what metal lathe do you guys recommend
- Thread starter bman43
- Start date
The Asian lathes are Okay. I have a 13 x 40 Jet and it is okay. I also have a old Atlas and I would also call it okay. The problem with the old south bends and such is they probably came out of a machine shop and have been heavily used. For cue work the Harbor Freight larger lathes are plenty sturdy enough for what we do.
Harbor Freight is fairly reasonable on repleacement parts compared to most others. I have customers that have my Deluxe Cue Smith and have a Harbor Freight, Enco or Grizzly 13 x 40 lathes and swear the two make a good set up. You will find various things on both that the other one does a little easier or faster. If you have the luxury of inspecting the lathe you are getting before buying you might get one with a more accurate chuck.
Harbor Freight is fairly reasonable on repleacement parts compared to most others. I have customers that have my Deluxe Cue Smith and have a Harbor Freight, Enco or Grizzly 13 x 40 lathes and swear the two make a good set up. You will find various things on both that the other one does a little easier or faster. If you have the luxury of inspecting the lathe you are getting before buying you might get one with a more accurate chuck.
In metal lathes, you generally get what you pay for.
Harbor Freight is considered bottom of the barrel. Jet is considered fairly high quality. Grizzley is in the middle. These are for Chinese lathes. They will all work, its the details that set them apart.
The non-chinese lathes are of course much better, but are out of the price range for most hobbyists.
I have a no-name chinese lathe at home. "Star". It works, but its fit and finish is crap, I had capacitors blow on me, its not very smooth running, etc. I have a Jet at work, and it runs much nicer, all the levers engage much easier, etc.
I also have an old SB at work. If it wasn't worn out, it would easily be the nicest of the 3 machines, as far as fit and finish and smoothness.
I've also used Hardinge lathes when I worked in a machine shop for a couple years. They are the best money can buy (50k for a manual lathe). They are in a league of their own.
Harbor Freight is considered bottom of the barrel. Jet is considered fairly high quality. Grizzley is in the middle. These are for Chinese lathes. They will all work, its the details that set them apart.
The non-chinese lathes are of course much better, but are out of the price range for most hobbyists.
I have a no-name chinese lathe at home. "Star". It works, but its fit and finish is crap, I had capacitors blow on me, its not very smooth running, etc. I have a Jet at work, and it runs much nicer, all the levers engage much easier, etc.
I also have an old SB at work. If it wasn't worn out, it would easily be the nicest of the 3 machines, as far as fit and finish and smoothness.
I've also used Hardinge lathes when I worked in a machine shop for a couple years. They are the best money can buy (50k for a manual lathe). They are in a league of their own.
merry christmas chris,
is the grizzly a nicer lathe than the harbour freight?by pictures it looks nice but pictures can hide a lot.
is the grizzly a nicer lathe than the harbour freight?by pictures it looks nice but pictures can hide a lot.
I bought a cheap new lathe.
Lucky I had acccess to a high end accurate mill and surface grinder ,to be able to rework the slides and dovtails on the carriage and cross slide and compound slides.
There was the option from the dealer to replace it. But I chose to fix it myself and get it to the accuaracy I wanted.
The initial issue was when the compound slide was traversed it's length, the tool height changed. At full stroke the change was aprox .015 inch apart from not smooth running.
So after this discovery, I checked the rest of it out .
The cross slide was not parrallel or square to the lathe bed.It was about .01 over it's travel from flat and in 6 inches was out of square to the run of the bed by about .005 inches.
There was about 12 hours in correcting and reassembly.
Now the compound slide runs within .01 mm over it's travel.
The cross slide is about .01 for flat and parrallel, and the squareness is to .003mm in 150mm.
Even with my repair time,the lathe was still a good deal, and is better than machines at twice it's purchased price.
I have reference master squares and indicators that are .0005mm resolution for metrology work.Without this equipment would have made the corrections alot more difficult.And of course, with equipment this accurate, it shows movement from just leaning on the machine.
I now recomend before buying a machine, get a DTI dial test indicator, and check a few things.
Happy holidays, Neil Lickfold
Lucky I had acccess to a high end accurate mill and surface grinder ,to be able to rework the slides and dovtails on the carriage and cross slide and compound slides.
There was the option from the dealer to replace it. But I chose to fix it myself and get it to the accuaracy I wanted.
The initial issue was when the compound slide was traversed it's length, the tool height changed. At full stroke the change was aprox .015 inch apart from not smooth running.
So after this discovery, I checked the rest of it out .
The cross slide was not parrallel or square to the lathe bed.It was about .01 over it's travel from flat and in 6 inches was out of square to the run of the bed by about .005 inches.
There was about 12 hours in correcting and reassembly.
Now the compound slide runs within .01 mm over it's travel.
The cross slide is about .01 for flat and parrallel, and the squareness is to .003mm in 150mm.
Even with my repair time,the lathe was still a good deal, and is better than machines at twice it's purchased price.
I have reference master squares and indicators that are .0005mm resolution for metrology work.Without this equipment would have made the corrections alot more difficult.And of course, with equipment this accurate, it shows movement from just leaning on the machine.
I now recomend before buying a machine, get a DTI dial test indicator, and check a few things.
Happy holidays, Neil Lickfold
I have to agree with most of what you have stated. American made iron is about the best if you can find one not worn out. They can often be had for a song but you need to know what your purchasing as it only takes a few parts, that are almost impossible to find new or in good condition, to make that cheap purchase into a very expensive one. They are great for most secondary work and if in good shape there is none better for all work. The Asian import lathes are probably almost all made in the same plants and most parts are interchangeable. They, however, are made on a pecking order meaning the parts are made and the companies who do the assemblies and importers buy these parts and do the assemblies. Those who pay the most for the parts get the first choice on the parts and so on down to the lowest on the level who is probably Horrible Fright. The Jet will be assembled using much more care making sure that the parts and castings are properly cleaned and assembled to closer tolerances. Of coarse since they are paying more for the parts and the assembly process they cost quite a bit more. A Horrible Fright lathe can be made to run just as well and just as accurate as a Jet but you must do the cleaning and tuning yourself instead of letting Jet do it for you. If you've got more time than money and have a little common sense and an inkling of machine tools quite a bit of money can be saved over buying a Jet. They lathe needs to be just about dismantled, cleaned and reassembled to the correct tolerances. H/F and Enco carry some parts but I have found that Grizzly carries a much better supply. So does Jet but their prices will be higher. I have an Enco that I bought new in 1992 and a Jet that I bought used out of a machine shop, but was built in 1983. I love both of them and neither have caused me any problems and the Enco has 1000's of hours running time on it.
Dick
wow
hey neil, merry christmas,
thats the kind of information i was looking for.but was hoping not to get.lol.i always preach to my kids you get what you pay for.i guess this kills my chinesee lathe idea.i will ask more on the grizzly but will be cautious.thanks brian
hey neil, merry christmas,
thats the kind of information i was looking for.but was hoping not to get.lol.i always preach to my kids you get what you pay for.i guess this kills my chinesee lathe idea.i will ask more on the grizzly but will be cautious.thanks brian
Buy a Jet.
It will work fine for cue work
you won't wear it out if you make cues full time
for the rest of your life.
Dale
The following is an image of what I bought. It is made by Microweilly and parts can still be purchased. I suggest when buying, you take into consideration parts availability as well. I have found both Jet and Grizzly to have excellent support, although they no longer carry many spare parts for this particular machine. Even though it was built 20 some years ago, Jet answered any questions I might have. This lathe is currently available new at Ganesh Machinery, but I cannot speak for their support. I believe when I inquired about it new, they said around 5k with a dro. It is a Taiwanese lathe with meehanite castings and has done everything I have asked of it.
This model was supplied with a two speed motor, which gives it 20 speeds. It is also 3 phase, which is not a big deal and actually better.
This model was supplied with a two speed motor, which gives it 20 speeds. It is also 3 phase, which is not a big deal and actually better.
Attachments
I don't know that the Grizzly is better. But Grizzly is more likely to have spare parts, but the parts will cost you more from them than the same parts will from Harbor Freight. So I am saying Grizzly will most often have better customer service, but will cost you more also. Grizzly does not buy closeouts and such like Harbor Freight does, so you will get a 1st quality machine from Grizzly. With Harbor Freight you never know, unless it is a model they carry all the time.
Their Mills are okay for cue work although the amount of travel they have is less than desired.
Their lathes are just not made to easily convert for cue repair, so that is why you don't hear much about them.
They are good machines for what they are designed to do and that is light metal work.
Grizzly will give you a lot better phone support regarding technical issues than harbor freight.
While the lathe is under warranty for Jet (2 years), you get on site warranty service.
The general pecking order from poorest to best of the "big 4" if you will are:
Harbor Freight
Enco
Grizzly
Jet
YMMV!, this is just a general feel.
Kelly
While the lathe is under warranty for Jet (2 years), you get on site warranty service.
The general pecking order from poorest to best of the "big 4" if you will are:
Harbor Freight
Enco
Grizzly
Jet
YMMV!, this is just a general feel.
Kelly
There is a new 13x40 Jet on Ebay for $3374 with free shipping. Now I admit I do like the looks of a Porper (although I love my CS Deluxe) but wouldn't a person be far ahead to buy this Jet for a 2nd machine, save $1k+, and have a better lathe with the Jet? Just my observation. Opinions?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...Category=97230&_trkparms=algo=LVI&its=I&otn=2
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...Category=97230&_trkparms=algo=LVI&its=I&otn=2
You don't have to buy new for support. At least that has been my experience. Getting a lathe for half or less than new on Craigslist is easy.
enco
I purchased the enco 13x40 for $2295 and am satisfied..customer support seemed spot on..
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=510-2585&PMPXNO=9033435&PARTPG=INLMK3
I recieved 10% off sale price.
I purchased the enco 13x40 for $2295 and am satisfied..customer support seemed spot on..
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=510-2585&PMPXNO=9033435&PARTPG=INLMK3
I recieved 10% off sale price.
Looks good and the price is definitely right too. I'm looking to buy a "companion" to go with my Deluxe. I had just about decided on the Porper model B but they are a little too pricey (even used). Looks like you got a lot more machine for a lot less money. What all do you plan to do with your new machine? Which others do you use?
Meantime they probably came from the same factories. Having said that though, the chinese factories build to the quality the customer wants. The highest end piece of equipment is being built in the same factory as the lowest.
I've been to China 5 times for my job in the past few years. I visit the South East side of China when I go, which is the manufacturing part of China. My profession is in design and manufacturing.
Most city blocks I go down are arranged like they are in the US: Store fronts along the whole length of the street. The difference here, is there will be normal store fronts for clothing, food, retail, and manufacturing all next to each other. The manufacturing store fronts are literally a store with a big garage door in the front. Inside, you can see mills, lathes, EDM's, injection molding, welding, etc. going on just driving by on the street. Each of theses little store fronts is its own small factory and business, either supplying end items, or supplying parts for a larger factory.
My point in all of this, is no one really knows where the stuff we buy comes from. EVEN the distributor might not know all the details and sub-supliers. There are thousands and thousands of these shops. Just because a lathe looks the same, does not mean it was made in the same factory, or it has the same internal components.
Another things is EVERYTHING is a knock-off there. They knock-off BMW's, sneakers, tools, watches, clothes, basketballs, you name it.
It can be a frustrating cluster**** of manufacturing sources. And the best part is, when you talk to one of them asking if they can make something, the response is ALWAYS, "yes, no problem" whether or not they can actually do it.
One thing I've experienced in my profession is the priority of the Chinese manufacturer is put on low cost, at the expense of precision of a part, even if you specify a high precision and are willing to pay more for it.
Things made in Taiwan on the other hand are generally considered of much higher quality.
Sorry for the rant.. just interesting seeing how the things we buy are made. I sure wish the manufacturing industry was still going strong in the US.
Most city blocks I go down are arranged like they are in the US: Store fronts along the whole length of the street. The difference here, is there will be normal store fronts for clothing, food, retail, and manufacturing all next to each other. The manufacturing store fronts are literally a store with a big garage door in the front. Inside, you can see mills, lathes, EDM's, injection molding, welding, etc. going on just driving by on the street. Each of theses little store fronts is its own small factory and business, either supplying end items, or supplying parts for a larger factory.
My point in all of this, is no one really knows where the stuff we buy comes from. EVEN the distributor might not know all the details and sub-supliers. There are thousands and thousands of these shops. Just because a lathe looks the same, does not mean it was made in the same factory, or it has the same internal components.
Another things is EVERYTHING is a knock-off there. They knock-off BMW's, sneakers, tools, watches, clothes, basketballs, you name it.
It can be a frustrating cluster**** of manufacturing sources. And the best part is, when you talk to one of them asking if they can make something, the response is ALWAYS, "yes, no problem" whether or not they can actually do it.
One thing I've experienced in my profession is the priority of the Chinese manufacturer is put on low cost, at the expense of precision of a part, even if you specify a high precision and are willing to pay more for it.
Things made in Taiwan on the other hand are generally considered of much higher quality.
Sorry for the rant.. just interesting seeing how the things we buy are made. I sure wish the manufacturing industry was still going strong in the US.
The Sharpe 13X40 variable speed is the best Chinese lathe I know of.