what helps you the most? this should enlighten some.
- Thread starter gpeezy
- Start date
I'm not sure I get it. Do you mean what helps me the most besides praticing? Of the 4 it would be playing for fun, but it would really be playing against (much) stronger players. Haven't had "real" lessons yet so can't comment on those.
gr. Dave
gr. Dave
I wouldn't say that any of those options have had a big enough impact on my game to say that they have helped "the most." Maybe I'm missing the point.
- Practice
- Playing stronger players
EDIT - Watching instructional video/dvd's or reading books
- Playing tournaments
- Playing for fun
In that order. Decent lessons would probably be first or second, I don't gamble much at all.
- Playing stronger players
EDIT - Watching instructional video/dvd's or reading books
- Playing tournaments
- Playing for fun
In that order. Decent lessons would probably be first or second, I don't gamble much at all.
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I thought i would share some insight i have had lately. I recently watched my video of Souquet v Pagulayan at the US open a few years back and before the match Alex had mentioned that he had been working on his mental game. He also quietly mentioned that he had read a book called mental edge. I recently went into borders and found the book he was talking about. I read it cover to cover yesterday. What a great book! This book talks about some very important aspects of working on your mental game as it relates to improving in sports. I really feel like this book is a must read for people who are serious about improving. The book is titled: The Mental Edge and the author is Kenneth Baum. I hope everyone gets a chance to read it.
Tournaments
I voted tournaments because I feel tournaments give me the best insight of the status of my game. I can understand why the gambling thing works for some, but when gambling, you can choose when and where according to the mood of the day. Tournaments, you gotta get on that train before it leaves the station, ready or not!
I voted tournaments because I feel tournaments give me the best insight of the status of my game. I can understand why the gambling thing works for some, but when gambling, you can choose when and where according to the mood of the day. Tournaments, you gotta get on that train before it leaves the station, ready or not!
Was a tough choice between gambling and tournaments. I chose gambling because, if I loose in a tournament (as sometimes happens ;-) I'm done. Sometimes this happens very quickly. No chance to grind it out.
I know people will tell me that this is part of tournaments and their pressure. I'm not arguing that it isn't. My point is this. On the average, do you learn more from one game or two games? Sometimes you might certainly learn more from one. All things being equal, however, playing more games means more learning.
Since I've gotten my butt kicked in the first round of tournaments so many times, I'm going to say I've learned a bit more from gambling. I never have to be finished after my first barrel.
I should mention also, that this is how I feel. I do not claim that anyone should feel the same way! I took your title to heart "what helpsyou (you in this case is me) the most?"
I know people will tell me that this is part of tournaments and their pressure. I'm not arguing that it isn't. My point is this. On the average, do you learn more from one game or two games? Sometimes you might certainly learn more from one. All things being equal, however, playing more games means more learning.
Since I've gotten my butt kicked in the first round of tournaments so many times, I'm going to say I've learned a bit more from gambling. I never have to be finished after my first barrel.
I should mention also, that this is how I feel. I do not claim that anyone should feel the same way! I took your title to heart "what helpsyou (you in this case is me) the most?"
gambling
Gambling helped my game the most, however I cut my teeth gambling or banging balls with friends. No comparison between the two as to which improved my game the most. With the availability of tournaments several times a week now they might offer much the same.
Gambling when the match up is very close can create hours long stretches of intense focus. Also the rewards for successes and the penalties for mistakes are very immediate so I tended to remember both mistakes and what worked.
Sometimes I can generate the same level of focus in practice but often the intensity is lacking. In addition, nothing seasons a player like hard fought battles, gambling or in tournaments.
Hu
Gambling helped my game the most, however I cut my teeth gambling or banging balls with friends. No comparison between the two as to which improved my game the most. With the availability of tournaments several times a week now they might offer much the same.
Gambling when the match up is very close can create hours long stretches of intense focus. Also the rewards for successes and the penalties for mistakes are very immediate so I tended to remember both mistakes and what worked.
Sometimes I can generate the same level of focus in practice but often the intensity is lacking. In addition, nothing seasons a player like hard fought battles, gambling or in tournaments.
Hu
I learn the most playing better players for fun. In a real game I tend to do what I already know I can do. (you don't learn much doing that)
If you can find a better player bored enough to play for fun they often show things you won't see or think of on your own and with nothing to lose you can try things you might or might not pull off.
The feed back you get to these tries can be invaluable. I have learned the most in this type of situation.
If you can find a better player bored enough to play for fun they often show things you won't see or think of on your own and with nothing to lose you can try things you might or might not pull off.
The feed back you get to these tries can be invaluable. I have learned the most in this type of situation.
I'd say it depends on what it is that I want to work on.
For example, say I want to work on a specific bank.
I make a drill and thrash it until I'm disgusted and feel like I am not / haven't made any progress. ( this is just perception )
Take a week off of that drill and then return to it.
Almost like magic, now I can see the progress I've made. You sometimes just need time to soak it in and let in sink in.
For example, say I want to work on a specific bank.
I make a drill and thrash it until I'm disgusted and feel like I am not / haven't made any progress. ( this is just perception )
Take a week off of that drill and then return to it.
Almost like magic, now I can see the progress I've made. You sometimes just need time to soak it in and let in sink in.
ShootingArts said:
I think you said it perfectly.
My only addition would be to only wager what you can afford to loose and don't gamble with jerks that may cause problems if you win. I have found the higher the stakes the more chance of running into bad losers.
Playing for fun
Without a doubt, playing for fun has done the most to raise the level of my game. There is absolutely no substitute for table time, whether that time is spent playing better players or by myself just having fun banging balls and trying shots I'm not confident enough with to use in a real game.
Tournaments are a great way for me to measure my progress, but, except for the mental aspect, they don't do much to improve my game. League play is the same.
I don't gamble much, but I can't recall ever learning anything from a gambling match that has helped my game. I learn things about other people's games when I gamble.
Good Rolls,
Rasta
Without a doubt, playing for fun has done the most to raise the level of my game. There is absolutely no substitute for table time, whether that time is spent playing better players or by myself just having fun banging balls and trying shots I'm not confident enough with to use in a real game.
Tournaments are a great way for me to measure my progress, but, except for the mental aspect, they don't do much to improve my game. League play is the same.
I don't gamble much, but I can't recall ever learning anything from a gambling match that has helped my game. I learn things about other people's games when I gamble.
Good Rolls,
Rasta
Double-Dave said:
I have to agree with DD even tho this wasn't one of choices. I do however always learn something every time I play in a tournament.
I analyze where my mistakes were and even write it down to remind me (not to do that) for next time...and when I do well I analyze that also.
For me it was a tough choice between gambling and practice. I don't know about you... but when I miss a shot when gambling I go back and practice it until I feel confident that I will make that shot next time. Between gambling and practice.. that is how I improve for tournaments.
Playing for fun... is... um.... not much fun.
-Back2good1
Playing for fun... is... um.... not much fun.
-Back2good1
I have never been able to play "just for the fun of it." The best way to beat me is to play me for nothing. Tournaments always bring out the best in me because I know I have to be at my best or I'll be out the door. Nobody wins every time but I know my game goes way up when there is something to play for. The last time I played league I was shooting 78% for the season but I shot 100% in the playoffs.
IMHO, as a veteran of some 25 years now (off and on), I think two things are crucial: focused and disciplined practice, and money matches.
Too many times I see players who practice by shooting shots they are already proficient at, rather than working on their weaknesses. If you want to get better you have to identify the weaker parts of your game and work on them in a sytematic and disciplined way until they are no longer weaknesses.
As for money matches, they are a very different animal than tournaments. The better player may or may not win a tournament match, and the best player may or may not win the tournament. But in a money match, over the long run, the better player will win. In a tournament you may wait 2 or more hours between matches, but in a money match you are always in competition, and this allows you to get in stroke better than playing one match at a time every couple of hours or so in a tournament.
Don't get me wrong, I think tournaments are a legitimate test of pool playing as well, and I think playing in tournaments is also a great learning experience. But I think if you only compete in tournaments to the exclusion of matching up and playing head-to-head it's harder to realize your potential and reach the pinnacle of your game.
Too many times I see players who practice by shooting shots they are already proficient at, rather than working on their weaknesses. If you want to get better you have to identify the weaker parts of your game and work on them in a sytematic and disciplined way until they are no longer weaknesses.
As for money matches, they are a very different animal than tournaments. The better player may or may not win a tournament match, and the best player may or may not win the tournament. But in a money match, over the long run, the better player will win. In a tournament you may wait 2 or more hours between matches, but in a money match you are always in competition, and this allows you to get in stroke better than playing one match at a time every couple of hours or so in a tournament.
Don't get me wrong, I think tournaments are a legitimate test of pool playing as well, and I think playing in tournaments is also a great learning experience. But I think if you only compete in tournaments to the exclusion of matching up and playing head-to-head it's harder to realize your potential and reach the pinnacle of your game.
The tourneys around me are league sponsored, or small affairs which anyone can win on a given night.
League play offers a variety of players at a variety of skill levels, and a longer race than the tourneys here.
I try to get the matchup with higher skill level players, as I think it helps my mental game. I'm much more focused when I know the other player is supposed to be stronger than me.
By the same token, a poor player can provide a good exercise in reading the table, because every time you get to shoot every ball on the table seems to be in a different location....
McCue Banger McCue
League play offers a variety of players at a variety of skill levels, and a longer race than the tourneys here.
I try to get the matchup with higher skill level players, as I think it helps my mental game. I'm much more focused when I know the other player is supposed to be stronger than me.
By the same token, a poor player can provide a good exercise in reading the table, because every time you get to shoot every ball on the table seems to be in a different location....
McCue Banger McCue