I agree. You hit the nail on the head. He is probably one of my favorite pool players today, mainly because of his integrity and ability to balance family and pool.
Waxing the cue ball? WTF is Kaci talking about now?
- Thread starter benjaminwah
- Start date
Yates suggested, and I concur, that both players seemed surprised by how the ball reacted in the first few racks. I didn't think Chua had any advantage over Ko in the first half of the match. Both had some setbacks.
By the second part of the match, both players had largely adjusted to the conditions. These are among the best pros. They don't take long to adjust. They have to do it all the time.
I do not recall seeing any kind of crazy spin reactions like the ones Kaci referred to.
A pool hall near me has glass-like surfaces on some tables that most of the players play on. I play on the normal tables (GC4, Simonis, Aramith).
The ball rolls like crazy on the glass tables. Table-length draws are easy. But I find the CB very hard to control, even knowing how the table plays.
Agreed. It wouldn't be hard to subtly change your style of play a little to minimize weird cue ball reactions. If I had to bet, I would say someone did manipulate some cueballs somewhere. If several of the best players in the world all say something was off, ya gotta believe there's something there.
Just one more thing before I stop adding fuel to a fire!
Chua has one of the best draw strokes in pool. Among current players, he is in the mix for being the very best. De Luna, SVB, Biado are others that stand out to me.
A few years ago, Chua made a video showing how he draws shots. He's one of the few players to use a slip stroke. It gives him more power with less effort. During his demo he was making long draws with ease on a home table with somewhat worn cloth with zero problem. I tried to mimic his draw stroke but failed.
If anything, Chua has a tendency to overdraw. In any case, draw shots by Chua won't persuade me of anything.
I do suspect some cheating has been going on. Too much smoke - emanating from good players - to think otherwise. But at this stage, all MR can do is make sure it doesn't happen going forward.
Going to be interesting to see who does not show up for the Philippines Open!
Chua has one of the best draw strokes in pool. Among current players, he is in the mix for being the very best. De Luna, SVB, Biado are others that stand out to me.
A few years ago, Chua made a video showing how he draws shots. He's one of the few players to use a slip stroke. It gives him more power with less effort. During his demo he was making long draws with ease on a home table with somewhat worn cloth with zero problem. I tried to mimic his draw stroke but failed.
If anything, Chua has a tendency to overdraw. In any case, draw shots by Chua won't persuade me of anything.
I do suspect some cheating has been going on. Too much smoke - emanating from good players - to think otherwise. But at this stage, all MR can do is make sure it doesn't happen going forward.
Going to be interesting to see who does not show up for the Philippines Open!
Most likely only few Pro players from Europe, probably not even a single US player will attend. I think it has a big impact on the current issue but I I could be wrong, but hoping that the Phil. Open would be star studded pro players will join the first ever tournament.
In the past all balls were cleaned at the beginning of each day.
My son went to the bathroom during a match against a pro in a pro tournament. While he was gone the pro player took a cloth out of his case and cleaned the cue ball with it. After that the pro just used stop shots and follow the last couple of games while my son was missing and even miscuing when trying draw shots.World number six Eklent Kaci has called for any player caught cheating to be banned for a long time after the cue ball behaved in a strange fashion at the World Pool Championship.
Kaci, who was beaten in the final in Saudi Arabia last time around at the hands of world number one Fedor Gorst, exited the tournament in the last 32 at the hands of world number 61 Patric Gonzales.
Gonzales was amongst seven Filipino players to book their places into the World Championship last 16, joining the likes of Carlo Biado, Anton Raga, Jefrey Roda and James Aranas at the business end.
However, Albania’s Kaci raised his concerns via social media following his abrupt exit and fuelled the strong rumours that certain Filipino players have been waxing the cue ball in some manner.
“I lost in the last 32 against one of the 30 Filipinos in the tournament,” Kaci began. “[There was a] weird cue ball, it was all over the place.
“I think the cue ball was waxed real bad, and I think whoever gets caught doing it should get banned for enough time for their gloves, towel and whatever to get real dry.”
Kaci later added: “I’m not complaining because I lost. It’s not my first time and it’s not going to be my last time losing that’s for sure.
“My mind says that the cue ball was playing different, compared to my previous three matches, where the start of the match plays just fine, and then mid-match until the end tables and balls play tougher and tougher.
“Last match I had too many over-draw shots, playing a safe shot, aiming half of the ball with english, and didn’t even hit the ball, missed lots of shots by a mile where english was needed, out of position totally sometimes.
“Even if nothing wrong was with that cue ball, I still think that the authorities in charge about this stuff should take this seriously. It has happened many times in many tournaments, where lots of players have complained about it and no one has gotten punished. It will keep happening from one or another.”
Kaci’s concerns come following the cue ball behaving oddly in Jeffrey Ignacio’s 11-10 win over Aloysius Yapp, with world number two Yapp putting ‘wax on, wax off’ on his Instagram story post-match.
Yapp has since apologised for that quip and who it may have affected. But he also said: “We players are letting the relevant authorities handle it now. Whatever the verdict may be, we players we accept it.”
Yapp added: “It’s basically impossible for a cue ball to be slicker at the end than at the start after 21 racks of play, with the refs sweaty palms and humidity in the room too.”
‘I think the cue ball was waxed real bad’ – Kaci questions Filipino opponent after World Championship exit
Last year’s runner-up Eklent Kaci has raised cheating concerns following his World Pool Championship exit (Photo: Taka Wu)absolute-pool.com
i don't know what you guys are implying. why wouldn't they go? because pinoy fans?
And??? What's your point? More baseless accusations? Seems par for this course on this topic.
Anyone caught intentionally doctoring the cue ball or the equipment in any way should be banned for a year. If they don't already, there should be a player-appointed committee of 5 or 7 of the most respected players (including representation from each relevant geographic area) to rule on matters like this and others (i.e. sharking, etc.). A suspension should require a super-majority (4/5 or 5/7) but not a unanimous vote from the player ethics committee.
Kaci is getting lots of hate for going to social media to call this out - you can criticize the approach but the reality is a week ago I had no idea applying wax/silicone to the cue ball is something that happens and based on the reaction and fall out from these last few days I think it is clear that this is broadly known and suspected amongst the players. They need to take these types of things seriously.
Kaci is getting lots of hate for going to social media to call this out - you can criticize the approach but the reality is a week ago I had no idea applying wax/silicone to the cue ball is something that happens and based on the reaction and fall out from these last few days I think it is clear that this is broadly known and suspected amongst the players. They need to take these types of things seriously.
There are a lot of events in Asia in September and October, so I would expect most WNT regulars to show up in Manilla.
The WPA has the World 10-ball Championship in the last week of September in Saigon. The WNT has the Peri Open (Da Nang) and Hanoi Open in the first two weeks of October.
Given how cheap Manilla is, I wouldn't be surprised if many players just fly to Manilla from Hanoi and hang around for a week. All the members of the "World" team that will play in the Reyes will also play in the Philippines Open.
If anything, the wax ball controversy might just gin up a big crowd.
Badpenguin
Well-known member
The ban needs to be for life. This is a crime, and you would be stealing real money from people. Maybe you can get away with it in your local pool hall, but when we are talking 5 to 6 figure prizes, it is serious and should be treated as a crime.
Which is why it would really surprise me that a Filipino would do such a thing in Saudi Arabia, where Filipinos are basically enslaved, and people are put to death for less.
g0ds gReeN
Active member
wat
Didn't the #1 Worlds Chinese Snooker player get caught cheating?
Remember when Buddy Hall and the boys dumped Vegas.
Remember when Buddy Hall and the boys dumped Vegas.
How is it doctoring the cueball conceptually different from a major league baseball pitcher doctoring the baseball. Yes, it compromises the integrity of the game and can affect the ability of batters to make a living at their trade. Yes, many steps have been taken to limit it. The same must happen in pool.
Typically, a pitcher caught breaking the rules gets a ten-day suspension, and even elite pitchers, including Mets reliever Edwin Diaz in 2024, have been disciplined in this way.
A ban for life might be overdoing it but I am OK with stiff fines and suspensions.
g0ds gReeN
Active member
Match fixing iirc
Badpenguin
Well-known member
I'm not sure that the subject of side gambling by a manager has any relevance here. We are debating the subject of intentionally compromising the equipment and how it should be dealt with.
On the other hand, you are right to bring up the money issue. If a batter loses just ten hits in a season because opposing pitchers doctored the ball, it can make millions of dollars of difference when that player's contract is up for renewal.
All in all, though, we are on the same side here. We see doctoring of the cue ball as a serious matter and want infractions to be severely penalized.
billiards_watch
Well-known member
Very similar to baseball.
The general public watch the game and not many know behind the scenes there are things like scuffing a baseball and pitches using vasoline and other compounds to affect the ball.
We're just now hearing it in pool. It could very well be a pool room secret and "if you know, you know" kind of things.