Which basically means you are using the ghost ball method unconciously.seven said:
I have never met a person who shot straight and needed this esoteric aiming systems.
Using glare off balls for aiming method????
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I have never met a person who shot straight and needed this esoteric aiming systems.
JoeyInCali said:Which basically means you are using the ghost ball method unconciously.
I have never met a person who shot straight and needed this esoteric aiming systems.
Very possibly true.. but is it considered a system even if I dont know I'm doing it? or could it just be called "feel"
Might be but you are still imagining the two balls colliding and the result.seven said:Very possibly true.. but is it considered a system even if I dont know I'm doing it? or could it just be called "feel"
Great thing about it is I think you are subconciously thinking " if I send the cueball there, I pocket the ball ".
It's not a system per se. It's a visualization or feel.
There are lots of details in Ron's book. It is not something like, "point your stick at the reflection farthest from the pocket and the ball goes in." If you want to try the systems he shows, expect it to take a few weeks. A very brief summary and a picture from his book is available in this Billiards Digest article on aiming systems:kaznj said:
http://www.sfbilliards.com/articles/2004-06.pdf
I have found some aspects of aiming by "lights on the balls" to be useful for beginners, but I think eventually people graduate to feel.
S
Snoogi
Guest
I once asked a snooker player where he' looking when he shoots, he said he's not looking anywhere, just the pocket and pot. I guess this is the center ball, ghost ball not enough but where the ghost ball sits. Dunno about others but I think pocketing can get very sharp with this. Maybe this is 'feel'. As far as light is concerned, I can't get myself to use it because it follows my sight whenever I shift.seven said:
No, they're not.JoeyInCali said:
pj
chgo
Old Max Olds once suggested to me to try shooting with the reflection off the lights. I respect Max's opinion because at one point in time he was one of the best players in San Diego (he's in his mid-late 80's now) so that method is known to be used. I tried using it for a while when I first started playing but it didn't work for me or maybe I didn't try using it long enough.
You can sometimes learn anything from anyone including league players. Sometimes you learn what not to do .
You can sometimes learn anything from anyone including league players. Sometimes you learn what not to do
.
Using reflections is actually VERRRRY accurate. The reflections are NOT the contact point. It's kind of hard to explain without showing someone.
I know this is new to about 95% of the people on here, who would be quick to dismiss.
Many times you're shooting to replace one reflection with another. Sometimes you're shooting an edge of a reflection to the center of another.
I use reflections for banking, if the lighting is right (either 3-incandescent bulbs or 1 or more flourescent bulbs). For short-rails banks:
Shoot either the inside or outside edge of the CB reflection to the center of the OB reflection (it's self-correcting, only one edge of the CB reflection will look right--- the other will send you square into the rail). Use pocket-speed, hard shots will shorten the angle and it'll not work).
I don't use this exclusively, but with full-table length flourescent lighting - and the $ is on the line and I have to make a short-rail cross side or cross corner bank - --- I always look at this.
Dave
I know this is new to about 95% of the people on here, who would be quick to dismiss.
Many times you're shooting to replace one reflection with another. Sometimes you're shooting an edge of a reflection to the center of another.
I use reflections for banking, if the lighting is right (either 3-incandescent bulbs or 1 or more flourescent bulbs). For short-rails banks:
Shoot either the inside or outside edge of the CB reflection to the center of the OB reflection (it's self-correcting, only one edge of the CB reflection will look right--- the other will send you square into the rail). Use pocket-speed, hard shots will shorten the angle and it'll not work).
I don't use this exclusively, but with full-table length flourescent lighting - and the $ is on the line and I have to make a short-rail cross side or cross corner bank - --- I always look at this.
Dave
Review all the responses from those who use reflections or have used reflections or know somebody who uses or used reflections. Count how many of them say specifically HOW to use reflections. That number is the Reality Quotient of this "system".
The same test applies to other aiming systems frequently discussed here.
pj
chgo
The same test applies to other aiming systems frequently discussed here.
pj
chgo
Patrick Johnson said:
Check out my post above yours, pat. I explain.
I appreciate the effort, Spidey, but an "explanation" would have to be something I could make sense of and use. Maybe I'm just dense, but yours doesn't do it for me. For instance, how does it account for the fact that the light reflection moves around on both balls depending on where they are and where you are in relation to them? How about the fact that the pocket's position can be anywhere in relation to those? How about the fact that there are different lights?
You haven't said anything that made sense of any of those questions.
pj
chgo
aiming is visual. It is not something that can be easily explained in writing. Ron vitello's book is mostly practice examples. He does a short explanation of each type of shot and then many examples of each shot. To get the most out of this book someone needs to show you how to use it. The explanations are easy to understand, but a demonstration makes it much easier. You are not always aiming at the light reflection itself. Read my last post here. If you move the cue ball around to different positions you will obviously have different aiming points. Sometimes you are aiming at the bottom of the cresent reflection, sometimes the top, sometimes the middle, sometimes the point between the light and the edge of the ball, and sometimes you don't use the light at all, but are aiming at the edge of the ball.
glare
one more time a little slower...........
look from object ball to pocket see the light go back to cueball aim straight thru cb to reflection and you will see and understand this i hope like any system you have to practice and beleive.......its the aiming point we are refering to here is not the contact point.i keep my BALLS real clean and have over-head lighting so i get more than a crescent shape reflectioni actually get like pinpoint reflections so i have more options but if your in a bar say....well your at the mercy of the house as to how clean they keep their BALLS.this is one of those things better talked about while standing around a table and the points can be pointed to and shown......
one more time a little slower...........
look from object ball to pocket see the light go back to cueball aim straight thru cb to reflection and you will see and understand this i hope like any system you have to practice and beleive.......its the aiming point we are refering to here is not the contact point.i keep my BALLS real clean and have over-head lighting so i get more than a crescent shape reflectioni actually get like pinpoint reflections so i have more options but if your in a bar say....well your at the mercy of the house as to how clean they keep their BALLS.this is one of those things better talked about while standing around a table and the points can be pointed to and shown......
OK, really slowly: the reflection moves when you move.
Systems don't require belief unless they can't be described, and then they're belief systems, not aiming systems.
pj
chgo
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Patrick Johnson said:
I just read my post again to make sure, and it makes perfect sense. The light acts as a mirror, with the source being consistent from anywhere on the table. The only time the system doesn't work is if the lights are not hanging dead-center.
I'll try again:
With flourescent lights, you will see a "bar" of light on each ball. With the banking system I described above, you aim the end of the bar on the CB to the "center" of the bar on the OB. All I do really is "connect the dots" visually and pull the trigger at pocket speed.
With incandescent lights, there must be at least 3 bulbs (these lights are not as good, flourescent is way-better, you will see 3 "dots" on each ball). Aim the outside dot (reflection) to the center dot (reflection).
The reflection does move from one ball to the other, but it doesn't matter. The closer you are to the center, the higher on the ball the reflection - the farther you are from center, the lower the reflection. It's a self-correcting system, but once again, the light MUST be center above the table. Yes, if the CB is dead-center and the OB is against the rail, the CB reflection is on top and the OB is closer to the equator. Doesn't matter, Pat.
I respect some of your posts, because you like to map out the geometric proofs to dis-prove some horse-shit rumors that float around. Before you blast it---- go to your table and try it and then report back
I wouldn't post bad information, trust me. Once again, the lights must be hanging dead-center above the table. I'm not a math genius, I would guess the proof for that is advanced because of the geometry of the curvature of the ball, versus its relation to the light. I make my proof on "does the ball go" vs. how to carry the 1 and proving angles congruent, etc.True story: I'm in China right now and showed a snooker club owner that system (because of this thread) and he was so elated for the knowledge he said (through an interpreter) I never have to pay for table time in his club (this is earlier yesterday). Connect the dots, pocket speed the ball, ball goes.
Have fun.Dave
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