No
Nope..............................................
Nope..............................................
Should all miscues = foul?
- Thread starter DTL
- Start date
Back when music was good, I used to play a lot of bar pool with bar rules, you could not play a safe because that was called dirty pool.
We used to lick your thumb when no one was looking and wipe the chalk off the tip. Then miscue to play a safe.
No one was the wiser.
Won a lot of beers doing that.
Kim
We used to lick your thumb when no one was looking and wipe the chalk off the tip. Then miscue to play a safe.
No one was the wiser.
Won a lot of beers doing that.
Kim
An unintentional miscue is not a foul. Read the rules.
A scoop jump IS a foul, but only because the BCA rules defined to be so. (Which I think is retarded, but that is an argument for another thread. The rule is the rule.)
Slow motion video shows that the ferrule and the shaft DO NOT contact the ball in a scoop jump: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWWMy5tj69s
So, if it is a foul, it is because the rules define a scoop jump as a foul, but not because of illegal contact.
Unintentional miscues, including unintentional scoop jumps, are not fouls.
See the rule below.
1-34 Jump Shots and Massé Shots
1. Jump shots are legal shots. However, it is a foul if you intentionally cause the cue ball
to rise off the bed of the table by "digging under" or "scooping" the cue ball with the cue.
If such a motion is unintentional, it is considered a miscue, and not a foul in and of itself.
1. Jump shots are legal shots. However, it is a foul if you intentionally cause the cue ball
to rise off the bed of the table by "digging under" or "scooping" the cue ball with the cue.
If such a motion is unintentional, it is considered a miscue, and not a foul in and of itself.
Should all miscues
The BCA Rule Book describes in the General Glossary a miscue as,
"A stroke which results in the cue tip contact with cue ball being faulty. Usually the cue tip slides off the cue ball without full transmission of the desired stroke. The stroke usually results in a sharp sound and a discoloration of the tip and/or thecue ball at the point of contact."
Under General Rules it states that," Legal shots require that the cue ball be struck only with the cue tip. Failure to meet this requirement is a foul."
Further in the rule regarding Illegal Jumping of Ball(3.25 in my book), it describes the out come as not an evident foul unless it can be determined that the cue ball had contact with the shaft or ferrule. So, it is not an automatic foul when this "dig" or "scooping" action occurs. The outcome is the same for miscues. When it is evident that contact with the ferrule is made, it is a foul.
I had this happen to me last Friday Night in a tournament. Even though I made contact with one of my object balls, and subsequentially touched a rail, I informed my opponent I had in fact contacted my ferrule on the miscue. A Foul.
For any accomplished player, it is unmistakeable when this happens. You Hear it, and Feel it.
Hope this helps.
cajunfats.
Regardless of the percentages of video evidence, the answer is no. Not all miscues are fouls.
The BCA Rule Book describes in the General Glossary a miscue as,
"A stroke which results in the cue tip contact with cue ball being faulty. Usually the cue tip slides off the cue ball without full transmission of the desired stroke. The stroke usually results in a sharp sound and a discoloration of the tip and/or thecue ball at the point of contact."
Under General Rules it states that," Legal shots require that the cue ball be struck only with the cue tip. Failure to meet this requirement is a foul."
Further in the rule regarding Illegal Jumping of Ball(3.25 in my book), it describes the out come as not an evident foul unless it can be determined that the cue ball had contact with the shaft or ferrule. So, it is not an automatic foul when this "dig" or "scooping" action occurs. The outcome is the same for miscues. When it is evident that contact with the ferrule is made, it is a foul.
I had this happen to me last Friday Night in a tournament. Even though I made contact with one of my object balls, and subsequentially touched a rail, I informed my opponent I had in fact contacted my ferrule on the miscue. A Foul.
For any accomplished player, it is unmistakeable when this happens. You Hear it, and Feel it.
Hope this helps.
cajunfats.
I know a man who plays 8-ball at the Press Club.
Sooo...I asked him if 'scoop' shots were allowed in that place....
....he swore at me...:angry:
I told him that I didn't think anything he said should be unprintable.:yikes:
He said "Your dumb jokes should be unprintable.":embarrassed2:
Sooo...I asked him if 'scoop' shots were allowed in that place....
....he swore at me...:angry:
I told him that I didn't think anything he said should be unprintable.:yikes:
He said "Your dumb jokes should be unprintable.":embarrassed2:
You completely ignored the part of my post that said well executed draw shots sometimes sound like miscues. That's where I think the arguments would start. I've heard commentators often say, "It sounded like he might have miscued a little bit."
I think it would be a bad idea to change the rule.
Strongly agree. I would remove the subjective language and either it's always a foul or never a foul.
Will people argue? Meh, who cares... people will argue about anything. Guys will argue that fouls should be behind the line because that's how they play at joe's bar. A random scrub will swear he didn't push when he obviously did. You can't 100% remove argument from pool, but if you want to try... removing subjective rules is a great start.
Just playing devil's advocate here but, would it be so bad if it's (almost) never a foul? Maybe make an amended rule to prevent scoop jumps,which are hazardous to the cloth. Miscue = ok, but if the cue ball hops over an impeding ball then it's a foul.