What is a perfect break-ball set up in 14.1?

BigRigTom

BigRigTom

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I am trying to learn 14.1 and my transition between racks truly sucks.
I run 14 balls, get what I think is a pretty good break-ball & cue ball position then when I break I am luck to even have a shot much less a good shot plus a good break and opportunity to run the rack again....consequently my high run is 18!


Can someone tell me how to strike this the cue ball when sinking the one ball to get the best break results? Also....Where should I be trying to get the cue ball to land for my second shot on this rack after the break?:confused:

CueTable Help

 
I'd say bottom left. You hit the rack and should carom the cue ball from the deflection off the rack.
 
A couple of things I've been taught:

Are you right handed? If so, I would always try and setup on the other side so the reach isn't that awkward; if you're a lefty then that is a good spot.

The main thing you want to do when you're hitting the stack on the break is to focus on hitting a single ball in the stack fully - this will help transfer the force of the break throughout the rack. You'll get a lot more action by hitting one ball rather than by hitting half of two balls. Also, the cue ball doesn't have a tendency to stick when you hit just one ball, meaning that draw and follow will take better.

From the position that you're at in the diagram, you could hit top (or top-left) for a full hit on the 10-ball, to try and bring the cue ball two rails back to center table. Or, you could hit the one ball with a stun shot (with a little bit of draw to bring the cue ball out of the stack close to the side rail) for a full hit on the 13-ball.

I like trying to hit the 10-ball and bringing the cue ball back to center table - this would have the potential to yield a good, second shot.

Also, I wouldn't always limit myself to just that particular break shot. It's probably the easiest to execute, but you can also come from under the stack (if an object ball is close to the foot rail), or a side-pocket cut shot with the cue ball hitting the top of the stack or going off the side rail into the stack works pretty well also.

Hope this helps; these are a couple things I've learned and have helped quite a bit, even though my runs are only in the 20s (for now).
 
Tom
This is the best information on the subject from one of the most knowledgeable players in history - Pat Fleming.

Pat Fleming - The Creative Edge - Final Chapter

Your diagram -
When the ball is that far back in your diagram, you want to use draw. That will pull the cue ball into the stack and then away from that corner pocket.

also, go back and watch some of the stuff I have put up on youtube and Veoh, especially Thorsten's 98 ball run. You will find that the most successful players will try to stick with what works - and they try to get a similar set up when going from rack to rack.

If you are a beginner, just remember the rules that Pat covers in the video - and learn how to study end patterns.

Its one thing to have a break ball in perfect position - but it is useless unless you can find the correct key ball to set you up for it. Watch the videos that I recently did for Dennis, I extensively cover stop-stop end patterns in both evaluations.
 
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All good info here....sometimes with the ball that low, and the CB on the flat side I will hit it at about 2oclock....or high inside and go 2 rails to the center of the table.

G.
 
WOW!
Great replies ...all... and especially you BlackJack.
I really have watched several of your evaluations and the more I learn the more I want to know....I am greedy that way....

Thanks again to all of you, way more response than I expected so quickly.
Now back to the practice table.:thumbup:
 
Gerry said:
All good info here....sometimes with the ball that low, and the CB on the flat side I will hit it at about 2oclock....or high inside and go 2 rails to the center of the table.

G.
Click to expand...

Gerry: I agree with you. With it that low, high inside two rails to the middle.

A lot of guys will do what BJ says and use low and bring it back. Some would just bring it back a bit... to the middle of the table. Nowadays they smack the crap out of it and draw it back to the top rail and back towards the middle again.
 
BigRigTom said:
I am trying to learn 14.1 and my transition between racks truly sucks.
I run 14 balls, get what I think is a pretty good break-ball & cue ball position then when I break I am luck to even have a shot much less a good shot plus a good break and opportunity to run the rack again....consequently my high run is 18!


Can someone tell me how to strike this the cue ball when sinking the one ball to get the best break results? Also....Where should I be trying to get the cue ball to land for my second shot on this rack after the break?:confused:

CueTable Help

Click to expand...

If you are in Simi Valley, then Marop is your neighbor. He regularly runs 50s, 60s, and occasional 100s. Check out the 14.1 section and send him a pm. He has no one to play out there.
 
You will find a lot of different opinions on this topic. I saw a video of Archer running 120 in practice with Varner helping him analyze the run and he said he never uses inside unless he is below the rack.

A general rule which I think Pat Fleming covers in his video is if the cue ball is closer to the rail than the object ball you follow. If the cue ball is closer to the middle of the table you use draw.

But some player don't like to draw the ball because they don't want to end up with the cue ball at the other end of the table facing a difficult 8' shot.

If you follow Blackjack's advice you will be off to a good start and then as you play more you may refine it to fit your style of play.
 
As diagrammed, after striking the break ball, the cue ball looks as if it will catch a piece of the 13 ball and hit fairly full on the 10 ball. To me, this calls for top-left with medium speed, sending the cue ball 2 rails toward mid-table - pretty much what others here have already said. After the shot you're hoping to see something good from the 5 or 11 ball.
 
Thanks again everyone.
I need lots of practice at this kind of shot.
It had not occurred to me to use top.
I had already tried the draw, the low left, the low right and the hard stun and none of them gave me good results.

I will go back and try that top left but it is hard for me to know for sure exactly where I am hitting the rack on the break so I will need to video that and/or get a friend to watch and advise me.

You all have been a lot of help here and I will now move on over to that 14.1 section of the board and quit breaking your flow here...hehe:wink:
 
BigRigTom said:
Thanks again everyone.
I need lots of practice at this kind of shot.
It had not occurred to me to use top.
I had already tried the draw, the low left, the low right and the hard stun and none of them gave me good results.

I will go back and try that top left but it is hard for me to know for sure exactly where I am hitting the rack on the break so I will need to video that and/or get a friend to watch and advise me.

You all have been a lot of help here and I will now move on over to that 14.1 section of the board and quit breaking your flow here...hehe:wink:
Click to expand...

Try high right while you are at it. It is what Jim Rempe and Mike Sigel recommended in their straight pool instructionals and still works.

As you might guess, this is not an ideal break shot. You could probably get a lot more yield if the object ball was up a little and if the cue ball was about 6 inches to the right. then you would just hit it with high.
 
BigRigTom said:
Thanks again everyone.
I need lots of practice at this kind of shot.
It had not occurred to me to use top.
I had already tried the draw, the low left, the low right and the hard stun and none of them gave me good results.

I will go back and try that top left but it is hard for me to know for sure exactly where I am hitting the rack on the break so I will need to video that and/or get a friend to watch and advise me.

You all have been a lot of help here and I will now move on over to that 14.1 section of the board and quit breaking your flow here...hehe:wink:
Click to expand...

Earlier, I said top-left when I meant top-right. Sorry for the mix up.
 
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