The Monk - opinions

[DeadStrokeMan]

What do folks know of him? Is he the 400+ ball man? His books appear to be pretty material.

I've barely heard his name mentioned on this board and was just wondering why not.

I missed a chance to go to one of his 'seminars' in Vegas last summer/fall - should have gone.

 

[catscradle]

What do folks know of him? Is he the 400+ ball man? His books appear to be pretty material.

I've barely heard his name mentioned on this board and was just wondering why not.

I missed a chance to go to one of his 'seminars' in Vegas last summer/fall - should have gone.

JMHO, but ....
I've purchased a couple of his videos and books and found them completely useless. I feel he is a snake oil salesman, a fraud. I haven't the slightest idea if he can play pool and maybe he can teach in person, but the materials he sells definitely strike me as jive. Too much psuedo religion mixed up in what he says. He kind of half explains things under the guise that when you become enlightened you'll understand it.
You're money is much better spent on Byrne's or Capelle's book.
As I said JMHO and I won't be changing it. Any of you Monkites out there can just as well present your opinion to counter it.

 

[sjm]

I don't know much about the man or his pool game, but the Monk's instructional tapes are, in my opinion, superb.

His tapes on banks and kicks have often been mentioned on the forum, and tend to get very high marks from forum members.

 

[sjm]

JMHO, but ....
I've purchased a couple of his videos and books and found them completely useless. I feel he is a snake oil salesman, a fraud. I haven't the slightest idea if he can play pool and maybe he can teach in person, but the materials he sells definitely strike me as jive. Too much psuedo religion mixed up in what he says. He kind of half explains things under the guise that when you become enlightened you'll understand it.
You're money is much better spent on Byrne's or Capelle's book.
As I said JMHO and I won't be changing it. Any of you Monkites out there can just as well present your opinion to counter it.

Try his "Foundation for Banking & Kicking" tapes. They are excellent.

The excellence of the Byrne and Cappelle books is something we seem to see eye to eye on.

 

[strikeout]

Guess everybody is different, but I get more from watching matches like the ones you can buy from accu stats. Actually we have the berne,capelli etc books here and my husband says he learned from some of them, but I would rather read 'Dean Koontz', and play pool.

Laura

 

[DeadStrokeMan]

Hmm - Byrne's or Capelle'

Got any specific book title on these? Byrnes has multiple. I've not read much on pool - just "feel" the game and I can hold my own (Yeah - I'll come back atcha rudeDog )

I have those "monk" books and noted alot of the same kinda stuff mentioned.
We all KNOW the mental game is the 'real deal' - but check this out. When you get a "nugget" of data on info that deal directly with your game, it can SHOOT YOU MENTAL GAME THROUGH THE ROOF. For example: "Trust your stroke" - didn't really dawn on me until I put the mechanics of it in motion - crap runOut fool . And it had nuffin' to dowith the inner "Karma" stuff ... strickly boosted my game into infinity from discovery.

I had posted a thread about that "sting of the cue" in right hand - feeling the bite of the CB as the cue when though it. All that was a "mental discovery" of sorts that gives me fuel to WIN WIN - RUN RUN.

So in terms of reading - I'd love to read those things that expose those "discoveries" that I can use to lean on.

Hey - is 45 too old to compete? - lol

 

[TATE]

What do folks know of him? Is he the 400+ ball man? His books appear to be pretty material.

I've barely heard his name mentioned on this board and was just wondering why not.

I missed a chance to go to one of his 'seminars' in Vegas last summer/fall - should have gone.

The Monk doesn't talk like it, but he was a feared player on the road. He can play 9 ball with the big boys. He's mentioned in "On the Rail" - I think Bucktooth warned Tony Annigoni not to play him.

His big accomplishment in my opinion is the book, "The Lesson". I would say it's geared toward "B" and lower "A" players trying to solidify their pattern and safety play, but any level player will get something out of it. There are also some good drills which have been used by a bunch of instructors.

His work is geared at building a foundation for playing by training the player to recognize certain shots and situations, with drills on how to go about them. It's a good read, not just a bunch of boring drills. He like to use punch shots to get angle and position. That combined with drills build something a player can draw on in competition.

His tapes are just OK - but the book "The Lesson" is all you need.

Chris

 

[DeadStrokeMan]

The Monk doesn't talk like it, but he was a feared player on the road. He can play 9 ball with the big boys. He's mentioned in "On the Rail" - I think Bucktooth warned Tony Annigoni not to play him.

His big accomplishment in my opinion is the book, "The Lesson". I would say it's geared toward "B" and lower "A" players trying to solidify their pattern and safety play, but any level player will get something out of it. There are also some good drills which have been used by a bunch of instructors.

His work is geared at building a foundation for playing by training the player to recognize certain shots and situations, with drills on how to go about them. It's a good read, not just a bunch of boring drills. He like to use punch shots to get angle and position. That combined with drills build something a player can draw on in competition.

His tapes are just OK - but the book "The Lesson" is all you need.

Chris

Thanx - you spoke tons here. My book "the Lesson" (which I've not yet read) is on loan to my good friend and nemesis, Carl. He said the book was really good - so I guess I'll have to read it . Couple of years ago I bought 99 Critical shots - I KNEW THEM ALL ALREADY! - Boring read.

I gotta check out the authors Byrne's and Capelle's mentioned above. I'm not a big fan of reading deep material - only the stuff that quickly "gets to the point". Meandering around the topic tends to make me put the material down.

 

[Secaucus Fats]

Try his "Foundation for Banking & Kicking" tapes. They are excellent.

The excellence of the Byrne and Cappelle books is something we seem to see eye to eye on.

The "Foundation For Banking and Kicking" tapes are done by Dr. Cue (Tom Rossman) the other tapes in the series are by The Monk and they are IMHO pretty much worthless.

SF

 

[catscradle]

Hmm - Byrne's or Capelle'

Got any specific book title on these? Byrnes has multiple. I've not read much on pool - just "feel" the game and I can hold my own (Yeah - I'll come back atcha rudeDog )

I don't know where your game is, but I'd start with Byrne's first book because even if you can shoot already there may be technical information in there you'd find useful.
I think Capelle's "Play Your Best Pool" is broad enough to offer something even if you're an advanced player.
As far as just "feeling" the game, an excellent book on that topic is "The Inner Game of Tennis". Basically it is about just that, feeling the game, not letting your mind interfer with your body which knows what to do.

I have those "monk" books and noted alot of the same kinda stuff mentioned.
We all KNOW the mental game is the 'real deal' - but check this out. When you get a "nugget" of data on info that deal directly with your game, it can SHOOT YOU MENTAL GAME THROUGH THE ROOF. For example: "Trust your stroke" - didn't really dawn on me until I put the mechanics of it in motion - crap runOut fool . And it had nuffin' to dowith the inner "Karma" stuff ... strickly boosted my game into infinity from discovery.

I had posted a thread about that "sting of the cue" in right hand - feeling the bite of the CB as the cue when though it. All that was a "mental discovery" of sorts that gives me fuel to WIN WIN - RUN RUN.

So in terms of reading - I'd love to read those things that expose those "discoveries" that I can use to lean on.

Hey - is 45 too old to compete? - lol

I'm 59 and don't think that is too old to compete, I don't win often but I can still compete.

 

[chefjeff]

I just looked up my copy of Point the Way, copyright 1993, and found this handwritten note from January 1995 to myself inside the cover:

"Non-integrated, mystical, contradictory ramblings. Contains a few snippets of good advice (e.g., life and pool had better complement each other), but fails to tell reader how to USE that advice. On a scale of 1 to 10, I give it a 3."

And, I'm the one here on AZ that SEEMS to post similar advice to Monk's about life and pool. SEEMS to be similar to Monk, but not really. I'm into integration of truths and concepts, all kept in context and all honestly acquired and processed. By mixing the concept of honesty, a lot of Monk's mystical advice falls apart. If I had followed his advice, MY game would have gone backward.

Yet, with that being said, the Monk's works might be just the thing for you, now...only you can tell. My advice is to get the book(s), read them, and they YOU decide. The costs will long be forgotten while the values will forever remain. Just because you may not agree with a book doesn't mean it can't be of value to you, even if the only value is knowing better what to ignore, as in my case.

Byrne's book, The Standard Book of Pool and Billiards, is one to read, for sure....especially if you play billiards. And if you're into science, get Kohler's book, The Science of Pocket Billiards, as it makes great reference material when working on shot making concepts.

I have over 30 books on pool and each of them has added at least one thing to my shot. This is good, cheaper, and faster than figuring it out all by myself.

imho,

Jeff Livingston

 

[Jersey]

I bought The Lesson...and I agree that 'The Monk' can be a little esoteric, but, I found a lot of useful stuff...had the 'eBook' printed and bound at Kinkos...use the practice, shot and stroke routines all the time and have found them to be useful...in eBook/spiral bound form I can lay it out on the table for practice set ups...

What about this Billiards Workbook for $159.95!

 

[Fred Agnir]

What do folks know of him? Is he the 400+ ball man? His books appear to be pretty material.

I've barely heard his name mentioned on this board and was just wondering why not.

I missed a chance to go to one of his 'seminars' in Vegas last summer/fall - should have gone.

Tim "the Monk" Miller is the author of the instructional books.

Warren "the Monk" Costanza is the infamous player.

Don't confuse the two.

Fred

 

[Fred Agnir]

The Monk doesn't talk like it, but he was a feared player on the road. He can play 9 ball with the big boys. He's mentioned in "On the Rail" - I think Bucktooth warned Tony Annigoni not to play him.

His big accomplishment in my opinion is the book, "The Lesson".

Two completely different people, Chris.

Fred

 

[Blackjack]

I bought The Lesson...and I agree that 'The Monk' can be a little esoteric, but, I found a lot of useful stuff...had the 'eBook' printed and bound at Kinkos...use the practice, shot and stroke routines all the time and have found them to be useful...in eBook/spiral bound form I can lay it out on the table for practice set ups...

What about this Billiards Workbook for $159.95!

Not every instructor will fit every student. Tim Miller is very dedicated to the game of pool. He spends a lot of time, money and energy to not only sell his material, but he also hits the road and meets as many of his students as possible. Is it for everybody? Probably not. A lot of people hate the crap I write, but that's life. The Monk's stuff is very pricey, but there are a lot of people that swear by his methods. I always tell my students to read everything they can get their hands on. You never know where the most important piece of your puzzle is going to be hidden. There is a lot of garbage out there, but there is also some very good stuff.

 

[TATE]

Two completely different people, Chris.

Fred

Thanks, Fred!

I wonder if Tim can play?

 

[jungledude]

Great coach not necessary to be great player

I saw the Monk play at the Senior tournament at South Padre Island and he is definetly not a very good player, but his material I think is very good. Some of the really great coaches and managers in baseball were never really good players so I guess this explains why Monk may be able to teach without being a very good player. As Fred said up above, the player in "Playing off the Rail" is Monk Costanza who is a very good player and always has been. Tim Miller has dedicated himself to improving players games and has done a very good job in this department, but please don't bet your lunch money on him beating even average players.

 

[JohnnyP]

Yeah, I bought one of his tapes. Still kicking myself for wasting $60.

He kept talking about some 2-7-2 system. Then he added modifiers, like 2-7-2 plus 5, or plus 2. I think he basically was trying to teach you to get the cueball back to the center of the table.

He really lost me when he called a shot with topspin a draw shot. Then he had the girl in the tape demonstrate a nip draw shot, and how this type of draw actually helps the ball go in the hole. To demonstrate, the girl hit a long shot but the ball hit the rail two feet away from the pocket and it still fell, only because she hit it with pocket speed. Didn't have anything to do with magic nip draw.

 

[BlowFish]

My 2cents.....

As a non-accomplised player, any reading material is very helpful. I found it pretty boring on my first read. For the accomplished ones, then this material is very boring.

My first material was from Tim "The Monk" Miller, which is "Point the Way" and that was a good read (after the first read) and helped me go on a higher level. My next were "The Lesson" and "The Monk 101" DVD and I'm currently on it since the start of this year.

"Point the Way" has helped me move up from a #4 in our team to #1 in terms of point average, which really surprised my team mates 'coz they can beat me most of the time. That was my first team tournament that I joined in. Our team ended in 5th out of 8 teams.

Our bi-weekly Team Open 9-ball (2nd Season) will start in April 2 and ends late November and let's see if "The Lesson" and "The Monk 101" DVD was of any help or maybe I can't improve any more.

After I finish the stuff from "The Monk", I will be looking for other materials from other authors and is inclined to try Brynes and then Capelle.

I am in no way related to/work for Tim "The Monk" Miller or his associates. I'm just a customer.



"Filipinos are feel players, while the Taiwanese are mechanical."

 

[recoveryjones]

Thanks, Fred!

I wonder if Tim can play?

I've got the Monks videos and he and Bert Kinister never miss a shot....LOL while showing their vids. Ahhhh but the things you can edit out with a video camera.

On one of the Monks videos he mentions that he'd like to get together with Bert Kinister and I think one other instructor, (I'm not sure who) and see who can shoot the best.I saw it as him carefully issueing a challenge.I found it kind of comical and unnesesary.Some people like his vids, however, I thought that they were only so so, however, would be good for the B player.I did think that the girl who demonstrates his shots was kinda cute( had a nice ass) so that kept my intrests up enough to watch all three vids.


If you can cut through the thouroughly intensive(sometimes irratating) ramblings of Dr. Cue (who does 3 kicking and banking videos for the Monk) you will find that there are some totlally excellent kicking/banking systems that he teaches in his most excellent videos.These systems have helped me tremedously and I highly reccomend them to anyone who plays nine ball.These are amongst the best of the many instructional videos that are out there.RJ