What to do about a bad AZer deal ?

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Matt90

Trust the Process
Silver Member
I do not post alot on here usually just read it or
pm a question about an item for sale .Recently purchased
a rather large item on here and part of the deal went bad
I do not want to start to post pictures and reciepts
and make a big stink out of the whole thing so I am hoping
the person in question will read this and do what they said they
told me they would do on the phone saturday ...
I have had alot of good information on here about tournaments ,
game play , and even some books to read . So I really hate to
start a bad post about something that a phone call and a reasonable
mind could work out . My hope is that this AZer will read this and give me
a call back and work this out like I thought we could . I will give it till
tomorrow night (tues Jan 10th) before I start telling my story and posting
photos and the like . From the start this person seemed like a "man of his word" So I at least want to give hime the chance to make it right .
Let's See what happens next
Matt
 
Matt-
I do not know any of the details of your deal whatsoever. Still, from my experience, any deal I have ever had through AZ has been pleasant. AZ is a pretty decent place to do business but you have to remember, when you are dealing with buying and selling products blindly or solely from pictures, you rely heavily on the word of the individual selling the product and he may have a different opinion than you. I would recommend you contact the individual and voice your dissatisfaction in a calm and respectful fashion. If he does not contact you, perhaps try him again.

Make every effort to work out a peaceful deal before starting a flame thread and trashing an individual. I did not follow this advice myself on a specific occasion and I regret it. I bought a cue online from a well-known cue dealer who posts on this forum. I had contacted the dealer to voice my disappointment and he offered to make the situation right. Stand up move on his part. But I chose to keep the cue and voice my dismay online. And I have to admit, I regret it.
Sean (cueaddicts) is a good guy with a lot of great cues and again, he's a good businessman. My apologies to you Sean.

My point, Matt is this: you may not be happy with what you received through the deal and if you're not, make every effort to let the individual know and try to work it out peacefully. Call. Call again. Leave messages and if you don't hear back, try one more time. Don't just write a post and hope he reads it.

Please don't take this as criticism. It is only meant as advice. I just thought that perhaps others could learn from my mistakes.

-Brian
 
good solid advice there, dont just assume the person is gonna see your post, they could be out of town, computer down, who knows. Id make repeated efforts to get it straightened out with them in person. All else fails, even then i dont know if i would bring to the board, because youre looking at opening up a big can of worms and drama. Guess it depends on if its worth to you, of course its nice for us other az'ers to know, so we can be aware if we deal with that person. Personally ive only ever dealt thru paypal, whether on ebay or on here, and ive been lucky.
 
Matt90 said:
I do not post alot on here usually just read it or
pm a question about an item for sale .Recently purchased
a rather large item on here and part of the deal went bad
I do not want to start to post pictures and reciepts
and make a big stink out of the whole thing so I am hoping
the person in question will read this and do what they said they
told me they would do on the phone saturday ...
I have had alot of good information on here about tournaments ,
game play , and even some books to read . So I really hate to
start a bad post about something that a phone call and a reasonable
mind could work out . My hope is that this AZer will read this and give me
a call back and work this out like I thought we could . I will give it till
tomorrow night (tues Jan 10th) before I start telling my story and posting
photos and the like . From the start this person seemed like a "man of his word" So I at least want to give hime the chance to make it right .
Let's See what happens next
Matt
I think that you are handling this in a very mature manner. I think that a lot of the posters on here could learn something from the way that you are handling this. Kudo's to you....
 
I also agree with Pharoah...it is sometimes difficult for us pool players, but we must all practice a bit of patience...even in the worst of times. Have some patience with each other and I am sure it will all work out fine.

Shorty
 
I am doing my best

thanks guys for the insight .I will keep calling this
guy and see what happens . He stoped answering his
phone yesterday so I have nothing to go on . In these
situations a "kiss my ass youre screwed " is better than
nothing .However I would like to work it out better than
that . Thanks guys
I'll keep hope alive for a while Matt
 
This thread is in regards to me.

I will let Matt post everything he wants and then I will explain my side of the situation....

Personally, this is not the venue to air out something like this in my humble opinion, but well let him do what he wants to do.

I'll also have the other 2 people that bought the same thing from me speak their minds on how things went for them.
 
Yes it was

It was the Gold crown III
and am not going to go into great details yet
I am still going to give Jedi the space to work this
out either on the phone or pm 1st before I post pictures
and at least tell my side of the story .
Heres to peace and good will
Matt:rolleyes:
 
Jedi V Man said:
Matt, feel free to go ahead and post everything you want to post.

So you've given up on trying to fix whatever the problem is with the buyer?
 
Well, he since he wasnts to start something I will reply to you guys are not totally in the dark about this matter he chose o bring here....

Matt bought a Cold Crown III table from me last week. Being he was from AZ illiards and seemed like a decent guy I knocked off 50.oo off of the price of the table a struggled to get a 9' Gold Grown anyhow.

Shipping was on him but I had a table leaving already and told him if he adds his table to the one I have leaving already it will save you $100.00 and you wont have to worry about a shipper.

He then asked me if the guys do set up and felt, which they do. I explained the Shipper charges $350.00 for set up with standard felt like basic Championship or Mali cloth, and charges an Extra $75.00 for Simonis and an extra $100.00 for Championship our Edition.

He agreed that the standard cloth was fine he didn't wanna pay the extra money for Simonis or Tour Edition.

He paid me dirctly for the table, which was my responsibility and took care of th rest with the installers which was not my endof the deal.

They called me midway into the install saying "Matt doesn't like he felt we are using. and wants a better cloth. I spoke with Matt and what he didn't like about the cloth and he went into all kinds of thread count stuff and ounce weight and such.

I explained he can have the installers quit now and pay them for the work they did, which was to bring the table in the house, assemble it, level the slate, wax the seams and get ready to cloth it, then pay someone local to finish it with what ever cloth he chose.

Him and the installer agreed that the installer would be back in 1 week and install Championship Tour Edition cloth for JUST THE PRICE OF THE CLOTH and he would do all of th labor himself for free. But it had to wait a week untill he was back down there again.

Matt calls me the next day saying, and I quote "I hit a few balls on the table and I do not like the cloth at all, we need to work something out", I asked him what the felt guy said and he replied "he says he cant make it back for 2 or 3 weeks and I can't wait that long to get it fixed. I want someone here local to do it and it is gonna cost me $375.00 to get it done with a new cloth...

I said I would speak with the cloth guy and IF THAT 2-3 WEEKS WAS TRUE<, I WOULD WORK WITH HIM on paying for the right cloth.

He then goes on to say they did a shoddy job installing the cloth, the cloth is installed Upside down "it's dual sided cloth" and they were realy hacks.

I call the felt guy and he states he told Matt he would return in the one week as he promised and would install which ever felt he chose for the additional price they agreed to. I explain Matt says your not going to be returning for 3 weeks and he can't wait that long.

So felt guy gets me and Matt on a 3 way call to get to the bottom of it with non of this he said she said crap. Matt, myself and felt guy are all on the phone and find out everything Matt says was innacruat, cause in fact Felt guy was going to be back to his house THIS WEEK ON THURSDAY to exchange the cloth per their agreement.

Matt calls the felt guy a hack and says he does shoddy work, the felt is installed wrong, upside down and not stretched properly at all. He then calls both of us every name in the book, calls us liars and makes a bunch of threats to us and hangs up on us.

He calls back the felt guy and makes more physical threats against him and his 2 employees and once again says they do shoddy work and he doesn't want them to touch his table again and are not welcome or allowed back at his place.


felt guy says no problems and hangs up. The goodness of his heart deal is over with and Felt guy wont deal with Matt again.

Now, Matt wants me to pay $275.00 to help him get his table refelted with Championship Tour Edition cloth which he says he should have gotten in the ifrst place. 1st off, if they were charging an extra $75.00 for the cost of Simonis cloth, and Championship Tour Edition is $25.00 more than Simonis, why would he think he was getting the Tour Edition for free? If he KNEW he wanted a better cloth than a standard cloth, why did he not want to spend the extra money up front to be done with this in the first place? And why is it my responsibilty to pay for him to get his table redone when he had it worked out with the felt guy who was coing through in a few days to redo it all LABOR free????

Because he lied to everyone involved, I will have ZERO conversations with him any furthur.

Because he lied to and about the felg guy, then threatened phsical violence against the felt guy, the felt guy refuses to do buisness with him anymore, and who could blame him since he was standing by his word the entire time and now is being threatened by physical violence???

Also, when the table was done they took some digital stills of the table and then did a small video of it showing all of the detail. In the video they caught Matt talking to the felt guy saying "How nice a job they did on the install, how happy he was with the table and set up and with everything going to gether so well". And that video is being uploaded now and will be posted on here for all to see if matt would like a refresher in what he said....

Honest goes a long ways, idle threats in the form of phone calls, PM and voice messages will get you know where.

I will have ZERO dealing with Matt for anything ever again.

On a side note, the other 2 guys who received their tables are very happy with them and the quality of the install and will be commenting on this thread shortly to say how nice things came out on their end......

And the felt guy will be registering here to post the video and comment on hos the things went as well.

I sold a table, that was my responsibility, I followed through on everything to make sure it went as smooth as butter......

On a side note Matt, with the $50.00 I made off of your table I am taking my family to Maui for a 2 weeks all inclusive vacation.....

Or, I'll use toe $50.00 to cover my cell bill fot the last 27 voice mails you left on my cell phone insulting and threatening me...

Thanks for bringing this up here, Matt.
 
Matt90 said:
It was the Gold crown III
and am not going to go into great details yet
I am still going to give Jedi the space to work this
out either on the phone or pm 1st before I post pictures
and at least tell my side of the story .
Heres to peace and good will
Matt:rolleyes:
Matt: i read everything and man you got one great deal on a Great pool table........enjoy it..play the hell out of it to wear the cloth out then get new cloth in a year or 2....enjoy the table.......
 
I've got a Falcon cue with the stock shaft plus a 314 that I'm interested in selling, and I know I could probably get more for it if I posted it here, but I haven't done so because I don't want to go through exactly this kind of a problem with someone who isn't satisfied with it. I would rather sell it or trade it in person to someone for less money just to avoid the potential hassle.
 
Ok so "I chose to bring it here " ???

I was trying my best to work this out through the phone which he will
not answer or PM with the same response . If you read the post I did not
say one bad thing about you Jedi . I did not even mention it was you, you came in defensively at that and said it was you I was talking about .
So now I must say it was a nice play to take the first stab . I am going to write this the same way I would say it to you if you were here . The truth is
you sent out some very tired , unexperinced , and unprepaired guys to
do the job . A great delivery team they were but not one of them was the
professional installer you claimed (to your defense maybe he told you he was ) They showed up around 9:30 pm friday and started unloading . I had went on Jedi /Gary's word pretty much about the whole deal . To my suprise
I got a great looking /older 9 ft Gold Crown table for a good price . The guys
unloaded it with care and all was well . He came in with what I thought was
the Championship pro tour ed. cloth Jedi / Gary had told me the installer would bring with him .Until the had the table set up the cloth layed in the
corner. So when they got to the cloth install I asked the guy what this was ??? He started looking around and stammered out something like 5 speed or the best Olhousen puts out . I could tell right away it was not what I was
told he was sending (Champion Pro tour ) So at this point I call Jedi /Gary
He is more than amicable / nice about it and we agree its late these guys
have worked hard and I even said I do not want to tell em forget it at this point .Gary and the installer both tell me to try it for a few days if I do not
like it he can bring the right thing on one of his next trips to florida .I say ok
and let them do it . So they do and finish up at about 3 am . I payed the guy 250 . for the shipping and 350 for the cloth and set up . He gives me a reciept with a written promise that he will re-do with the right thing as agreed. I help them out of the drive and go to bed . The next day I look at the table closer and realize the guy put the cloth on backwards .It has a fuzzy side and a slicker side and he put it on fuzzy side up ?? THen I look at the rails and they have riples and loose spots where he did not pull em down tight enough . SO this is saturday ,I call Gary and to Jedi/Garys credit he
is really cool about the whole ordeal and tells me what a time he is having with these guys and even states he is having to send new rails out on another job .
and that they messed up and covered bad rails with good simonis cloth?? I told him the installer had told me it may be a couple of weeks before he could make it through again and suggested that I would rather have a local installer do it .I called and got a price from my local guy and even with Jedi/Gary's ok
got the guy to knock of 75.00 from his price for the trade of this new cloth
that is already on the table .So we come to a price of 300. from the local guy putting on what I asked for to begin with and Jedi / Gary agrees to go
200.00 on it and I will shell out another 100.00 and all will be well .
Then sunday I get "the call" from Jedi/Gary who now says he can't do it
and he needs photos and he needs to have my local guy call him and tell him
that the cloth was put on wrong and a sloppy install which I agree to with no
problem . Saturday worked out so good I was kinda thinking "hey what the heck is going on ??" I had even sent him a paypal request for the 200.00 which he even gave me the email on the phone while I was sending .Then
after I get off the phone with Jedi/Gary I get call #2 from Chris the installer
at this point I am kinda getting pissed off .Why can't Gary/Jedi do what he gave his word to do on saturday and be over it ?Why can't I just send the photos and get the installer here to call him and tell him what kind of job they
did ? So call # 2 with Chris and Jedi/Gary . They are arguing amoungst themselves and with me and yes it got kinda bad . Ending I think with me
asking them if it was worth the stain on their souls for doing business that way .
So since then I have made several attempts to contact Jedi/Gary (maybe not quite as many as he said ) with no response . So I came back here to see if I could get him to work with me here . Jedi/Gary you did not sell me a bad table , I am happy with that (thanks) However you DID promise me that the installer was good and he was bringing the cloth we had agreed on .You DID
tell me you would make it right both friday night and saturday when we talked
Chris the installer gave me a written reciept and told me he would make it right . All I asked was to be treated right and I was willing to give you the
pictures and letter/ reciept from my local guy to verify what I would call a bad install like you asked for . I was willing to pay an extra 100 to get it right
as well .I don't think you are a bad guy Jedi/Gary nor do I have any real bad feelings toward you . I am just setting here in Georgia wondering why I did
all the things I felt were right to do and you are not ? Maybe you are just in
a pinch or having $$ problems .At any rate Gary /Jedi I wanted you to know
I forgive you and I am letting it go .It is not worth my peace or time if this is how you are going to deal with things . All I can say is Jedi/Gary sold me what I wanted but I do not know if he realizes what a bad job his install crew did
at least on my tabel .SO I have to come up with the whole 300.00 to get it
corrected .Heck at least throwing me 100.00 on paypal would of been a good gesture . It's over and I do not want to take it any futher but if Gary/Jedi decides to do what is right I can still send the photos you requested and a letter/reciept from a real pro installer and maybe you and Chris can work it
all out from there . Sorry to write a book but I needed to get it all out and
tell my side of the story without slamming Jedi and just state the facts .
God Bless to all (even you Jedi)
Keep hitting them strait Matt :confused:
 
Matt90 said:
The next day I look at the table closer and realize the guy put the cloth on backwards .It has a fuzzy side and a slicker side and he put it on fuzzy side up ?? THen I look at the rails and they have riples and loose spots where he did not pull em down tight enough .

Personally, I don't find anything wrong with what happened regarding the installation of the cloth on both the table and the rails.

If the installers were planning to return to replace the cloth in a week, it makes sense that they would try to save the cloth that was to be replaced for use on another table. By stretching it loosely the cloth would be reusable. By installing it upside down on the playing surface, the playing side would be like new, again making it reusable. It seems to me you may have jumped the gun and didn't allow the process to play out. It's within their rights to try to save the old cloth so they only have to pay for one new cloth, since you were only paying for one. I would suggest, if it's not too late, to allow the original team to complete the installation of the Championship cloth and allow them to take the original cloth back with them. You have nothing to lose.

Just a thought. If what I outlined above is indeed what happened regarding the covering of your table, than it does sound as if the team did not communicate what would happen with you clearly so you wouldn't feel their work was shabby.
 
Very objective but

THey will not come back and I don't think at least Chris the installer ever planned to .Like I said it's over and done if jedi wanted to make it right he would
 
BTW did I say

I am done with this and forgiving and forgetting
if Jedi wants to work it out with me he will or he wont
it is not going to do me anygood writting or talking anymore
about it .But thanks for taking the time to read this .
 
Yes, i have found it is not so easy to sell items here as well...Either they want a lower price or they dont like youre item ,or like in this case the customer just cant be satisfied no matter what you try to do for them........;)
 
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