Simonis 860 HR Question

SCCues

< Searing Twins
Silver Member
I bought some Simonis 860 HR cloth to use on my home table when I had my table moved and set up at my new home (new to me). The cloth came to me folded in a clear plastic bag. I didn't have any reason to take it out of the bag so it stayed in the bag until I had to use it. To save time I took my rails off the table and took them to the shop along with my new Simonis cloth so they could do the rails ahead of time.

My table was moved and set up last Friday and I stayed out the way while the 2 mechanics worked on setting up the table and covering it with the Simonis Cloth (?). So I didn't actually see the cloth before it was put on the table and the job was finished and maybe I should have stayed in the room with them.

I'm not sure they installed the cloth I bought and took to their shop to do the rails ahead of time. There are a couple of reasons i'm suspicios and one is the cloth has some dark colored lines like water marks on one end and I can't see how that could be on brand new cloth of that type. The marks run close to all the way across the table and it just doesn't look right. My new cloth is Tournament Blue 860 HR and my table is an over sized 8' table so when I ordered it I ordered cloth for a 9' table to be sure i'd have plenty with a little left over. I wasn't in the room when the cloth was cut and I didn't ask about any left over cloth before they left. My wife wanted some of the material so I called the shop and I asked the owner to see if they could let me have the extra cloth from my job (they should have had it since my call was just a couple of hours after they finished). The installer called me back in about 30 minutes and he said that there wasn't any cloth left over! How could that be when he used cloth cut for a 9' table on an 8' table?

Maybe someone on the forum can answer this question. I had green Simonis put on my table years ago and along the border it had "Simonis" printed along the border, but I don't know if Simonis still does this. After I started getting suspicious about the installer doing a switch on my cloth I got under the table and looked at the edge of the cloth that had the border stitched and I couldn't see the word Simonis printed anywhere, but maybe they don't do that anymore. Does anyone know if Simonis 860 Tournament Blue HR should have "Simonis" printed along the border of the cloth?

One reason i'm suspicious is the shop that did my table has the same colored blue cloth on about 8 tables in their show room and it's not 860 HR Simonis. I'm wondering if they pulled a switch on me since there's no cloth left over and I can't find any Simonis markings on the edge of the cloth. I hope i'm out in left field with this suspicion, but the black marks across the table bed on brand new Simonis just doesn't look right and my table is slower than it was with the old green cloth on it.

Thanks for any advice or comments.
 
Simonis

I bought some Simonis 860 HR cloth to use on my home table when I had my table moved and set up at my new home (new to me). The cloth came to me folded in a clear plastic bag. I didn't have any reason to take it out of the bag so it stayed in the bag until I had to use it. To save time I took my rails off the table and took them to the shop along with my new Simonis cloth so they could do the rails ahead of time.

My table was moved and set up last Friday and I stayed out the way while the 2 mechanics worked on setting up the table and covering it with the Simonis Cloth (?). So I didn't actually see the cloth before it was put on the table and the job was finished and maybe I should have stayed in the room with them.

I'm not sure they installed the cloth I bought and took to their shop to do the rails ahead of time. There are a couple of reasons i'm suspicios and one is the cloth has some dark colored lines like water marks on one end and I can't see how that could be on brand new cloth of that type. The marks run close to all the way across the table and it just doesn't look right. My new cloth is Tournament Blue 860 HR and my table is an over sized 8' table so when I ordered it I ordered cloth for a 9' table to be sure i'd have plenty with a little left over. I wasn't in the room when the cloth was cut and I didn't ask about any left over cloth before they left. My wife wanted some of the material so I called the shop and I asked the owner to see if they could let me have the extra cloth from my job (they should have had it since my call was just a couple of hours after they finished). The installer called me back in about 30 minutes and he said that there wasn't any cloth left over! How could that be when he used cloth cut for a 9' table on an 8' table?

Maybe someone on the forum can answer this question. I had green Simonis put on my table years ago and along the border it had "Simonis" printed along the border, but I don't know if Simonis still does this. After I started getting suspicious about the installer doing a switch on my cloth I got under the table and looked at the edge of the cloth that had the border stitched and I couldn't see the word Simonis printed anywhere, but maybe they don't do that anymore. Does anyone know if Simonis 860 Tournament Blue HR should have "Simonis" printed along the border of the cloth?

One reason i'm suspicious is the shop that did my table has the same colored blue cloth on about 8 tables in their show room and it's not 860 HR Simonis. I'm wondering if they pulled a switch on me since there's no cloth left over and I can't find any Simonis markings on the edge of the cloth. I hope i'm out in left field with this suspicion, but the black marks across the table bed on brand new Simonis just doesn't look right and my table is slower than it was with the old green cloth on it.

Thanks for any advice or comments.

If you know anyone that has a black light you can put it up to the cloth and it should say Simonis, you cant see it with out the black light, hope this helps thanks gary
 
Simonis 860

SCCues-

There is ALWAYS some material left over.
Even if just the trimmings.

Winners07 is correct - take a black light and 'simonis' will show up in quite a few places.
I cannot remember the distance but am thinking it repeats quite a bit.

Simons did this to thwart counterfeiting.
Something does not sound right.

If you wife needs some cloth for 'stuff' - email me a we usually have pieces around our office. Some are pretty good sized ( roll end) and some are quite small.

include phone number etc. we also have rail cloth still for sale.
Let me know.

Mark Griffin
Markg@playcsipool.com
 
Simonis?

Thanks everyone for the suggestions and the information about the black light. I wasn't aware of this and a lot of good products are being counterfitted today so it makes sense for Simonis to include a hidden signature. I'm going to get a black light to satisfy myself that I haven't been taken advantage of. I trusted the people who did my job and it will be a disappointment if someone pulled a switch on me.
 
I've never seen simonis cloth without the simonis name on it. Generally you'll see the Ivan Simonis signature logo in one place along with simonis 860 in block print in another. Also, in my experience simonis 860 is fastest when it is brand new. I hope this helps
 
SCCues-

There is ALWAYS some material left over.
Even if just the trimmings.

Winners07 is correct - take a black light and 'simonis' will show up in quite a few places.
I cannot remember the distance but am thinking it repeats quite a bit.

Simons did this to thwart counterfeiting.
Something does not sound right.

If you wife needs some cloth for 'stuff' - email me a we usually have pieces around our office. Some are pretty good sized ( roll end) and some are quite small.

include phone number etc. we also have rail cloth still for sale.
Let me know.

Mark Griffin
Markg@playcsipool.com

Mark, I took yours and winners07's advice and I bought a black light to satisfy myself that I either had the right cloth or I didn't. The cloth checked out as real Simonis 860 and I was so relived. I didn't want to believe that the installer had pulled a switch on me, but with the discolored lines in the cloth and no Simonis name that I could find I was skeptical. Everything checked ok with the black light and I'd like to thank you both again for the tip about the light. I had no idea that you could verify true Simonis cloth with a black light.

James
 
3 years ago a guy came to me with 20+ bags of counterfeit Simonis was NOT HR, he wanted $80each for them, we were selling lots of tables then. He was honest that it was counterfeit and said I could sell it as real. Needless at say I told him to stuff it, i dont do biz like that.

I got a bad feeling about that bagged cloth.

Dartman here on AZB sells cloth and he works close with Glen(far as I know, they did, i assume they still do). Mark Griffen post is correct too.

On the bright side if it plays well, what the hell use it for a while. i'd be pissed as well myself.

sorry no good news,

best
eric
 
Simonis only prints their name on one side of the cloth, if that was the excess cloth side, you wouldn't be able to find the Simonis name on the cloth. The dark lines in t he cloth are more than likely fold mark lines, they'll go away in time.

Glen
 
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