VNEA 2012 8 ball regular division won by pro

8

8BallWonderland

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I was just curious to see what standard of player is allowed to play in the VNEA 8 ball mens regular division at the nationals in Las Vegas.

Here is a link to the results you can choose the division to view: http://compusport.us/?SportEventId=38#/Home

So last year in 2012 not in the Masters or even in the Intermediate division but in the regular division Marko Lohtander a pro from Finland wins $6000.
Finishing second is Pod Shognosh who plays Master level pool and finishing 3rd is Chris Siefken who also should be a Master in my opinion.

And i'm not saying they are one division under ranked but two divisions.

How do these amateur national tournaments continue to let way under ranked players enter the Open/Regular divisions?
A simple google search or maybe even using the player finder on az billiards would help police this.

Where do you go to compete if you are a good but not monster APA 7 in 8 ball.
You can't play in the BCA Open and think to be able to compete as per the top 8 finishers every year.
You obviously can't play in this VNEA regular division.
And in the APA singles you would have to play players like Steve Knoll, Brian Parks, Jeff Sergent and Kenny Brisbon even in a race to 5.:confused:
 
They should just have a foreign division for any of these big 8 ball league tournaments. Want to come in under ranked - want to be coached by your teammates in your own language - we don't care, you go into the Foreign Division and have a grand ole time.
 
watchez, i know exactly what you mean, we had the same happen to us. almost came to blows, kinda funny now, but cheating none the less!

scott, in 2011 justin volk won the vnea open division and is not a pro. its funny that in the tournaments around here he doesn't even make it to the money.
 
8BallWonderland said:
How do these amateur national tournaments continue to let way under ranked players enter the Open/Regular divisions? A simple google search or maybe even using the player finder on az billiards would help police this.
Click to expand...

8 Ball,

One of the major difficulties is the sanctioning bodies only look at singles results and only 8 ball. If a player can avoid playing in the national 8 ball singles, they will never reach their true rating. Playing on a team evidently does not count. Who really won the match? Which player was responsible? Some sanctioning bodies do not recognize other sanctioning bodies. A master player in one is not a master in the others.

BCAPL created the "team master" designation a few years ago in an effort to keep "super" teams from being formed. That's evolved into the Advanced catagory. Only one Advanced player on an Open team now.

As far as identifying "special" players, there are many ways to learn a players speed. My gut feeling is it's all about the number of entries and the money generated. Hard to keep every good to great player on the radar screen and out of the Open events.

8ballwonderland said:
Where do you go to compete if you are a good but not monster APA 7 in 8 ball. You can't play in the BCA Open and think to be able to compete as per the top 8 finishers every year.
You obviously can't play in this VNEA regular division.
Click to expand...

Why can't you play in the BCAPL Open 8 ball? Being an APA 7 is not a disqualifier. Same with the VNEA or ACS. The top eight finishers in the BCAPL event are moved to the Masters division. Finishing from 9th through 48th moves you to Advanced. Regardless of the division you enter, if you play the player and not the balls on the table you will be in trouble.

Lyn
 
8BallWonderland said:
I was just curious to see what standard of player is allowed to play in the VNEA 8 ball mens regular division at the nationals in Las Vegas.

Here is a link to the results you can choose the division to view: http://compusport.us/?SportEventId=38#/Home

So last year in 2012 not in the Masters or even in the Intermediate division but in the regular division Marko Lohtander a pro from Finland wins $6000.
Finishing second is Pod Shognosh who plays Master level pool and finishing 3rd is Chris Siefken who also should be a Master in my opinion.

And i'm not saying they are one division under ranked but two divisions.

How do these amateur national tournaments continue to let way under ranked players enter the Open/Regular divisions?
A simple google search or maybe even using the player finder on az billiards would help police this.

Where do you go to compete if you are a good but not monster APA 7 in 8 ball.
You can't play in the BCA Open and think to be able to compete as per the top 8 finishers every year.
You obviously can't play in this VNEA regular division.
And in the APA singles you would have to play players like Steve Knoll, Brian Parks, Jeff Sergent and Kenny Brisbon even in a race to 5.:confused:
Click to expand...

You can compete in the B.C.A. Open 8 ball singles. If you play their league. They will give you a shot. I live in a big city, Houston and I know a ton of APA 7's in 8-Ball that got ZERO chance in the BCA. The APA handicapping is a joke, they got no idea of what a 7 should be. They got girls here that are 6's that would never win a match in the bca open. Never the less they should be about 4's, and most 7's deserve to be 6's.
 
I understand you are allowed to enter and play in the BCA 8 ball Open singles.
But as a decent, or lets say medium APA 7 you have absolutely no chance of finishing in the top 8 or lets say top 32.
You need to be a monster APA 7 or BCA Master level ability to finish top 8.

There is no national level tournaments that I know of that allow good but not great APA 7's to compete and have a chance to win the tournament.
 
8BallWonderland said:
I understand you are allowed to enter and play in the BCA 8 ball Open singles.
But as a decent, or lets say medium APA 7 you have absolutely no chance of finishing in the top 8 or lets say top 32.
You need to be a monster APA 7 or BCA Master level ability to finish top 8.

There is no national level tournaments that I know of that allow good but not great APA 7's to compete and have a chance to win the tournament.
Click to expand...

8 ball,

Check out the new leasure 8 ball division offered by the BCAPL. Think that might be your best option. All players who have participated in past Nationals and NOT cashed. Think it kind of mirrors the standard division offered by the VNEA and ACS. No world beaters here. If one happens to slip in by misrepresenting themselves, BCAPL may handle them same as the Taiwanese last year. Guess it all depends on how serious they are about keeping the event real.

Lyn
 
I did not know about this new BCA leisure division, this might be the division for those type of players

It's not for me anyway, I was just talking about multiple other players who might be the equivalent of a medium APA 7.

Thanks.
 
Hadicapping is impossible and rediculous

From an Old timer:
A majority of advanced shooters who have been around and particularly learned the hard way naturally play with tendency to use no more speed then necessary to win. To much speed / flash / showbiz in the bar table world will make you a bar stool boozer fast. Tournaments are always similar - bring out the loot and reality sets in. Of course there's always the betting, dumping, etc. hustling going on. If you don't know whats up - better be happy screwing around. Ratings are a joke - however the promoters are not interested in the sport or art of billiards and the work it really takes to do it. To them - make the game even by any means including rigged tables, handicaps, etc. and collect the dough. I genuinely hope that many are really enjoying the sport regardless of the scams. Just understand that they are ever present. Watch many of the dumps on youtube !!

Tony
 
BCAPL leisure division etc.

cardiac kid said:
8 ball,

Check out the new leasure 8 ball division offered by the BCAPL. Think that might be your best option. All players who have participated in past Nationals and NOT cashed. Think it kind of mirrors the standard division offered by the VNEA and ACS. No world beaters here.

If one happens to slip in by misrepresenting themselves, BCAPL may handle them same as the Taiwanese last year. Guess it all depends on how serious they are about keeping the event real.

Lyn
Click to expand...

LYN,
We are very serious about keeping it real! Bill Stock has to personally sign off on any Leisure player. If there is any doubt, they will have to play open - especially if we don't have a lot of history on them.

But - someone has to win the division.

But - on the same token, if a player is shown to be an APA 7 - they are NOT getting into the Leisure Division. I tend to agree with Jumpin Joe on this one.

Mark Griffin
 
Mark Griffin said:
LYN,
We are very serious about keeping it real! Bill Stock has to personally sign off on any Leisure player. If there is any doubt, they will have to play open - especially if we don't have a lot of history on them.

But - someone has to win the division.

But - on the same token, if a player is shown to be an APA 7 - they are NOT getting into the Leisure Division. I tend to agree with Jumpin Joe on this one.

Mark Griffin
Click to expand...

Guaranteed! If you are an APA seven of any kind you will not be playing in the Leisure Division.
 
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