Spinning the cue on shots

I have been shown how twisting the wrist or stick creates a stun effect..The shot I was shown by an old timer works best when you get left straight in on a ball on an end rail and have to go up table to get position..

you can create left or right stun and the cue ball goes up table..Why exactley it works is a different matter..But i have made the shot work
 
Blackjack said:
I was talking to a very well known player from the Philippines about this same subject about 3-4 years ago. I told him that I had been crucified by many people on the internet for teaching this method - a method he had personally showed me a few years earlier. I told him about the comments and the consensus of the crowd that said "this is impossible" or "that is impossible". He didn't seem surprised at all.

He simply shrugged his shoulders and said this:
"That is why those people and none of their students will never reach the playing level of the Filipino players."

Now he wasn't talking about the playing level of Efren, Francisco, Jose, or Ronnie - he was talking about your average pool hall player in Manila.

I don't believe in "impossible". I once had somebody tell me I would never run a hundred. One day I did it. Then I did it again. And Again. Then one day I ran 200. So much for "impossible".

To be a great player, you need to place the words "That's Impossible" into the same file where you put Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, and the Easter Bunny - it doesn't exist.


Edit: FTR, Keith McCready just made a post about using this same method and recommended that a player learn how to do this... Me, I'd listen to Keith.
Click to expand...
I agree fully with you BJ,listen to keith. fact i'll go a step further, i listen to two great players and just good people..Keith and YOU. anyways here is the post for those who dont like to search;)
One tip that you may want to use, if you don't use it already, I like to twirl my fingers on the hand that holds the cue and twist the cue around sometimes. Don't hold the cue tightly. You can experiment with a lot more shots when you twirl. It helps a lot with your spin shots, top right, top left, low right, and let's not forget about your inside lefts. Keep twirling, and you'll find that you can get to feel these shots a lot better and make them with a lot more ease, once you master all the twirl feels. Trust me, I did it all the time when I was experimenting in practice. It really works.
 
XxMerlinxX said:
I found that CueTable program, let me know if it doesn't work for some reason. The closer the cue ball is to the OB, the easier the technique is since the spin on the cue ball is harder to maintain over greater distances. I don't know why everyone's saying not to bother, it does work and it's a nice thing to be able to utilize.

<iframe src="http://CueTable.com/P/?@4BYek3EWCL4FVtL3HJAx4LYIB1PUbW1kUbW1kVfA1kVfA@" noresize="noresize" marginheight="0" marginwidth="0" frameborder="no" width="660" height="430" ></iframe>

Edit- Didn't pop up in the window for some reason, try clicking on this link instead.
http://CueTable.com/P/?@4BYek3EWCL4FVtL3HJAx4LYIB1PUbW1kUbW1kVfA1kVfA@
Click to expand...
your'e talking about back hand english(which i use ) not spinning the cue stick.
 
XxMerlinxX said:
I found that CueTable program, let me know if it doesn't work for some reason. The closer the cue ball is to the OB, the easier the technique is since the spin on the cue ball is harder to maintain over greater distances. I don't know why everyone's saying not to bother, it does work and it's a nice thing to be able to utilize.

<iframe src="http://CueTable.com/P/?@4BYek3EWCL4FVtL3HJAx4LYIB1PUbW1kUbW1kVfA1kVfA@" noresize="noresize" marginheight="0" marginwidth="0" frameborder="no" width="660" height="430" ></iframe>

Edit- Didn't pop up in the window for some reason, try clicking on this link instead.
http://CueTable.com/P/?@4BYek3EWCL4FVtL3HJAx4LYIB1PUbW1kUbW1kVfA1kVfA@
Click to expand...

I don't know why you posted the cuetable in reference to this topic because no spin is necessary...and if it was the method described would not create any.

Regards,
Jim
 
XxMerlinxX said:
I don't think it'd be possible to "spin" the cue and make a shot, but a good full twist of the wrist can put the desired amount of sidespin on the ball.
Click to expand...


C'mon...you're kidding right? This is all a joke?

But seriously...I've been working on forcefully exhaling just as I make CB contact. I've found that if I twist my head toward the side of the CB to which I want to impart english that the rush of breath adds significantly to the amount of spin.



(-:
 
No, he is not blowing smoke.

penoy78 said:
Wanted to get some peoples opinions on this. A buddy of mine was telling me how he "spins" or rotates his cue on certain shots. So my question here is...Does anyone else do that? And if so, in what situation would you need it in?

It seems to me that this complicates shots but I just had to ask.

I'm just trying to find out if he's blowing smoke up my butt. Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Spinning the cue is a great technique to learn and master. It is mainly used when attempting to widen the angle of a bank shot far beyond what an extreme cut with boo coo english will provide for. The all time master of this technique among living players has got to be, Truman Hogue" If you doubt me, read the back cover of Freddy Bentivegna's Book, "Banking With The Beard"

Quote: "The Beard snitched off evry secret except my famous "Wrist Turn" shot.

This shot is easily learned and quickly mastered if you dedicate the time and effort. It will pay huge dividends when you need it!


Cross Side Larry

"Learn from the best, and beat the rest"
 
Blackjack said:
I was talking to a very well known player from the Philippines about this same subject about 3-4 years ago. I told him that I had been crucified by many people on the internet for teaching this method - a method he had personally showed me a few years earlier. I told him about the comments and the consensus of the crowd that said "this is impossible" or "that is impossible". He didn't seem surprised at all.

He simply shrugged his shoulders and said this:
"That is why those people and none of their students will never reach the playing level of the Filipino players."
Now he wasn't talking about the playing level of Efren, Francisco, Jose, or Ronnie - he was talking about your average pool hall player in Manila.

I don't believe in "impossible". I once had somebody tell me I would never run a hundred. One day I did it. Then I did it again. And Again. Then one day I ran 200. So much for "impossible".

To be a great player, you need to place the words "That's Impossible" into the same file where you put Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, and the Easter Bunny - it doesn't exist.


Edit: FTR, Keith McCready just made a post about using this same method and recommended that a player learn how to do this... Me, I'd listen to Keith.
Click to expand...

With all due respect to you and the Filipino player..

A) Every Filipino player in the world today can be and has been beaten by players form several nations. They are wonderful players...legenary players but they are not "perfect" players or anything close to it.

B) Any teacher who would teach his students to put LOOPS in their strokes like Django should be drummed out of the business because their students don't have the muscle control and coordination to pull it off.

C) There are other ways to achieve CB spin...and last time I studied the matter...spin is spin.

D) Someone forgot to tell Reyes about this technique. Check out the video that shows his stroke from several angles and in slow motion. He uses NO "drive shaft" rotation of the cue whatsoever as is PROVEN by the fact that there is no rotation in the inlays of his cue.

He does have a slight slip stroke that I had not noticed before.

Regards,
Jim

http://youtube.com/watch?v=V6sKPP9nuis

Regards,
Jim
 
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av84fun said:
B) Any teacher who would teach his students to put LOOPS in their strokes like Django should be drummed out of the business because their students don't have the muscle control and coordination to pull it off.

Regards,
Jim
Click to expand...

Jim, I was not talking about Efren or Francisco. I'm sure Efren has a pretty unique stroke. I have seen him twirl some spin in the past.

Here is a direct quote from the foremost authority of "twirling the cue" - Keith made this post a few days ago -

Keith McCready said:
One tip that you may want to use, if you don't use it already, I like to twirl my fingers on the hand that holds the cue and twist the cue around sometimes. Don't hold the cue tightly. You can experiment with a lot more shots when you twirl. It helps a lot with your spin shots, top right, top left, low right, and let's not forget about your inside lefts. Keep twirling, and you'll find that you can get to feel these shots a lot better and make them with a lot more ease, once you master all the twirl feels. Trust me, I did it all the time when I was experimenting in practice. It really works.
Click to expand...

I have been using this and teaching this for years, drum away.

:p
 
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I ave been using this and teaching this for years, drum away.
Click to expand...

BJ,
Just so I'm clear (or everyone else is too I guess)...are you saying that the cue stick is spinning in your back hand while the tip hits cue ball?

Or is it something you do to keep the grip lose pre shot?
 
Thunderball said:
BJ,
Just so I'm clear (or everyone else is too I guess)...are you saying that the cue stick is spinning in your back hand while the tip hits cue ball?

Or is it something you do to keep the grip lose pre shot?
Click to expand...

Yes and Yes. Re-read Keith's description of "twirling" the cue. It's fun to experiment with and to incorporate it into your little bag of tricks, and it does work.
 
penoy78 said:
He gave me a "show and tell" and the best way that I can describe it is that he spins the cue with the figer tips in his back hand. I hope this makes sense. Thanks.
Click to expand...

That is either just habbit, or he is rotating the shaft to line up the grain the same way on the shots. If he does this mid-stoke, he is a D player.
 
hang-the-9 said:
That is either just habbit, or he is rotating the shaft to line up the grain the same way on the shots. If he does this mid-stoke, he is a D player.
Click to expand...


Yes. Just to clarify, he spins it mid-stroke. I spin the cue while lining up but that's only to make sure that I'm not gripping the cue too hard. But he'll actually spin it mid-stroke. I guess the better way to explain it is like someone else here explained it....He's actually twisting his wrist mid-stroke to create the action on the cue that he wants. It seems like we're getting mixed reactions here. Some people do it and some don't. Thanks for everyone's opinion on it though. I greatly appreciate everyone's help on this forum. take care.
 
Does it spin during the final, forward stroke?
Click to expand...

I try to keep an open mind when I read things posted here,especially when they are put forth by players well above my own speed.

That said,I can not make heads or tails of this one.What is gained exactly?

Also,if I try tried to introduce this into my already uneven game,I may not ever make a ball lol.
Speaking honestly.... with no bad intent towards anyone who is for the "spin the cue on the final stroke" school of thought....this just seems kinda nuts.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding.

Can a brother get a youtube of this in action?That would help no doubt.
 
I wouldn't do it on final stroke. If my nerves started effecting my arm, I would on the practice strokes and the final address to CB.
 
Bob Jewett said:
Does it spin during the final, forward stroke?
Click to expand...

Bob,

I'm not sure if it does or not. I know when I was watching him play Chris Bartrum he was spinning it pretty good! Might need slo-motion to be sure or maybe someone can ask Alex.

Kelly
 
gutshot said:
Bob,

I'm not sure if it does or not. I know when I was watching him play Chris Bartrum he was spinning it pretty good! Might need slo-motion to be sure or maybe someone can ask Alex.

Kelly
Click to expand...
I think it's not that hard to see. For any normal grip, the only way to spin the cue stick about its axis on the final, forward power stroke is to twist the wrist in or out. This is very, very different from spinning the stick when you are approaching the shot and not putting any power into the shot.

I don't object to the idea of relaxing your hand by rotating the stick during your approach or even in position. Maybe it helps or maybe it doesn't. What I think is totally bogus in this discussion is the idea that you can somehow get better spin on the cue ball by rotating the stick about its axis. It would be interesting to have a shot that requires the "special spin" derived from twirling the stick during the power stroke.
 
av84fun said:
I don't know why you posted the cuetable in reference to this topic because no spin is necessary...and if it was the method described would not create any.

Regards,
Jim
Click to expand...

I posted the cuetable because someone was having a difficult time visualizing in their head what I was describing. If you're saying that there's never any time where you've had a ball that required a ridiculous amount of cut, then perhaps you're just a better player than I am. As for the method not working, I guess you're just not doing it right.
 
I've seen this before. Some people like to twirl, some don't. Does it have any real advantages? I don't know. I personally am not a twirler. But I have seen this guy do it. More pics.
IMG_0535.jpg
 
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