Um hey Mac, it's called a friendly jab. It was a joke, an attempt at humor. 
I am sorry you took it to heart.
I am sorry you took it to heart.
Tell me about TAP...
- Thread starter linkui
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FLICKit said:
Hahaha, you're a trip dude. You're cool in my book, even though we disagree on some things.
If you read the thread, you'd have seen the response to that...Sarge said:
FLICKit said:
8 ball then play by the rules... 9-ball then adjust and play by those rules... straight pool, one pocket, ....Sarge said:
In TAP if it's open table and you make a ball and scratch, then you call that a legitimate shot, despite the obvious foul.
Say what you want, this was already discussed... Old news....
Give up the TAP crap....
Hey Flick.....I been away from the board for a week or so because quite frankly, the league has been keeping me very busy. The league I am talking about is the APA. The local APA here just finished their playoffs for Vegas (in their 8 ball I think 3 out of about 100 teams in the entire league go to Vegas, good odds, huh?) Since than my phone has been ringing with alot of players and teams switching to TAP. At their playoff there were players arrested, banned for life and I heard that about 40 players in the first two days had their handicaps raised, (see below). There were less than 50 teams there. Good handicapping system, huh? If look on www.tapleague.com since this thread started, TAP has picked up over 1,100 new members. So while your on your soap box beating your chest on how great the APA is, take your blinders off because less and less people are listening to you. They are TAP members now. 
Here are a few comments (there were more) that have been posted on my message board at www.poolpa.com Remember, these are postings and one email and not my words.
"Sam: Thanks for all the info and time to discuss the potential for a Monday Night Greensburg Session. As I indicated, I am from an EX-APA Team that's extremely interested in Monday night 8 Ball because WE ARE FINISHED with the APA, at least for the way this area APA operates and treats those of us that are interested in a fair game of pool and rankings."
"Sam, that tourney was so out of wack...they raised probably 40 people in 2 days...I wore my TAP shirt yesterday there"
The email was.....They aren't actually booting people for mentioning TAP....when (name witheld) hears it....they wait until you swear or something and boot you for that. I know that they booted Jim because he swore right after he told (name witheld) that he's glad he doesn't play with us because everyone who does moves up to 7's had said something about the TAP league. (Name witheld) tried to throw the Mt Pleasant kids out the other night after saying how much better TAP was...using swearing as an excuse."
When you treat people like that, how do you expect to keep your league? With League ops like this, it makes my job so easy. In fact the APA ops here are my best recruiters. Maybe I should put them on the payroll.
One side note on the no slop rule. TAP 8 ball is call pocket, not slop. TAP 9 ball is Texas Express (without the 3 foul rule) which is slop but we are playing the way the pros play, not counting points for each ball made.
Here are a few comments (there were more) that have been posted on my message board at www.poolpa.com Remember, these are postings and one email and not my words.
"Sam: Thanks for all the info and time to discuss the potential for a Monday Night Greensburg Session. As I indicated, I am from an EX-APA Team that's extremely interested in Monday night 8 Ball because WE ARE FINISHED with the APA, at least for the way this area APA operates and treats those of us that are interested in a fair game of pool and rankings."
"Sam, that tourney was so out of wack...they raised probably 40 people in 2 days...I wore my TAP shirt yesterday there"
The email was.....They aren't actually booting people for mentioning TAP....when (name witheld) hears it....they wait until you swear or something and boot you for that. I know that they booted Jim because he swore right after he told (name witheld) that he's glad he doesn't play with us because everyone who does moves up to 7's had said something about the TAP league. (Name witheld) tried to throw the Mt Pleasant kids out the other night after saying how much better TAP was...using swearing as an excuse."
When you treat people like that, how do you expect to keep your league? With League ops like this, it makes my job so easy. In fact the APA ops here are my best recruiters. Maybe I should put them on the payroll.
One side note on the no slop rule. TAP 8 ball is call pocket, not slop. TAP 9 ball is Texas Express (without the 3 foul rule) which is slop but we are playing the way the pros play, not counting points for each ball made.
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linkui said:
I think Robert hurt his feelings when he threw him out of TAP and now he has to play in a inferior league. I would be bitter too. To have to play in a league like that when down deep you know there is a better one in town. No wonder he is on this board so much. He doesn't have to practice anymore. He can just slop balls in.
Sam at TAP said:I think Robert hurt his feelings when he threw him out of TAP and now he has to play in a inferior league. I would be bitter too. To have to play in a league like that when down deep you know there is a better one in town. No wonder he is on this board so much. He doesn't have to practice anymore. He can just slop balls in.
All about spin with you... Like I said, I expect it from you. No change... Always have and always will.
LOL...
You want to get into some of the details.... First of all, be accurate.
First, I told Robert, due to all the problems with the TAP league, that I will not be returning. Robert responded with an e-mail which stated that my TAP membership has been revoked.
It was all pretty funny to me... You can't quit, you're fired! LOL.
Afterwards, I had so many players approach me and agree that what TAP did wasn't right. I really appreciate and value those numerous people that supported me. It made a big difference during those strenuous times with that League.
Currently, I have players constantly approaching me about problems that they've encountered from playing in the TAP league. Some players that I've talked to say they don't want to join any league, because there experiences in the TAP league were so bad.
I haven't been relaying their experiences. I'll let them do that on their own. I've just relayed my own bad experiences.
They in TAP accused me of causing all the problems in their league. In an effort to keep the peace and friendliness, I backed down numerous times. The TAP people never did, and instead tried to attack more. So I left, on my own accord. It wasn't worth the trouble.
The funny thing is that after I left, those same TAP players had a major fallout with each other, during the following season and seasons to come. There's just something in their culture.
I've had 0 problems with players and issues in leagues I play in ever since. I'll repeat 0. Since you now wanted to take it to details, let's see if you have any details of any issues I've had during league play since. Talk to your cronies and see what they can dig up regarding issues since leaving TAP. I challenge you on that one.
People can make up their minds on their own, about what is legitimate or what is anti-, always attacking, spin. They can see who is clearly expressing an agenda, and who is responding with honesty.
Oh... and since you made a reference to game skills. My game personally never deteriorated more while I was in TAP. Not only were people so badly rated, that matches didn't have relevance. This has been the opinions expressed by a majority of players in TAP. But, overall basic stroking abilities deteriorated. Pool became frustating and makes you want to just quit the game altogether. I've seen that happen with others...
As soon as I left TAP, my game has bounced right back. My stroking and shotmaking skills and all other aspects of the game have increased leaps and bounds since then. I am very happy as a result, and have never even wanted to go back.
The rules in APA are more in favor of offense. While the rules in TAP gives a much bigger advantage on defense. Defense is useful for winning games in certain situations, but overall good offense is what has you improve your skills. Defense can also get you a number of cheap wins. With the TAP rules all you have to do is to do a half-assed defense, and odds are you'll be rewarded. But in an offensive or more balanced game, like 9-ball, you need a much stronger defensive shot, cuz any hit on an object ball, can reverse the situation in your opponents favor. That kind of attention to detail is what improves one's game.
You can argue all you want and do all the politics stuff you like, but personal experiences are just that.
You can make assumptions all you want. You can try to attack, you can even try to divert the issues, and try again with a different line of attack. Such is to be expected...
You should quit posting Flick. Your really starting to ramble on and on and on and on. Seems your the one on tilt now. I know Robert personally and he is a good and honest person. I will take his word over yours any day of the week. What's the matter? I hit a nerve a little to close to home. Isn't it amazing how you can't hide behind this computer now that I and everyone else know your story. You got banned from TAP and you got a axe to grind. Simple as that. TILT!!
Game skills? Slopping balls improved your game? Maybe because you couldn't handle the better competition in TAP. With APA's 23 pt. rule, teams break up quicker and players have to recruit weaker players to get under the limit. End result. A diluted player base of weaker players.
Spin? Where is the spin? Here is what the TAP home page says....."New TAP Members for the month of May 2005. 1,161 as of May 26th. Welcome to all."......Truth....not spin.
Game skills? Slopping balls improved your game? Maybe because you couldn't handle the better competition in TAP. With APA's 23 pt. rule, teams break up quicker and players have to recruit weaker players to get under the limit. End result. A diluted player base of weaker players.
Spin? Where is the spin? Here is what the TAP home page says....."New TAP Members for the month of May 2005. 1,161 as of May 26th. Welcome to all."......Truth....not spin.
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You're so pathetic... LOL...
Every time you open your mouth to make a point, as soon as the details come to light, you cower away. Typical. LOL....
You wanted details, you got em. Now you have nothing else on topic to say. So go ahead with your squirmy little rants...
Aren't you supposed to be a TAP top executive. Yet you stoop so low...
Your attitude is shameful. Such a pity. You're so tilted you don't even see it.
Every time you open your mouth to make a point, as soon as the details come to light, you cower away. Typical. LOL....
You wanted details, you got em. Now you have nothing else on topic to say. So go ahead with your squirmy little rants...
Aren't you supposed to be a TAP top executive. Yet you stoop so low...
Your attitude is shameful. Such a pity. You're so tilted you don't even see it.
Ive played 1 APA session and have never played a TAP session. With that out of the way...
"OK... I see how you're defining it. You call the pocket, and you don't care how sloppy it gets there. If it goes 7 rails and goes in the pocket, it's not slop. If it richochets off many other balls, no matter, it's not slop. OK, I see how you play it. So, it's not a matter of whether it's a good shot or bad shot, but simply a matter of whether you're lucky enough to get it into that pocket, no matter how sloppy the route. OK, I see your point."
It is ludicrous that you are trying to say that having to call a pocket (in TAP) and having a ball go off another ball or perhaps go a couple rails around the table and back into that pocket is the same as a spray and pray shot in the APA. There may be some luck involved in shitting a shot in to a called pocket in a manner which you didnt intend BUT you had to some to some sort of conclusion as to which pocket you thought the ball was going to go in. This arguement is part of why your posts in my opinion lost some meaning. Instead of seeing what we all see (that TAP rules of call pocket results in a loss less percentage for an oppertunity of shitting a shot in than does the rules of APA) you continue to argue that there is too much slop in TAP. If you would have just agreed to what we all see then your other arguements might carry more weight instead of just looking like arguments for the sake of arguing.
You know we have disagreed in most of the threads we have both been part of but I came to this thread with an open mind and im calling it how I see it with facts to back it up. (APA = 6/6 chances of legally pocketing a ball TAP = 1/6 chance of legally pocketing a ball, it doesnt take a mathematician to see the difference in legally pocketing a ball thus the APA allows for 5/6th more oppertunity to shit in an object ball and have it count I believe thats 83-84% more chance of slop in the APA based on your own argument... so is there slop in TAP, yep it seems there is, is there DRASTICALLY LESS opportunity for it in TAP... yep there is 83% less in fact.
ALl of the above is merely pointing out one protion of your arguements, noone else but you was splitting hairs and thats the problem. Argueing with you has no point, as soon as legitimate factors start to be brought up you should them down because the specifics are not 100% rather than seeing that they are 83% in favor of one over the other and then moving on to the next factor at hand.
In all honesty I just want to play pool, even though I know there is no unflawed rating system out there I like to try as many things as i can, if it starts to hurt then I have the opportunity to stick it out and try to make it better or quit.
Sam its possible I might try a TAP session as it would be nice having better chances at moving on and or travelling to play. Right now my APA team will be playing for #1 in our division next saturday and then hopefully playing to move on... so things arent going too badly for us but having more opportunity to play is nice. I seem to remember last year or the year before there being a blonde haired female TAP rep that came down to my club and spoke with my gf's father about trying to get a TAP team playing out of our place but I believe it never was tried. (we have 4 APA 8 ball teams and 1 APA 9 ball team a week out of our club currently)
Also I mentioned in a thread 3 days ago that the reason the APA had a 23 rule was so teams would have to break up and it would mean more growth and more money. (its a business however and thats how business works) The main complaints I hear and see about my local APA is that its all about padding their pockets and some about sandbagging.
-Lou
"OK... I see how you're defining it. You call the pocket, and you don't care how sloppy it gets there. If it goes 7 rails and goes in the pocket, it's not slop. If it richochets off many other balls, no matter, it's not slop. OK, I see how you play it. So, it's not a matter of whether it's a good shot or bad shot, but simply a matter of whether you're lucky enough to get it into that pocket, no matter how sloppy the route. OK, I see your point."
It is ludicrous that you are trying to say that having to call a pocket (in TAP) and having a ball go off another ball or perhaps go a couple rails around the table and back into that pocket is the same as a spray and pray shot in the APA. There may be some luck involved in shitting a shot in to a called pocket in a manner which you didnt intend BUT you had to some to some sort of conclusion as to which pocket you thought the ball was going to go in. This arguement is part of why your posts in my opinion lost some meaning. Instead of seeing what we all see (that TAP rules of call pocket results in a loss less percentage for an oppertunity of shitting a shot in than does the rules of APA) you continue to argue that there is too much slop in TAP. If you would have just agreed to what we all see then your other arguements might carry more weight instead of just looking like arguments for the sake of arguing.
You know we have disagreed in most of the threads we have both been part of but I came to this thread with an open mind and im calling it how I see it with facts to back it up. (APA = 6/6 chances of legally pocketing a ball TAP = 1/6 chance of legally pocketing a ball, it doesnt take a mathematician to see the difference in legally pocketing a ball thus the APA allows for 5/6th more oppertunity to shit in an object ball and have it count I believe thats 83-84% more chance of slop in the APA based on your own argument... so is there slop in TAP, yep it seems there is, is there DRASTICALLY LESS opportunity for it in TAP... yep there is 83% less in fact.
ALl of the above is merely pointing out one protion of your arguements, noone else but you was splitting hairs and thats the problem. Argueing with you has no point, as soon as legitimate factors start to be brought up you should them down because the specifics are not 100% rather than seeing that they are 83% in favor of one over the other and then moving on to the next factor at hand.
In all honesty I just want to play pool, even though I know there is no unflawed rating system out there I like to try as many things as i can, if it starts to hurt then I have the opportunity to stick it out and try to make it better or quit.
Sam its possible I might try a TAP session as it would be nice having better chances at moving on and or travelling to play. Right now my APA team will be playing for #1 in our division next saturday and then hopefully playing to move on... so things arent going too badly for us but having more opportunity to play is nice. I seem to remember last year or the year before there being a blonde haired female TAP rep that came down to my club and spoke with my gf's father about trying to get a TAP team playing out of our place but I believe it never was tried. (we have 4 APA 8 ball teams and 1 APA 9 ball team a week out of our club currently)
Also I mentioned in a thread 3 days ago that the reason the APA had a 23 rule was so teams would have to break up and it would mean more growth and more money. (its a business however and thats how business works) The main complaints I hear and see about my local APA is that its all about padding their pockets and some about sandbagging.
-Lou
VP of Sales?
I finally decided to read this thread to see what was keepin it alive. This has to be one of the funnyest threads I have ever seen. Here we have the VP of Sales for the tap league involved in a flame war, on an internet message board. Is the VP of Sales actually a paid position, or did they give you a title in lieu of pay? Most importantly, where did you gain these fine marketing skills? Any company that expects to be taken serious would fire you on the spot.
It was obvious from the beginning of this thread that Flick It had a grudge against tap. You brainiacs let him sucker you into an all out flame war. I bet this will have people beating down the door to join tap.
I have been visiting pool related message boards for several years now, and have never saw APA represenatives trolling for members or bashing other leagues. It could be that they are to busy running and growing their own business?
I finally decided to read this thread to see what was keepin it alive. This has to be one of the funnyest threads I have ever seen. Here we have the VP of Sales for the tap league involved in a flame war, on an internet message board. Is the VP of Sales actually a paid position, or did they give you a title in lieu of pay? Most importantly, where did you gain these fine marketing skills? Any company that expects to be taken serious would fire you on the spot.
It was obvious from the beginning of this thread that Flick It had a grudge against tap. You brainiacs let him sucker you into an all out flame war. I bet this will have people beating down the door to join tap.
I have been visiting pool related message boards for several years now, and have never saw APA represenatives trolling for members or bashing other leagues. It could be that they are to busy running and growing their own business?
Razor_Blade said:
Look at my first posts Razor. I never trolled for members, attempted to sale a license or anything that you say. I never once asked anyone to play TAP. I didn't even start this thread and to be quite honest with you, I visited this board very, very seldom. I have better things to do with my time. I was told about the post and came on to defend TAP. I also mentioned that I did not want to get in a "flame war" as you say with anyone but it always happens. That's why I try to stay off these boards. I know how words get twisted on these boards and to be quite frank about it, it gets very boring. But when someone posts lies and untrue rumors about people I know and TAP than I will post something on here defending both. I exposed Flick for exactly what he is, a disgruntled and banned ex TAP member.
And what is in a name? Sure I am VP of sales. Big deal. I am and always will be first a pool player like everyone else here. I don't put no airs on about a position or name. People that know me know that I really don't care about that sort of thing. The reason I have this position is that I have sold more licenses for TAP than anyone. Period. It's easy to sale something when you believe in it 100%. I could have hid under a fake name on here but I didn't. Unlike most everyone here, you all know who I am but I see names like Flick, Razor, etc. Put your name up if your going to attack organization or a person. I don't care what you think of me, what you think of my marketing skills or anything else. I am good at what I do and I know it. Instead of saying when is the last time a APA rep with that kind of position came on here and hashed it out with us you should ask is WHY don't they come on here and hash it out?