the sound of the cue??????
- Thread starter Djay Customs
- Start date
I think so.
Most feedback should be where you grip the cue.
So that's my point. How many of you guys are told where the grip position is? If you have that information can you adjust the cue to match?
This kind of stuff is what I call a Custom Cue rather than I want this wood and that inlay here and there.
Butt Taper V. Sound Quantity
3 K,
I believe that you have hit on a very good point concerning the taper of the butt and sound quantity. Shown below is a pic of one of my cues. I am not sure if you can see it clearly butt there is a parabolic curve that starts at the butt and transitions into the A-Joint area roughly forming a trumpet type effect. This is not an offset but is a distinct arc plotted by a series of arc points when viewed graphically. When holding this cue or sighting it down it is very apparent in person. I won't get info wave propagation, laminar flow pathways, destructive interference cancelation concerning sine wave peaks. I used to be an amateur audio engineer and understand sound and how it is measured and analyzed. Don't think I used any of this when I designed my butt geometry because it was not sound I was trying to control. This is my standard taper because I was seeking to reduce the handle's physical size a tad so I designed the curved taper geometry to my permanent butt taper bar. All of the cues I have ever played with that I liked never had fat handles so I went with it. I loved my Kershsenbroch but I wanted my joint to be larger than David's.
My A-Joint is only .981 which is small by most standards I have observed but my forearm tapers down to .850 at the joint. Kinda like a counter culture or antithesis to a Southwest fat spaghetti noodle concept.
With all that being said as a precursor to your point of contention. Yes, I believe that a trumpet style taper will amplify the tone and here is why I think it's true. I fully core all of my cues with a 29" maple dowel from stem to stern as I wish to eliminate the ring tone of the exotic wood combos so my cues are very quiet and play and feel pretty much the same from cue to cue no matter what combos I choose. Just the way I do things and the way I want my cues to be known for.
The last A Joint cue I made was several years ago and it was the first and only A Joint cue I made with this trumpet style taper. When I hit with that cue I heard a very noticeable ringtone that I believe was from this amplifying geometry of the taper as I had made about 60 A Joint cues previously and was accustomed to the way my cues sounded in general.
How loud was it? It was so loud that I had to put ear plugs in before my next shot fearing OSHA would fine me for noise pollution. :nanner: No seriously, to me it was very noticeable but of coarse this is all subjective concerning cue ring tones. On this one you will have to take my word on it, :duck:, but if you experiment with this type of taper you may be surprised.
For all of the CMs who prefer the noticeable audible feedback in their cues this may be something to try.
JMO,
Rick
PS: If any other cue maker friends who like Ping in their fine cues made with great ring tone materials wish to try this type of taper. Send me a cue blank about .030 over .850 / 1.250 size finish and I will take the last passes on my butt taper saw machine for you and nail your desired joint dimension for shaft line up an fit. Of coarse you will pay the shipping back and forth and buy me one deli sandwich for $ 6.00.
Here is a new cue I just finished. I don't know if you can see it in the pic but the bunny rabbit has the right angled view. The curve starts from the butt to about the middle of the handle before there is a more conventional butt taper climb from the joint to the transition area in the handle. Joint .850, A-Joint .980 and Butt end 1.254.
The butt taper is fixed on this machines bar. If you wish to see if it makes a sound difference just PM me and I would be happy to do it for a deli sandwich from Capri Deli. Plus I would get CM feed back to share info from anyone who wants to experiment.
3 K,
I believe that you have hit on a very good point concerning the taper of the butt and sound quantity. Shown below is a pic of one of my cues. I am not sure if you can see it clearly butt there is a parabolic curve that starts at the butt and transitions into the A-Joint area roughly forming a trumpet type effect. This is not an offset but is a distinct arc plotted by a series of arc points when viewed graphically. When holding this cue or sighting it down it is very apparent in person. I won't get info wave propagation, laminar flow pathways, destructive interference cancelation concerning sine wave peaks. I used to be an amateur audio engineer and understand sound and how it is measured and analyzed. Don't think I used any of this when I designed my butt geometry because it was not sound I was trying to control. This is my standard taper because I was seeking to reduce the handle's physical size a tad so I designed the curved taper geometry to my permanent butt taper bar. All of the cues I have ever played with that I liked never had fat handles so I went with it. I loved my Kershsenbroch but I wanted my joint to be larger than David's.
My A-Joint is only .981 which is small by most standards I have observed but my forearm tapers down to .850 at the joint. Kinda like a counter culture or antithesis to a Southwest fat spaghetti noodle concept.
With all that being said as a precursor to your point of contention. Yes, I believe that a trumpet style taper will amplify the tone and here is why I think it's true. I fully core all of my cues with a 29" maple dowel from stem to stern as I wish to eliminate the ring tone of the exotic wood combos so my cues are very quiet and play and feel pretty much the same from cue to cue no matter what combos I choose. Just the way I do things and the way I want my cues to be known for.
The last A Joint cue I made was several years ago and it was the first and only A Joint cue I made with this trumpet style taper. When I hit with that cue I heard a very noticeable ringtone that I believe was from this amplifying geometry of the taper as I had made about 60 A Joint cues previously and was accustomed to the way my cues sounded in general.
How loud was it? It was so loud that I had to put ear plugs in before my next shot fearing OSHA would fine me for noise pollution. :nanner: No seriously, to me it was very noticeable but of coarse this is all subjective concerning cue ring tones. On this one you will have to take my word on it, :duck:, but if you experiment with this type of taper you may be surprised.
For all of the CMs who prefer the noticeable audible feedback in their cues this may be something to try.
JMO,
Rick
PS: If any other cue maker friends who like Ping in their fine cues made with great ring tone materials wish to try this type of taper. Send me a cue blank about .030 over .850 / 1.250 size finish and I will take the last passes on my butt taper saw machine for you and nail your desired joint dimension for shaft line up an fit. Of coarse you will pay the shipping back and forth and buy me one deli sandwich for $ 6.00.
Here is a new cue I just finished. I don't know if you can see it in the pic but the bunny rabbit has the right angled view. The curve starts from the butt to about the middle of the handle before there is a more conventional butt taper climb from the joint to the transition area in the handle. Joint .850, A-Joint .980 and Butt end 1.254.
The butt taper is fixed on this machines bar. If you wish to see if it makes a sound difference just PM me and I would be happy to do it for a deli sandwich from Capri Deli. Plus I would get CM feed back to share info from anyone who wants to experiment.
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Yes.
It's pretty easy to offset my taper groove.
The rest of the info, others can tinker on their own b/c self-discovery is priceless.
I believe Harvey Martin and Gus were the pioneers of compound taper.
Here is a new cue I just finished. I don't know if you can see it in the pic but the curve starts from the butt to about the middle of the handle before there is a more conventional butt taper climb from the joint to the transition area in the handle. Joint .850, A-Joint .980 and Butt end 1.254.
That would be the direct opposite of DPK and SW taper philosophy I think.
Here's SW's ; .832-.1.058-1.248".
Omega/DPK's; .824-1.079-1.263 "
I have a spread sheet Edwin passed on to me .
I'm kinda shocked at Omega's really fat A-Joint.
That would be the direct opposite of DPK and SW taper philosophy I think.
Here's SW's ; .832-.1.058-1.248".
Omega/DPK's; .824-1.079-1.263 "
I have a spread sheet Edwin passed on to me .
I'm kinda shocked at Omega's really fat A-Joint.
Hi Joey,
I never did like Omega's taper. Too fat for my liking, JMO.
I always felt the Philippino thiner style handles rocked for me.
I had 24 Omega Blanks at finial turn size and still have a few floating around here and your numbers are spot on except all joints before finish after final turn are .835 to .837. with the butt at 1.260 or so. They are fatter than SW.
Rick
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Here is Red Bakers cue built by Harvey Martin with the razor blade monogram window in the butt. I think you can see the taper in this pic. Stew has owned this cue since Red passed and he recently sold it to a heavy duty collector. In the day anyone who frequented North Hollywood Billiards would be familiar with this little gem.
This cue was used many time by Red on many TV and Movie sequences where Red was man they called as the pool player stand in. Except of coarse for Willy in the Hustler.
Rick
This cue was used many time by Red on many TV and Movie sequences where Red was man they called as the pool player stand in. Except of coarse for Willy in the Hustler.
Rick
^
That looks like a really short forearm and long handle.
Did you copy that taper ?
That looks like a really short forearm and long handle.
Did you copy that taper ?
The curve gets less and less in the handle and then becomes a convential straight climb to .850.
No I never measured it. My forearm is 12". If you would like I can get the sizes from my collector friend. He is pretty good with a mic because he used to work with Craig Peterson and knows his way around a cue.
I have had my new taper bar for over 70 cues now. This cue just came into my shop this year. Stew got a pretty penny for this one.
Rick
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Sure. Thanks.
CP's joint size, A-joint size and three inches below then then bottom.
Joe,
The same guy that has the Martin has a beautiful CP. I will get those numbers to you when I get back from Philly. My shop is closed to visitors till next week.
Rick
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