The REVO is taking over pool

speedi said:
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Maybe it's time for some pool enthusiast (engineer/designer) to invent a substance that gives a phenolic tip the same kind of performance characteristics as chalk does to leather?
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I agree. It is ridiculous to me that the billiards industry has not found anything better than chalked "dead animal skin" in the last 200 years!

My best idea is urethane that comes in a wide range of material properties (including hardness) and colors, or a urethane composite (with strengthening fibers mixed in), with diamond powder (or other suitable abrasive) mixed in before molding. If it works as well as I hope it might, no chalking would be required (although it still might be recommended). Anybody with the desire and time to pursue this idea is welcome to it.

Maybe Predator can take this on as their next project. It could certainly be quite lucrative if a good solution is found.

Regards,
Dave
 
dr_dave said:
I agree. It is ridiculous to me that the billiards industry has not found anything better than chalked "dead animal skin" in the last 200 years!

My best idea is urethane that comes in a wide range of material properties (including hardness) and colors, or a urethane composite (with strengthening fibers mixed in), with diamond powder (or other suitable abrasive) mixed in before molding. If it works as well as I hope it might, no chalking would be required (although it still might be recommended). Anybody with the desire and time to pursue this idea is welcome to it.

Maybe Predator can take this on as their next project. It could certainly be quite lucrative if a good solution is found.

Regards,
Dave
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Non-biodegradable materials deter from the razor business model. They'd have to really market and sell at a significantly higher price point to be lucrative, no?
 
I can see peoples point about buying a revo to avoid the warps and dings associated with wood shafts. But i aint buying the hype some people on here have claimed that they play 2-3 balls better with a revo.

I can say that the guys around here that have bought revos are not playing any better so far. I have faced 3 guys so far that shoot with revos and won all 3 matches using a 20.00 Chinese sneaky Pete I bought brand new 5 years ago .

Last night my team mate who is also a 6 like me was using a players cue and beat a 9 in 9 ball by a score of 17-3 that was using a revo p3 and breaking with a bk rush. My team mate was breaking with a dufferin. I know every one has an off night every once in a while but damn...2,500.00 worth of new technology did not help that 9 one bit last night. Sure it may last longer .
 
lorider said:
I can see peoples point about buying a revo to avoid the warps and dings associated with wood shafts. But i aint buying the hype some people on here have claimed that they play 2-3 balls better with a revo.

I can say that the guys around here that have bought revos are not playing any better so far. I have faced 3 guys so far that shoot with revos and won all 3 matches using a 20.00 Chinese sneaky Pete I bought brand new 5 years ago .

Last night my team mate who is also a 6 like me was using a players cue and beat a 9 in 9 ball by a score of 17-3 that was using a revo p3 and breaking with a bk rush. My team mate was breaking with a dufferin. I know every one has an off night every once in a while but damn...2,500.00 worth of new technology did not help that 9 one bit last night. Sure it may last longer .
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Yeah, it's usually the Indian. But sometimes it might help dramatically; it really depends on the individual's playing. if a player who doesn't know that they're missing because their cue ball is masseing back instead of just purely squirting, the revo may probably fix those 2-3 balls without them knowing exactly why. But for any player who is well aware of what they can or cant do and what their cue can or cant do, it's a different story altogether
 
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Johnny Rosato said:
Well folks, I'm a believer now that the Revo really does improve ones game. For nearly 30 years that I played one of my closest friends, I would average winning 7 or 8 out of 10 games. He sold all his cues cases, etc. and bought all new Predator equipment, case, break and playing cue, both with Revo shafts, and even a Predator glove and chalk. For the past year, my winning average with him has dropped to 6 or 7 games out of 10.
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I’ve read all the posts in this thread and this one should mean more than all the physics, spin, deflection, squirt, stroke speed, cue weight etc. etc. etc.

You’ve played your friend for 30 years so you know his game inside out and the only difference is he changed equipment and suddenly his game is better! If that’s not a testimate to Predator’s equipment I don’t know what is. This isn’t one guys opinion on side spin, squirt, cue weight or what ever this is two men playing each other for 30 years and one changed to Predator equipment and the change came to the weaker player because of the equipment.
 
SCCues said:
I’ve read all the posts in this thread and this one should mean more than all the physics, spin, deflection, squirt, stroke speed, cue weight etc. etc. etc.

You’ve played your friend for 30 years so you know his game inside out and the only difference is he changed equipment and suddenly his game is better! If that’s not a testimate to Predator’s equipment I don’t know what is. This isn’t one guys opinion on side spin, squirt, cue weight or what ever this is two men playing each other for 30 years and one changed to Predator equipment and the change came to the weaker player because of the equipment.
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Or because his new equipment increased the attention he paid to his game. That's the usual reason for "new cue syndrome".

pj
chgo
 
It would be interesting, if there were a way, to see if a player's Fargo rating increased after an equipment change.
 
I'm interested in trying one of these new shafts, but I honestly can't think of a time I missed a shot and it was the equipment's fault. I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with them. I'm just saying I'd have to see it improve my playing to believe it.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Or because his new equipment increased the attention he paid to his game. That's the usual reason for "new cue syndrome".
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'xactly. Nice to see some sanity here.

I got myself 2 new Meucci shafts, The Pro and Ultimate Weapon plus a new cue about 1 year ago. My game improved by at least 1 ball since then - and I can prove it. I kept track in Excel.

So - this proves that you have to buy Meucci shafts in order to play better?

BS.

Fact is, I enjoyed playing and practising more than before and due to increased practice times my game got better. Oh yeah, if I take my old cue off the wall I equally play better, no chit.

Yes, a new cue can make you play better. But don't expect any improvement that can be measured if you keep your practice routine and don't try to cheat yourself.

While the Ultimate Weapon draws slightly better due to a smaller tip, it is also easier to put too much English on the cb than with the Pro. The tips are different from my old cue which makes a difference. Not necessarily in the better/worse department but rather in "different".

So - yes, there can be differences between cues - nobody doubts that. And some cues may also be suited to certain players better than others, no doubt there either.

But I don't believe in a flat earth, UFO's and I don't either believe any myth saying picking up a Revo, Meucci, $20k custom or whatever will really improve your game significantly and in any way that can be scientifically proven. UNLESS you also practice more with that new cue or if you are still on a relatively steep learning curve that was there before quite the same.

Last but not least: I do believe you should buy a Revo if it makes you feel better. Chances are you are going to invest more practice time and thus increase your performance. But there is no way you would suddenly jump from a C to a B or even an A player. If they ever invent that cue or shaft - tell me in secret. But I won't believe it anyway :-)
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Or because his new equipment increased the attention he paid to his game. That's the usual reason for "new cue syndrome".

pj
chgo
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Exactly. This has been proven in golf with new putters. New equipment has the effect of increasing overall brain activity and causes an up-tick in performance. For a while. Pretty soon you're back to your normal self and looking for that next "new cue high". See it all the time.
 
SCCues said:
I’ve read all the posts in this thread and this one should mean more than all the physics, spin, deflection, squirt, stroke speed, cue weight etc. etc. etc.

You’ve played your friend for 30 years so you know his game inside out and the only difference is he changed equipment and suddenly his game is better! If that’s not a testimate to Predator’s equipment I don’t know what is. This isn’t one guys opinion on side spin, squirt, cue weight or what ever this is two men playing each other for 30 years and one changed to Predator equipment and the change came to the weaker player because of the equipment.
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I wasn't gonna mention his Lasik surgery because I want all the credit to go to Predator! lol
 
Agreed on most points in this topic, however, there is such thing as better funcionality out of a higher priced/higher quality product. The revo isn't just a sugar pill that promises 3x weight loss with diet and exercise. Although, placebos are proven to help in most situations with most people, as you noted. Just buying weight loss supplements and getting a gym membership help me earn the motivation to lose weight/bulk up, even if in actuality, the supplements don't do anything. More accurately, it's like comparing a corvette to a 1996 honda civic while saying, "they both get you where you are going".

However, with the revo, its supposedly the lowest deflection cue on the market, they say it better exerts force to where you want it on the cue ball and all of the goodies that come from it being carbon fiber. New cue fever aside, this is probably a better shaft than most of us are playing with and could probably see marginal improvements from using one, just as some people play worse with it because they aren't use to low deflection or what have you. If believing a cue makes me play better in fact, actually makes me play better, doesn't the cue make me play better? I'd wager that all the anti-revo crowd are either playing with $2,000+ custom cues and dislike that there is better technology on the market OR play with $100 dollar dufferin's and insist on their life that its the "person using the equipment, not the equipment". As for myself, i have one on the way today and i have one on my BK rush break cue, as i am a man of min-maxing and perfecting something. Even if in reality, its pocketing one extra ball every10 racks or a fractional increase in english consistency, its a worthy investment for me.

Disclaimer - I'm not pooping on dufferins or custom cues. We are all entitled to our opinions and mine is that you get what you pay for with cheap cues and custom cues, you get something pretty that may not play as well as a manufacturered cue with more advanced technology. To me, just because something is handmade, that doesn't make it better, it leaves room for human error, once again, my opinion. You are also all entitled to hate Revos/predator/kittens, whatever you fancy.
 
Derek7646 said:
...they say it better exerts force to where you want it on the cue ball
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I can make sense of a fiber shaft transferring power (a tiny bit) more efficiently, but what does "to where you want it" mean? Do other cues deliver their power to someplace else?

pj
chgo
 
Patrick Johnson said:
I can make sense of a fiber shaft transferring power (a tiny bit) more efficiently, but what does "to where you want it" mean? Do other cues deliver their power to someplace else?

pj
chgo
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I assume means less deflection. I played with a carom cue a few times that had pretty much zero deflection. Was hard to get used to. I missed shots that I felt like I would have made with my regular cue. But who knows what would have happened if I had kept using it and got used to it.
 
Well, you are entitled to believe what you want. But I call it a myth that a Revo makes you play 1 ball better even in 10 racks. It doesn't. Practice and good fundamentals make you play better. The Revo may increase your fun factor. Ok, go buy one.

Remember all the gadgets that everyone believed to make pool easier? The Sardo rack, the Simonis X-1, the template racks and on and on. Some of them are still around, others are gone or the hype has gone - at least. I am not saying that carbon fiber shafts will go away soon. The advantages are in the dents and scratches being mostly gone but they will have to prove any value beyond that after the first hype is over. And I am sure that most people currently playing with a Revo aren't better than they were before owning one. I beat as many of them as I beat people with other cues. And I lose to as many of them as well. I don't see the need for myself. And I don't play with El Cheapo cues either, my new one cost me well over 1 grand including 2 shafts last year and I am happy with it. I am sure I wouldn't play any worse with a Players or a Dufferin. Any cue for less than $ 100 may have some inferior qualities but once you go well over that price it is just either a status symbol or something you want for it's beauty or that you badly want to believe makes you play better. Efren proved it over many years. YMMV.
 
Yeah, i'm not saying a revo is a "git gud quik" scheme, but its the best cue i have ever played with hands down and i have shot with everything from my friends dufferins to an open players 10k+ custom cue and everything in between. Just got my revo last night and i played a two man team i played three weeks ago in league 1 hour after getting the revo.

3 weeks ago with 314 shaft, soft predator victory tip on a wrapless p3 - Beat this guy mike 6-3 in 8 ball, his friend 6-1 in 9 ball.

Last night with the 12.4 Revo with a medium Kamui clear on a wrapless p3 - Beat mike 6-0 in 8 ball, his friend 6-0 in 9 ball with four total break and runs.

I'm not saying its a magic cue, but i love love love the weight, balance and feel of it. It took me very little time to get used to it after using a 314 and the english almost feels effortless. Its hard to describe and i don't believe its all "new cue factor", maybe partially, but it just hits like a dream. I will let you know how i feel in a month or two but right now, i am completely satisifed with my purchase and would reccomend it to anyone.

But yeah, you do you and i'll do me :)
 
dr_dave said:
I agree. It is ridiculous to me that the billiards industry has not found anything better than chalked "dead animal skin" in the last 200 years!

My best idea is urethane that comes in a wide range of material properties (including hardness) and colors, or a urethane composite (with strengthening fibers mixed in), with diamond powder (or other suitable abrasive) mixed in before molding. If it works as well as I hope it might, no chalking would be required (although it still might be recommended). Anybody with the desire and time to pursue this idea is welcome to it.

Maybe Predator can take this on as their next project. It could certainly be quite lucrative if a good solution is found.

Regards,
Dave
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Really. All us dumb humans still wearing "dead animal skins" on our feet after a couple thousand years. Seriously, isn't it just possible that leather is a very good material for cue tips? All we need is another five hundred tips on the market to confuse players even more.
 
garczar said:
Really. All us dumb humans still wearing "dead animal skins" on our feet after a couple thousand years. Seriously, isn't it just possible that leather is a very good material for cue tips? All we need is another five hundred tips on the market to confuse players even more.
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There is no question that "dead animal skin" is an amazing material, but wouldn't it be nice to have a chalkless tip that has a miscue limit as good or even better than leather? That would definitely be a truly revolutionary innovation in the billiards industry for which people would be willing to pay a premium price.

Regards,
Dave
 
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