Squirt-test machine available..?

[Peer]

I wonder if someone has a squirt/deflection machine that I could use to test my cues & shafts with? I'm eager to find a more factual/scientific way to this matter rather than rely on Bobby Jewett's skewed perception (no offense).

I'm willing to send or even travel with my cues to have this test done. Hence, any help and/or pointers appreciated. (It's about 10 cues that I'd like to test.)

-- peer

 

[randyg]

I wonder if someone has a squirt/deflection machine that I could use to test my cues & shafts with? I'm eager to find a more factual/scientific way to this matter rather than rely on Bobby Jewett's skewed perception (no offense).

I'm willing to send or even travel with my cues to have this test done. Hence, any help and/or pointers appreciated. (It's about 10 cues that I'd like to test.)

-- peer

Contact Preditor Cues.

I wish I had some of "Bobby Jewett's skewed perception".....SPF=randyg

 

[shankster8]

You say you want ". . .to test my cues & shafts. . . I'm eager to find a more factual/scientific way to this matter rather than rely on Bobby Jewett's skewed perception. . ."

I am curious, what method did Jewett recommend?

 

[Bob Jewett]

... I am curious, what method did Jewett recommend?

I shoot a shot with lots of side spin and compare the cue to the one I use normally. See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te-iCc-2NxQ for an example shot.

There is another way to do it by measuring the pivot point of the stick that gives good cancellation of squirt for shots with lots of side, but that measurement tends to be polluted by swerve if you're not careful.

 

[JimS]

I shoot a shot with lots of side spin and compare the cue to the one I use normally. See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te-iCc-2NxQ for an example shot.

There is another way to do it by measuring the pivot point of the stick that gives good cancellation of squirt for shots with lots of side, but that measurement tends to be polluted by swerve if you're not careful.

So, is there a robot pool playing squirt test machine?

 

[dr_dave]

I wonder if someone has a squirt/deflection machine that I could use to test my cues & shafts with? I'm eager to find a more factual/scientific way to this matter rather than rely on Bobby Jewett's skewed perception (no offense).

I'm willing to send or even travel with my cues to have this test done. Hence, any help and/or pointers appreciated. (It's about 10 cues that I'd like to test.)

You don't need a machine. You can easily measure and compare cues on your own per the info here:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/cue.html#pivot​

The amount of squirt (CB deflection) a cue creates is directly related to its "natural pivot length."

Happy measuring and comparing,
Dave

 

[Bob Jewett]

So, is there a robot pool playing squirt test machine?

There are at least two robots: Iron Willie, and the Myth Destroyer.

http://www.meuccicues.com/myth.htm

http://www.predatorcues.com/predator_cues_rd.php

There are other robots that play pool, but so far as I know none of them is set up to measure/compare squirt.

 

[dr_dave]

There are at least two robots: Iron Willie, and the Myth Destroyer.

http://www.meuccicues.com/myth.htm

http://www.predatorcues.com/predator_cues_rd.php

There are other robots that play pool, but so far as I know none of them is set up to measure/compare squirt.

We also designed and built one at Colorado State University, but I no longer have it. The sponsor, who wishes to remain anonymous, has it now. Results from various tests with our machine can be found in my February '08 and my August '08 articles. We didn't have a name for it, but if you want one, how about: CSR (Csu Squirt Robot).

Regards,
Dave

 

[Shaft]

Yes, more quantification please

I think the sport and the players and most manufacturers are helped by more measurement and quantification:

• Balance point of shaft, butt and assembled cue
• Shaft stiffness - including radial symmetry
• A numerical hardness scale for tips
• Squirt on a standardized scale
• Vibration dampening (?)
• Other (?)

All of these measures should be reported as averages PLUS standard deviations

Players are helped because they can specify and buy what they think they want. Players will begin to equate "good feel" to the factors that contribute to what they like best in the feel.
The sport is helped because quantification will reveal which factors are really important and which ones are not.
Pretty-but-poorly-performing cues will go away, replaced by better quality control.
"Bull Sh** technology breakthroughs" will be more readily apparent.
Custom makers will have more business as more customers get particular about this specification and that specification.

 

[KD Cues]

Machine test

For those who have built a machine for testing deflection, how do you incorporate bridge length and tension? How about grip tension and timing? What about someone who works through the center of the cue ball with the above mentioned forces? How does the machine generate an organic curve that has the stroke and timing of Larry Nevel drawing the ball four or more rails with english?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWtyPrgn2VA

These omitted forces have always puzzled me, sincerely KD.

 

[Bob Jewett]

For those who have built a machine for testing deflection, how do you incorporate bridge length and tension? How about grip tension and timing? What about someone who works through the center of the cue ball with the above mentioned forces? How does the machine generate an organic curve that has the stroke and timing of Larry Nevel drawing the ball four or more rails with english?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWtyPrgn2VA

These omitted forces have always puzzled me, sincerely KD.

The original Iron Willie had some major problems with its "humanity" but I've heard that most of them were fixed for the current version. Some of the other aspects you mention seem not to be problems based on the physics of the shots.

 

[Da Bank]

i think i saw a squirt machine on a porn site once...

 

[KD Cues]

Just curious

Bob or Dr. Dave, I would love to meet with you and hear what you have to say. Let me know if you are coming to So Cal any time in the near future and I will set aside some time to get together. Just pm or e-mail to: xmilekent@hotmail.com and I will be there, thanks, Kent

 

[androd]

question

Am I the only one who doesn't understand one thing in this entire thread ?
with the exception of "DaBank's" post.

 

[dr_dave]

Am I the only one who doesn't understand one thing in this entire thread ?
with the exception of "DaBank's" post.

If you don't understand, but you want to, here are some resources to help:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/squirt.html
http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/aiming.html#compensation​

Basic definitions of all of the terms and phrases can be found here:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/resources/glossary.pdf​

Regards,
Dave

 

[androd]

If you don't understand, but you want to, here are some resources to help:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/squirt.html
http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/aiming.html#compensation​

Basic definitions of all of the terms and phrases can be found here:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/resources/glossary.pdf​

Regards,
Dave

Thanks for the links, but it still seems like gibberish to me. I've been playing a long time. Maybe I'm to old to try and understand, for sure I don't have the attention span to study it. I am sure it would sabotage my game ! Matbe I already know these things, but don't know I do.

 

[Bob Jewett]

Thanks for the links, but it still seems like gibberish to me. I've been playing a long time. Maybe I'm to old to try and understand, for sure I don't have the attention span to study it. I am sure it would sabotage my game ! Maybe I already know these things, but don't know I do.

Capsule version: When you use side spin, the cue ball squirts off to the side away from the tip, a little. Many players don't even notice this -- it's just a subconscious part of their game. The amount of squirt depends on your cue stick, mostly. The main thing to remember is that if you change cue sticks, you should avoid side spin on important shots until you get used to the stick.