
sorry, its quicktime 7+... hope you have it!

Basically, it shows two balls and a cue lined up in 90/90. The blue square is your hand (bridge). There is a white reference spot on the cue. It is there to help illustrate what happends to you're cue as it pivots. Really, im saying that the pivot/anchor point is moving during the pivot. This happends because when you shift your weight (pivot with your hips), your cue slides slightly away from the cueball.

during the video, you will see the the white reference dot (which is also the anchor point) is at the bridge before the pivot. During the pivot, you will see the reference line move slightly back behind the bridge. Maybe two Inches or so. This is from the shift in body position. If you just move your back hand, the anchor point will stay the same and therefor, you will miss the ball. But by moving your hip, you are also bringing your cue slightly away from the cueball.

Hopefully this clears up the proper pivot point/bridge deal. Im not an expert, Im only creating what I believe logically happens.
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Another diagram drawer. Hmmph.

If this is what Spidey was doing Patrick loses $1,000.00 and his cue. That wouldn't be nice at all.

Maybe if Patrick would apologize to Spidey, Spidey might be in a forgiving mood. :D

Oh yeah... Good diagram and interesting thread.

Never bet a man that says he has a frog in his pocket.
JoeyA

Geeze, Andrew. That is some AWESOME stuff you do with graphics. :thumbup: thornbergandforester.com
 
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cleary said:
WRONG! knowing your target and hitting your target are two different things. Just like a straight in shot. You dont need a system to know where to aim, but its still one of the most missed balls ive seen. Because its the stroke. No aiming system in the world will cure a bad stroke.
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Still need to pay your dues..but at least your learning curve is cut shorter. You get to shoot with a "Third Eye"...how cool is that:).

Duc.
 
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