The aches about shaft deflection and others!

SlickRick_PCS

SlickRick_PCS

Pool, Snooker, Carom
Silver Member
Ok, I have read throughout the search sections about cue deflection and shafts. I am currently looking for a cue shaft that I would like to put on my Viking only that it is entirely confusing to know what I want. I have read from so many posts that one shaft (Tiger) has a tendancy to deflect alot. Predators are notorious of giving no deflection and having it being felt like a one-piece cue.

I don't know, I just want something that is in the middle: Where I could use the deflection for shots such as masses and kick shots (when needed) and not to use deflection, such as long shots requiring English... so to say.

It all comes down to these questions, AZers: What is your philosophy, psychology of a shaft? What purpose do you want out of it? Why?! Does the taper make any difference when playing?

It is very confusing knowing what I would want to buy if I know in the long run it's only going to bite me in the ass. I need advice. Thank you. :)
 
Well I suggest that you wait until the Derby City get together & attend that function. You can then try everyone of the shafts in Louisville, until you find that "Magic Wand" you are looking for.

Good Luck...
 
You are going to get as many different responses as there are AZers!

As a few AZers can attest to, I could babble for hours about shaft wood, GPI, cuts, density, tapers, growth, timbre, normalization, etc.

But I don't think any of that matters, because you only made reference to 2 shafts and they are both manufactured products with lots of glue.

But to each his own! So buy one of the manufactured shafts, say an OB1 if you must go that way, and hit with it for 6 months. Then try a P314 for 6 months.

Yes, taper makes all the difference in the world, as does ferrule & tip combo. So try a different tip every few months to see what works for you.

There's not a right & wrong shaft, per se. Only what YOU like. But to know what you like, you must hit with many different ones over an extended period.

-von
 
SlickRick_PCS said:
...I don't know, I just want something that is in the middle: Where I could use the deflection for shots such as masses and kick shots (when needed) and not to use deflection, such as long shots requiring English... so to say. ...
Click to expand...
I don't know of any shot that can be shot more easily with a high-squirt cue. Do you have a specific example?
 
jon21588 said:
I do, Bob. Here it is:
Click to expand...


I completely disagree that a shaft will have any effect on a shot over another shaft with regards to squirt/deflection(once a player can compensate for it).

After the cue ball leaves the tip, it only has a speed and a spin. Depending on the spin the cue ball will masse a bit, but this is independent to the shaft.

If you hit it differently with the pred then you need to adjust how much you are cheating the pocket because squirt shouldn't have any effect once the tip has left the cue.
 
MacGyver said:
I completely disagree that a shaft will have any effect on a shot over another shaft with regards to squirt/deflection(once a player can compensate for it).

After the cue ball leaves the tip, it only has a speed and a spin. Depending on the spin the cue ball will masse a bit, but this is independent to the shaft.

If you hit it differently with the pred then you need to adjust how much you are cheating the pocket because squirt shouldn't have any effect once the tip has left the cue.
Click to expand...

Agreed. But many players are telling me, that you can get more spin with the 314 than with a normal shaft. So there is a little differences on it.
 
Bob Jewett said:
I don't know of any shot that can be shot more easily with a high-squirt cue. Do you have a specific example?
Click to expand...

Perhaps this shot?:

CueTable Help



With a hight squirt shot, you can look and aim more at the direction of the 1-ball.
 
WesleyW said:
Perhaps this shot?:

With a hight squirt shot, you can look and aim more at the direction of the 1-ball.
Click to expand...

Thats a masse shot, if you are aiming them by looking at the obj ball instead of accounting for your spin and speed you won't be making very many.

Even if a que DID squirt enough to clear a ball, it would only do so at a certain distance which means all masse shots you need to shoot not at that distance are going to be off as well.

I'd much rather aim where I want and apply the right spin to get it towards the one than rely on my cue squirt and hope it goes.
 
MacGyver said:
Thats a masse shot, if you are aiming them by looking at the obj ball instead of accounting for your spin and speed you won't be making very many.

Even if a que DID squirt enough to clear a ball, it would only do so at a certain distance which means all masse shots you need to shoot not at that distance are going to be off as well.

I'd much rather aim where I want and apply the right spin to get it towards the one than rely on my cue squirt and hope it goes.
Click to expand...

I wanna play too. What about this shot? For some reason I think deflection helps out a lot here.

CueTable Help

 
SlickRick_PCS said:
Ok, I have read throughout the search sections about cue deflection and shafts. I am currently looking for a cue shaft that I would like to put on my Viking only that it is entirely confusing to know what I want. I have read from so many posts that one shaft (Tiger) has a tendancy to deflect alot. Predators are notorious of giving no deflection and having it being felt like a one-piece cue.

I don't know, I just want something that is in the middle: Where I could use the deflection for shots such as masses and kick shots (when needed) and not to use deflection, such as long shots requiring English... so to say.

It all comes down to these questions, AZers: What is your philosophy, psychology of a shaft? What purpose do you want out of it? Why?! Does the taper make any difference when playing?

It is very confusing knowing what I would want to buy if I know in the long run it's only going to bite me in the ass. I need advice. Thank you. :)
Click to expand...

A low deflection shaft will help you pocket balls when using english. Which one you choose is up to you. Currently it seems the ob1 is the one many people are choosing followed by the Predator 314 and then Ithink the Predator Z. There are others too and I don't know them all and I don't know which is the "best". Tests were done a while back and they show the Predator Z 2 to be the shaft w/the least deflection but it is not the most popular. Click on this link http://www.platinumbilliards.com/rating_deflect.php

Bottom line. Buy the one you feel is the coolest and you'll shoot better.
 
How about a solid hit? A stiffer cue with more deflection has a more solid hit than a low deflection shaft (if I'm not wrong). I think some peoples like a better feedback instead of a low deflection shaft.
 
MacGyver said:
I completely disagree that a shaft will have any effect on a shot over another shaft with regards to squirt/deflection(once a player can compensate for it).

After the cue ball leaves the tip, it only has a speed and a spin. Depending on the spin the cue ball will masse a bit, but this is independent to the shaft.

If you hit it differently with the pred then you need to adjust how much you are cheating the pocket because squirt shouldn't have any effect once the tip has left the cue.
Click to expand...

Have I got a shaft for you!

Sucker squirts more than a juicy lemon!

VERY hard to control when shooting hard with english!

Feels great, feels awesome actually, but is very difficult to adjust to. I tried for more than a year, and it's on those iffy shots where squirt will really come into play on long distance and medium distance and short distance shots (!!) that it's particularly tough.

Hey, wanna buy it? Made by Ed Young, in 5/16 X 18 joint, probably about an 11.5 mm tip now.

By the way, this shaft is GREAT for breaking. What power!

Flex
 
Shaft Selection and 'Squirt'

I really love having a day off to play on the internet???

AND I always enjoy these threads?so here goes

The best advice I can give you is to choose a shaft with characteristics (personality) you feel that you can/need to adjust to most readily. This is personal choice in my opinion. Don?t let the deflection rap psyche you?every shaft will require some adjustment/judgment and within a relevant range you can master most of them?which is what I think you are looking for.

It is no secret I am of the school that contends a low squirt shaft may require somewhat less dimensional judgment (a term I just coined for this post)?and I do think it is a good idea to eliminate such pesky ?error? in the early going. Once you master the shaft you are playing with there are few, if any, shots that are relatively easier with a ?low squirt? shaft if you consider the full range of decisions/adjustments/compensations that must made to accomplish a shot within a relevant range of tables and atmospheric, cloth, cleanliness, etc conditions BECAUSE the increase in precision afforded you by a ?low squirt? shaft is, in my opinion, not material to the entire calculation required. I could be wrong but I haven't heard ?low squirt? shaft makers challenging higher level players with claims like ?our player can do things with our shaft that you can?t do with yours?. That would probably be because they don?t think they can pass that test?not because they are too nice. I'm not really sure it would matter to lesser players anyway.

In the sports equipment business (and most competitive arenas) it is commonly known (and axiomatic) that wringing out the last 10% of competitive advantage is hard fought and expensive?AND only relevant after reaching the 90% pinnacle. In other words, it would do precious little good to put a slick nylon suit and pear shaped helmet on a kid riding his bicycle in the neighborhood but DOES, in fact, really help a Tour de France rider.

IN OTHER WORDS??low squirt? is NOT and NEVER WILL BE a substitute for mastery. I will concede that at some early point a low squirt shaft may help some people make the early adjustments however I will also tell you that finding the correct combination of equipment is the Holy Grail. My opinion is the ?low squirt? shafts have very little personality?but that is my opinion. As you progress in your game you will have different needs and you will probably continue to search for better combinations. You will get to the point where you will recognize a hit and do the?been there, done that, show me something different?thing?something new to master and increase the depth of my game.

So take your best shot on this purchase and master your decision. Don?t worry too much about it?get a high quality shaft from a reputable maker/dealer/manufacturer and play with it until you can do what you want to do.

Just my opinion...you be the judge

Hittman
flame on
 
Here I've got one, squirt your way through! I probably wouldn't worry about it too much though

CueTable Help

 
All I'll say about this is: if you think you want a predator, try one before you buy one. If you just go out and buy one, it may take a damn long time to get used to it.
 
I like all the posts that you all are posting up. Keep bringing some advice there, AZer folks :) .

I bought a Viking DeCue series (the grey-wolf) with a 12mm diameter, 16in pro-tapered origional shaft with a quick release thread and it was perspectively meant for only Mud-balled coin-op tables. Big mistake in the long run!! Then I started to progress into the regular 4'x8' tables and to 4.1" x 8.4" tables... both with nappy cloth. I then realized that when I shot around medium-hard, my shaft vibrated... whippy to some. I went on to just playing bar cues (which were 13mm) and I was pretty confortable with them. When I went over to a local sports bar which had 9ft Olhausen tables, I was in a huge "culture shock": The cloth was fast, rails replied sharply and not dead like the latter two, and the pockets were tight! I then realized why it was quite useful to use such a softly, decent cue... deflective I must say. Hitman has a close perspective of what I am talking about.

I told a fellow cueist of mine about the predator and telling him about where the fun is without deflection. I mean, I do use house cues time after time when I go to this sports bar and they're pretty decent 12mm stiff cues, only I would perfer some deflection (not alot!) for shots that requrie them. I know there are some situations where it requires (*as you all posted them.

But that's what I have in say. I would like to hear some more opinions or advice that I can obtain knowlege of. If I am going to buy a shaft for my Viking that is not my style, I will be more confused than satisfied.

And on Pushout's reply, I really don't see alot of cueist with other shafts except either origional or Predators. Where I live at, I can't just grab someone's cue and just use it (of course I have to ask them) but even then, they get this unconfortable feeling about one using their cue. So it's just a respect thing :/ .
 
Drew said:
I wanna play too. What about this shot? For some reason I think deflection helps out a lot here.

CueTable Help

Click to expand...
Is this the one where your stick is pointing directly at the pocket the 9 goes into and you are using extreme left english on the cue ball and the tip sort of slides off the edge of the cue ball and maybe hits the nine straight into the pocket? If that's the shot, I think I can make it with a low-squirt stick.
 
jon21588 said:
I do, Bob. Here it is:

CueTable Help

Click to expand...
You show the right edges of the two balls lined up to the right edge of the pocket. I think having more or less squirt on this shot is not going to help or hurt (except for the aiming). I don't think that shot is possible as shown.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top