What's a "major" title? Who the oldest winners in the 'modern' era?

jbart65

Well-known member
The post about Jayson Shaw getting into the HOF raises a few questions:

Who is the oldest winner of a major pool tourney in "modern" pool? And how are "major" and "modern" defined.

Tricky to define modern, but I'd say modernity started with the surge of talent outside the U.S. and much deeper playing fields. The era probably began around 2014-2015, as players such as Albin Ouschan and Ko Pin Yi ascended to the top ranks.

Looked at that way, Biado is the oldest winner in the past decade of what I would describe as a major title.

Carlo Biado won the WPA 10-ball title in 2024 at the age of 40.

SVB won the World Nine Ball title in 2022 at the age of 38. He also won the World Eight Ball title in 2023 at 40.

Is an 8-ball title a major? Was the field deep enough? The 8-ball field had 128 invitees.

Niels Feijin won the WPA World Nine Ball title in 2014 at 38. That was the cusp of the modern era.

Yet by and large, it's players under 30 who seem to be winning most of the majors these days.

***

Now what constitutes a major? Also hard to determine.

The pool industry is in flux. Matchroom is on the rise, but most if its big events are young. UK Open, European Open, Hanoi.

The rise of MR has also cause some havoc with the WPA, which has increasingly ceded control of its "major" events to Predator.

Let' start with MR. I'd consider the UK Open, European Open, US Open, World Pool Championship and Hanoi Open as majors.

The Spanish Open in 2023 would be another, and MR is bringing it back this year. The Spanish Open two years was every bit as big as the others I mentioned in the size (256 players) and quality of the field.

WPA events harder to figure. Predator invites 64 to 96 players for most events, and all of them I would consider non-majors.

The biggest Predator events so far have invited 128 players. These fields are arguably almost as deep as big MR majors since they don't include Open-type players with no chance of winning.

Problem is, only the Predator Las Vegas Open in 2025 and 2023, and the Puerto Rico Open in 2023, had 128 players.

I'd normally consider the World 10-ball Championship as a major given the large payout, but Predator has run it the past two years and only invited 64 players. This event has also been sporadic historically.

Aside from Predator-run events, the China 9-Ball Open has generally had fairly deep fields and good prize money. It's also been a regular event for 15 years.

The inaugural Ho Chi Minh Open had good prize money and a 128-player field. It could also become a major in time.

Put it all together, and there are somewhere between 5 to 9 events each year that could be considered MAJORS.

***

What about small but stacked invitationals?

SVB won the Premier League of Pool in 2024 in what was an incredibly grueling event. More grueling, I'd argue, than a 256-player field at a major Matchroom event.

Still, the fields are too small for events such as PLP or WPM to consider them major titles. Big titles, to be sure, but not among the very biggest.
 
The post about Jayson Shaw getting into the HOF raises a few questions:

Who is the oldest winner of a major pool tourney in "modern" pool? And how are "major" and "modern" defined.

Tricky to define modern, but I'd say modernity started with the surge of talent outside the U.S. and much deeper playing fields. The era probably began around 2014-2015, as players such as Albin Ouschan and Ko Pin Yi ascended to the top ranks.

Looked at that way, Biado is the oldest winner in the past decade of what I would describe as a major title.

Carlo Biado won the WPA 10-ball title in 2024 at the age of 40.

SVB won the World Nine Ball title in 2022 at the age of 38. He also won the World Eight Ball title in 2023 at 40.

Is an 8-ball title a major? Was the field deep enough? The 8-ball field had 128 invitees.

Niels Feijin won the WPA World Nine Ball title in 2014 at 38. That was the cusp of the modern era.

Yet by and large, it's players under 30 who seem to be winning most of the majors these days.

***

Now what constitutes a major? Also hard to determine.

The pool industry is in flux. Matchroom is on the rise, but most if its big events are young. UK Open, European Open, Hanoi.

The rise of MR has also cause some havoc with the WPA, which has increasingly ceded control of its "major" events to Predator.

Let' start with MR. I'd consider the UK Open, European Open, US Open, World Pool Championship and Hanoi Open as majors.

The Spanish Open in 2023 would be another, and MR is bringing it back this year. The Spanish Open two years was every bit as big as the others I mentioned in the size (256 players) and quality of the field.

WPA events harder to figure. Predator invites 64 to 96 players for most events, and all of them I would consider non-majors.

The biggest Predator events so far have invited 128 players. These fields are arguably almost as deep as big MR majors since they don't include Open-type players with no chance of winning.

Problem is, only the Predator Las Vegas Open in 2025 and 2023, and the Puerto Rico Open in 2023, had 128 players.

I'd normally consider the World 10-ball Championship as a major given the large payout, but Predator has run it the past two years and only invited 64 players. This event has also been sporadic historically.

Aside from Predator-run events, the China 9-Ball Open has generally had fairly deep fields and good prize money. It's also been a regular event for 15 years.

The inaugural Ho Chi Minh Open had good prize money and a 128-player field. It could also become a major in time.

Put it all together, and there are somewhere between 5 to 9 events each year that could be considered MAJORS.

***

What about small but stacked invitationals?

SVB won the Premier League of Pool in 2024 in what was an incredibly grueling event. More grueling, I'd argue, than a 256-player field at a major Matchroom event.

Still, the fields are too small for events such as PLP or WPM to consider them major titles. Big titles, to be sure, but not among the very biggest.
The 2024 PLP field in particular was an absolute gauntlet. Was there a single player under 800 fargo?
 
Look up Mike LeBron and see what his stats are. He did good when he was older.

Cool thread

Best Fatboy💪
 
Great question. In the general sense, a major is an event usually having a large (128+) field with substantial participation form the biggest stars of American, European and Asian pool.

Some slam dunk majors include World 9ball, World 10ball, All Japan, China Open 9ball, US Open 9ball, UK Open 9ball, European Open 9ball, Spanish Open 9ball, Hanoi Open 9ball and World 8ball, as well as the no longer contested events such as the BCA Open, the WPA World 14.1, the Sands Regency Reno, the US Open 14.1, and all PBT (elite American tour that folded by 2000) events.

Other events probably meriting inclusion would be the Qatar 9ball, Qatar 10ball, the Las Vegas Open 10ball, the International 9ball, the European Championship 9ball, European Championship 8ball, and the European Championship 10ball.

Of events having a large, elite field, events missing the cut for me are events like the Derby City 9ball, all Eurotour events, all US Open events other than 9ball, and the Texas Open.

Who are the oldest major champions? I think they are Ralf Souquet, Buddy Hall, and Mike Lebron. Souquet was European 8ball champion at 54 years old. Lebron won the US Open 9ball at 54 years old. Buddy Hall won the US Open 9ball at 53 years old.

... and let's not leave overlook that Reyes won the Derby City Master of the Table at 55 years old and Bustamante won the Derby City Master of the Table at 54 years old.
 
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i would say the modern era came with guys like mika, corey, alex, toastie, with earl transcending the old "gambling" era into the new tournament / professionalized era. so i would count from 2000. there were some real big tournaments in the noughties. IPT of course, and MR had world championships before the financial crisis with a first prize of 100k.
 
Your list of majors or potential majors includes some I couldn't remember, sjm. I am glad you chimed in. The Qater events in particular have been stacked. Big prize and 128-player fields.

I still have to wonder: Is it a major if the field is fewer than 100 players? Like the recent 10-ball championships?

I'd also be curious to know when you think the "modern" era of pool began. Did it begin earlier than I think?

I've just got to wonder if, in this day and age, a player over 50 could win any true major (at least 128 players) or a 256-player MR event.

The gauntlet is tough, and it seems players have to be in great condition physically to endure such a big tourney. Most of the top players these days work out and are in great shape. The best of the older pros, SVB and a part-time Feijin, keep in great condition.
 
I didn’t read the whole thread, I believe busty might be the oldest winner of the world championship.
 
The modern “tournament” era began with the WPA formation in 1990 (I think). Before then, it was every TD for himself could make any event he wanted and call it a championship.

The WPA started the large 128 plus fields of the best players from each country competing internationally in the same event.

The “modern” era, excluding tournament formats mentioned above, I’d say started in the 1980’s, with the transition to Simonis cloth and nine ball.
 
I'd also be curious to know when you think the "modern" era of pool began. Did it begin earlier than I think?
Those suggesting that the modern era began in 1990, when the first truly internationally balanced WPA World 9ball championships began, have a point,
Still, although Asia already had a significant presence at the majors worldwide, by 1995, Europe did not until about 2003. The WPA World 9ball events in Cardiff, which ended in 2003, had a lot to do with the growth of pool in Europe.

By 2003, it had all changed, and fields at the World Championship had really become tough, so a case can be made that this was the beginning of the modern era. We all understood that nobody was going to mass-produce world titles the way Strickland always had. Niels Feijen certainly wowed us by winning the WPA world 14.1 in 2008 and the WPA World 9ball in 2014. Thorsten Hohmann wowed us, too, winning the WPA World 9ball in 2003, the WPA World 14.1 in 2006, and the 2013 WPA World 9ball. Both Wu and Appleton won both the WPA World 9ball and the WPA World 10ball.

Still, the standard has gone through the roof since Matchroom took over the US Open 9ball in 2019. The fields we have seen ever since eclipse anything we had seen before, and winning the majors in all disciplines is harder than it ever has been. So, in a sense, 2019 was the beginning of the modern era. We need to appreciate just how impressive it is that SVB, Gorst and Filler all have two WPA sanctioned world championships since 2019.

In short, good cases can be made for 1990, 2003, and 2019 as the onset of the modern era of pool. Definitely a matter of opinion.
 
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This man was on the Miz senior tour when he won his last world 9-ball title…
IMG_3437.jpeg
 
Could a 50-year-old win a major title in this day and age? I wonder.
My inclination, if we are talking 9ball or 10ball, is to say no. Beating the kind of fields typically found at a major today is a very tall order. I don't remember a 50-something having a top 10 in a 9ball or 10ball major since then 54-year-old Ralf Souquet came tied for 9th at the 2023 US Open.
 

Busty won the WPA 9 ball World Championships at age 46, I just verified. He was one of the highest caliber players possible in his prime. I too doubt a 50 year old could win a 128 man field "stacked" major like this was.

ps, I don't know who put all the group stages and brackets into the wikipedia article.... they did a great job!
 
modern tournament play is longer days and more grueling. so an older gent has a big disadvantage it that. and desire to even enter.

and the equipment has tended to favoring the straighter shooters that run balls(younger eyes) than those that may need to play more safes.
 
modern tournament play is longer days and more grueling. so an older gent has a big disadvantage it that. and desire to even enter.

and the equipment has tended to favoring the straighter shooters that run balls(younger eyes) than those that may need to play more safes.

hmm, what aspects of the equipment? the main tour is on tight equipment and together with the break rules it lends itself to more safety exchanges. whenever they play on softer tables they just run out, like filler at the DCC and shane at the US open 10b/8b.. so i wouldn't say movers are at a disadvantage.
 
so i guess i am wrong, as you say older players do better on the modern fast tighter playing equipment.
 
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