trimming a stainless collar down to proper taper/size

Dave38

Dave38

theemperorhasnoclotheson
Silver Member
I need assistance yet again. I finally got my stainless collar threaded on, and went to trim it to the taper of the butt, and also cut it close to final size. I found out that is easier said than done. I got it down, but it took alot of work including using a dremel with a grindstone in it.
Is there an easier way, that gives a better result? I used a standard lathe cutter tool, a file, dremel, and not nessarily in that order. I got a lot of chatter with the cutter tool. Any thoughts are welcome. Thanks,
Dave
 
Dave38 said:
I need assistance yet again. I finally got my stainless collar threaded on, and went to trim it to the taper of the butt, and also cut it close to final size. I found out that is easier said than done. I got it down, but it took alot of work including using a dremel with a grindstone in it.
Is there an easier way, that gives a better result? I used a standard lathe cutter tool, a file, dremel, and not nessarily in that order. I got a lot of chatter with the cutter tool. Any thoughts are welcome. Thanks,
Dave
Click to expand...

Your lathe needs a stout set up to cut stainless cleanly. If you use carbide tooling then you need speed for it to cut well. Stainless also cuts better with a heavy cut. You need to chuck up on the prong very close to the joint, you must use a center and you should clamp down your carriage locks and tighten the gibbs on the cross slide and the compound so that everything is solid. Don't use your Taper bar but use the compound instead as it is more sturdy. I set my compound to about 3/4 of one deg and use a sharp carbide tool with a good radius. You should use plenty of oil on stainless but of coarse that is not possible on a cue so you can't expect a perfect job but it should be good enough to where a file will clean it up nicely.

Dick
 
As I understand it, there is an art is how stainless steel collars are cut...you need to have the right angle, cutter?? Anyone care to share their knowledge on this subject?

Any best practice on cutting stainless steel collar on the Deluxe Hightower? I will probably call Chris as I know he will have the answer.

Thanks,
Duc.
 
Have you tried to use your router on the tool post with a 1/4" carbide 4 flute end mill? Useing the taper bar and small cuts with the speed of the router and the rotation of the lathe makes a very nice & clean cut. This has worked best for me on the small lathes such as Hightower's & Porper's machines. No vibration or chatter like with the cutter bit.
David
 
Is it safe to use the router to cut stainless Steel collar?

Alway thought it safer with using the cutting bit. I have cut stainless on the deluxe but I had to do it slowly. I may give the router a try...but I'm just not to comfortable with using it just yet.
 
i dont use a router or a cutter. i use a file and ice cubes, only takes 10 mins

once its to size i sand with 220 400 600 100 1500 then buffing material

i dont have a big lathe i only have a midsize
 
dave sutton said:
i dont use a router or a cutter. i use a file and ice cubes, only takes 10 mins

once its to size i sand with 220 400 600 100 1500 then buffing material

i dont have a big lathe i only have a midsize
Click to expand...
Time to get one of these beasts.:D
 

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Cuemaster98 said:
Is it safe to use the router to cut stainless Steel collar?

I may give the router a try...but I'm just not to comfortable with using it just yet.
Click to expand...


Are you flippin insane?

<~~~put me in your will before trying....................
 
Have you tried to use your router on the tool post with a 1/4" carbide 4 flute end mill? Useing the taper bar and small cuts with the speed of the router and the rotation of the lathe makes a very nice & clean cut. This has worked best for me on the small lathes such as Hightower's & Porper's machines. No vibration or chatter like with the cutter bit.
David

I take it's dangerous then? Chris said a carbide bid with small pass should work fine. I've also got a Mini grinder so I will give that a try and see how it'll work out.

Thanks.
 
Duc, you have those PRed blanks with SS collars.
Do you know how they were turned?
 
I think they used the CNC machine to cut them. I must have sold over 500 plus of these blanks (The one without the SS collar was very popular)....they are so easy to convert. Most guy just have to add a shaft and wrap for a very nice starter cue. The only pain point is that these blanks had to be refinish in the butt area where a logo used to exist. I thought I should have sold out of these with the prices that I was selling them long ago. ROI just made sense...especially when most of my clients were selling them for $200 a piece with their own shaft. The stainless steel collar on these are already in final size at .84 so they don't really have to do anything to them. I made a jumper for myself with this blank and it great. I think some competent guys out there could have made these into great jumper. I still have 20 plus of these lefts but decide to keep them for myself so that I can practice on my cue making skills...what little time I have on the weekend.

Btw, I wonder how well the grinding router bits will work in tapering the stainless steel collar? Anyone tried this on their deluxe while the cue is turning at tapering speed? The Router that goes with the deluxe is all setup but I was sure if these bits will work. I've seen guys use these for shaping the stainless steel pin and for sharping bit. Just too busy to try it out myself.

Regards,
Duc.
 
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What kind of stainless steel is being used ? There is a big difference between the grades, 303 is "free machining" (for a stainless methinks) whereas 410 is not a nice alloy to cut.

Light cuts are fine and required in a low horsepower machine, but too light a cut and you'll chew up cutters like crazy as the stuff work hardens, some alloys harden rather easily. You have to cut deep enough to get under the work-hardened skin.

Normally it is reccomended that you cut stainless in the most rigid machine available, and most often ridgidity equates to weight, so trying to cut stainless in a lightweight machine may be an exersize in futility.

The topic of machining stainless steel is well covered. Here are a couple of brief overviews :



http://its.fvtc.edu/MachShop2/operations/turnsteel.htm

I like Joeys plan, a tool post grinder is a good idea for some things, and finishing up a stainless collar might be one of them.

Dave, not a cuemaker and avoids stainless whenever possible , and has been wondering when this topic would come up
 
Cuemaster98 said:
Have you tried to use your router on the tool post with a 1/4" carbide 4 flute end mill? Useing the taper bar and small cuts with the speed of the router and the rotation of the lathe makes a very nice & clean cut. This has worked best for me on the small lathes such as Hightower's & Porper's machines. No vibration or chatter like with the cutter bit.
David

I take it's dangerous then? Chris said a carbide bid with small pass should work fine. I've also got a Mini grinder so I will give that a try and see how it'll work out.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

Duc...no offense but it would be very dangerous IMO to attempt cutting SS in this manner. I haven't cut a lot of it but have found that it depends on what type it is.....machinable or not.....there are many diff types of SS.
Most types used for SS collars in cues are very machinable with the right tools and techniques.
When I was building cues with SS collars this is how I would do it.
It was one of the last things that was put on the cue after the cue was cut to finished size and I cut the collar to size and taper off the cue.
That way if I had a problem I didn't waste the whole cue or cause more work for myself by having to change out a collar that was already glued on.
Besides the heat created by cutting and polishing the SS is no good for the glue.
I used a rounded nose carbide cutter and took at least a cut of around
.007 deep. If memory serves right I did it with an approx 1/2 to 1 degree angle for the taper on it.
Turn everything down to slow, slow , slow when cutting....it peeled right back with a clean, smooth cut.....polished with 800, 1000, 1200, 1500, 2000, 2500, 3000..........then some rouge......I could shave in it when done.
Then glued it on the cue.
Used a 1236 logan lathe to achieve this finish. Not sure if you can get the same results with an after market cue building lathe...just don't know if they are rigid enough to hold without chattering.

Happy machining........


<~~~hopefully without the use of a router on SS.............
 
Has anyone here made a mandrel to turn and polish the SS before installing it on the cue, that way It only needs facing when installed? Your gonna want the wood below the SS collar anyway to make room for building the finish up to it, correct? I'm just wondering If this is possible. I have played around with the idea, and seems Like it may work If everything can be kept deadnuts during the proccess. I modify and center drill My ss pins on a smaller metal lathe, and HSS tooling seems to work for Me with those, although Like Dick mentioned I have to keep the oil to them so they don't heat up too much, and that wouldn't be a good mix while on the cue.My cues are still mostly built & assembled on a cuelathe until I move, and I don't really use SS collars anyhow, but sometimes someone will ask If I'll do them, so I've been toying with the idea of trying It. I'm thinking of threaded collars here, and realize there could be some problems doing the thinner slip tenon collars this way due to the fact they won't screw on a mandrel the same way. Also would it be better to polish the collars before intalling? SS always seems to create a mess of black gunk. Greg
 
BarenbruggeCues said:
When I was building cues with SS collars this is how I would do it.
It was one of the last things that was put on the cue after the cue was cut to finished size and I cut the collar to size and taper off the cue.
That way if I had a problem I didn't waste the whole cue or cause more work for myself by having to change out a collar that was already glued on.
Besides the heat created by cutting and polishing the SS is no good for the glue......
QUOTE]

Did you use a dowel that was pre-threaded to screw the collar on, then machine it?
I used the file method today, it worked, but alot of work.
Dave
Click to expand...
 
Dave38 said:
BarenbruggeCues said:
When I was building cues with SS collars this is how I would do it.
It was one of the last things that was put on the cue after the cue was cut to finished size and I cut the collar to size and taper off the cue.
That way if I had a problem I didn't waste the whole cue or cause more work for myself by having to change out a collar that was already glued on.
Besides the heat created by cutting and polishing the SS is no good for the glue......
QUOTE]

Did you use a dowel that was pre-threaded to screw the collar on, then machine it?
I used the file method today, it worked, but alot of work.
Dave
Click to expand...


That's what I've been thinking of, so I can turn them on My mini metallathe before going on the cue. It's more ridgid, so i'm sure it can handle the work. I was thinking a mandrel like you mention that is center drilled for tailstock support. I know i can polish them to My expectations already, just trying to figure out my best option for turning them to size. Alot less file work that way.:) Greg
Click to expand...
 
Turn everything down to slow, slow , slow when cutting....it peeled right back with a clean, smooth cut.
Click to expand...

By slow you're not talking about being in back gear are you? Maybe 200 to 250 rpm.

Thanks , Ray
 
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