When A Ball Is Almost In Your Way. . . . . . .

[DrCue'sProtege]

what do you do? i've heard people, including pros, say that when you have a shot, and there is another object ball very close to being in the way, that it is almost like a "Magnet" for the ball you are actually shooting.

in other words, you almost invariably will hit the interfering ball, even though you do indeed have just enough room to sneak it past.

so, do you better players out there have any tips/secrets to help in these situations? i have been experiencing this "Magnet" dilemma myself the past couple of nights.

DCP

 

[jhendri2]

Though it's hard to diagnose over the computer...it sounds like you're focusing too much on the interfering ball and not enough on the object ball... or the english you're using could be spinning you into the interfering ball. Like I say it's real hard to tell without actually seeing you do it.

Jim

 

[Cane]

You have to train your brain to completely disregard the other ball. If it's not in the way, you aren't going to hit it if you're aligned well.

When I golfed (what a disaster) I worried about every waterhole on the course, and by god, I hit every waterhole on the course. Used to do this with balls that were "near blockers". Now I just put the near blocker out of the picture. I don't really even see it on the table. It's just gone...

Now if it's marginal and I'm not absolutely sure it the OB will pass, I'll just elevate a little and hop the OB over the edge of it.

by the way, it wasn't just the near blockers I had a problem with. If I had a shot where the OB was really close to the rail and I had to shoot down the long rail past the side pocket, I'd clip the point of the pocket on a regular basis. That cost me a lot of racks.

Later,
Bob

 

[RSB-Refugee]

so, do you better players out there have any tips/secrets to help in these situations? i have been experiencing this "Magnet" dilemma myself the past couple of nights.

First off, let me say, I am not a better player, but I have learned a trick for these types of shots. If the left edge is slightly in the way, in other words if you hit the shot with no english you would actually graze the obstructing ball. Hit the cue ball with pocket speed and extreme low right english. The cue ball will squirt left and then swerve to the right. With some practice you can learn to controll it. Speed is an important key in this technique. I have done it several times and to me, it is one of the most satisfying shots I can think of.

Tracy

 

[DaveK]

what do you do? i've heard people, including pros, say that when you have a shot, and there is another object ball very close to being in the way, that it is almost like a "Magnet" for the ball you are actually shooting.

in other words, you almost invariably will hit the interfering ball, even though you do indeed have just enough room to sneak it past.

so, do you better players out there have any tips/secrets to help in these situations? i have been experiencing this "Magnet" dilemma myself the past couple of nights.

DCP

Everything with mass exerts a gravitational force on anything else with mass. The force is inversely proportional to the square (or cube ?) of the distance between the masses, so the effect is more noticeable when the two objects are closer together. Magnets have nothing to do with this, although that very concept pretty much drove Einstein crazy, but I digress ....

I agree with the poster who suggested a minor elevation of the butt end of the cue, causing the cueball to jump over the edge of the ball. I also play what I call 'baby masse' shots, but they are a bit more difficult to control.

Dave

PS I really don't think that magnetic nor gravitational pulls influence pool that much, other than to keep the balls on the table and the table on the floor.

 

[fxskater]

do one of 2 things.
1. Hammer it in the pocket at VERY FAST speed. The slight elevation that your cue has just to get over the rail will make the CB jump enough to make the OB jump enough to get over the edge of a ball.
2. Jack up a little, and jump into the OB slightly.

I prefer hitting it firm, if the shot allows it, you will get that Millimeter of height that you need to get over the edge.

 

[pete lafond]

what do you do? i've heard people, including pros, say that when you have a shot, and there is another object ball very close to being in the way, that it is almost like a "Magnet" for the ball you are actually shooting.

in other words, you almost invariably will hit the interfering ball, even though you do indeed have just enough room to sneak it past.

so, do you better players out there have any tips/secrets to help in these situations? i have been experiencing this "Magnet" dilemma myself the past couple of nights.

DCP

The pocket is always bigger than you think. Play to one side of the pocket. If you can not do that, then use english accordingly.

 

[wayne]

Pay attention. There is a way to handle the problem forever in the easiest of fashions. No need to masse, jump, use normal english or do magic tricks. You get to aim dead center on the cueball. You can even make the object ball if it is slightly blocked as long as the distance between the balls is not great. It is called a wrist turn. To turn the object ball slightly to the right on contact turn your wrist clockwise, to the left counter clockwise. You can make shots that "don't go" using this little trick and you can aim a little further away from the almost blocking ball if you want and still make it.

Wayne

 

[DaveK]

Pay attention. There is a way to handle the problem forever in the easiest of fashions. No need to masse, jump, use normal english or do magic tricks. You get to aim dead center on the cueball. You can even make the object ball if it is slightly blocked as long as the distance between the balls is not great. It is called a wrist turn. To turn the object ball slightly to the right on contact turn your wrist clockwise, to the left counter clockwise. You can make shots that "don't go" using this little trick and you can aim a little further away from the almost blocking ball if you want and still make it.

Wayne

Hmmmmm, never heard of this trick before. Just to clarify, when you say "turn your wrist", is the objective to get the cue to rotate along it's axis ? Or is moving the butt slightly sideways relative to the stroke direction the result of the 'turn' (I'm assuming that you turn your grip wrist as opposed to your bridge wrist) ? If it's the latter, it sounds like a small pivot, so why not simply align the shot that way rather than adding another dynamic to the stroke ?

Dave

 

[wayne]

Hmmmmm, never heard of this trick before. Just to clarify, when you say "turn your wrist", is the objective to get the cue to rotate along it's axis ? Or is moving the butt slightly sideways relative to the stroke direction the result of the 'turn' (I'm assuming that you turn your grip wrist as opposed to your bridge wrist) ? If it's the latter, it sounds like a small pivot, so why not simply align the shot that way rather than adding another dynamic to the stroke ?

Dave

Yes the grip wrist. Earl does a wrist turn on most or all of his shots but he only turns one way. Just turn your wrist and it will impart English onto the ball, the advantage is you can aim dead center on the cueball. No pivot just turn your hand as you are stroking through. The more dramatic the twist the more English imparted.

Wayne

 

[AuntyDan]

You need to clarify what you are trying to achieve - There are 2 main things you may want to do:

1) The object ball is makable as long as you avoid hitting the blocking ball first -In this instance you simply need help with that "magnet" problem. My personal solution to this is to aim to just barely miss the blocking ball by as little margin as possible. I do not aim at the object ball at all for this kind of shot. Unless you HAVE to use side/english to throw in the object ball shoot this center ball and just concentrate on the edge of the cue ball being just clear of the edge of the blocking ball.
EDIT - To make this clearer; visually focus on the blocking ball last in your shot routine. The problem you are fixing is that your eyes cannot sharply define both the edge of the blocking ball and the target object ball at the same time. This assumes you have already lined up correctly to make the object ball as long as the cue ball clears the blocking ball.

2) The object ball cannot be made directly - In this instance it is usually a problem of falling into the "wishful thinking" trap that makes us shoot at a ball that logically cannot be made and hit the blocking ball instead. Despite being possibly only 6" from the object ball and only having 1/16" of the blocking ball in the way the shot is still just as unmakeable as if the entire blocking ball was in the way. In this instance I like the slow masse described RSB-Refugee, but it needs some practice to get the feel of. The other thing you have to do when you shoot this is account for the large amount of throw you will get from the slow spinning cue ball action. (This often helps make the object ball, but many players make it in without know it was more throw than masse that did the trick. )
You may even want to consider a kick, especially if the object ball is hanging over a corner pocket. These kicks can be a very high percentage shot if you practice them a little, even if you have to go to the long rail.

 

[DaveK]

Yes the grip wrist. Earl does a wrist turn on most or all of his shots but he only turns one way. Just turn your wrist and it will impart English onto the ball, the advantage is you can aim dead center on the cueball. No pivot just turn your hand as you are stroking through. The more dramatic the twist the more English imparted.

Wayne

Let's walk through this. If you are aligned dead straight to hit dead center on the cueball, and turn your grip wrist just before the tip contacts the cueball, you will cause the butt to slide to one side or the other. This will cause the tip to move the opposite direction, pivoting around your bridge hand. Then the tip strikes the cue ball off center (laterally), which squirts the cue ball around the edge of the blocking ball, but the cue ball swerves back to the proper line into the object ball. Is this about it ? If so, then you are absolutely doing the pivot thing, but in the middle of the stroke as opposed to lining up that way from the start. The timing must be good to get the required action using a wrist twist, whereas the intentional pivot does not require this extra dynamic/complexity. I agree about using a bit of squirt to get around the ball, but disagree that the wrist twist approach is the best one. Does anyone else have a thought on this ?

If Earl does this on almost all of his shots, and only does it in one direction, how does he deal with the ball on the other side ? Maybe this gives new meaning to the saying 'miss on the pro side'.

Dave

 

[alinco]

Play safe!

If you're not comfortable making the shot, then play safe. It's no different than bypassing a really tough shot to play a lock up safe. Don't be concerned about whether you are "supposed" to make it or if it's possible - just do the best thing to win the game and play safe.

Andy

 

[sjm]

I agree about using a bit of squirt to get around the ball, but disagree that the wrist twist approach is the best one. Does anyone else have a thought on this ?

I largely agree with you, here, Dave. I first became aware of the wrist twist when Tony Robles showed it to me in about 1995. Still, it is not the only means of using a little squirt/swerve to your advantage in avoidance of an obstructing object ball. All that aside, however, if you practice the wrist twist, you'll get very good at it, and your view on this matter may change.
Guess I'm just suggesting that you keep an open mind here, Dave.

 

[Williebetmore]

what do you do? i've heard people, including pros, say that when you have a shot, and there is another object ball very close to being in the way, that it is almost like a "Magnet" for the ball you are actually shooting.

in other words, you almost invariably will hit the interfering ball, even though you do indeed have just enough room to sneak it past.

DCP

DCP,
Where do you come up with these dilemma's? You must be cursed. There is no frickin' magnet effect (if you believe that you'll believe Loogootee had a chance to win state).

The solution is simple. If the obstacle ball is to your right, just use your cue to sight a line between the right edge of the cue ball and the left edge of the "almost" blocking ball. Allow just a small space between the line and the interfering ball. Now just move your cuestick parallel to this line until you reach center ball - this is the closest you can come to the object ball without jumping or masse'/throw action. If this line allows you to make the real object ball you are home free; if not you must resort to masse'/jump techniques.

 

[mjantti]

Yep, I agree with Williebetmore. There is no magnet effect, if you hit the obstructing ball, either your aim was off or you hit it bad. It takes some time to train the eye to figure out if the object ball can be made past the obstructing ball without any swerve. I take a good look on those, if I decide the ball is not in my way, I ignore it completely. Things get more complicated if the obstructing ball is far away from cueball. Playing a little bit english or cheating the pocket gives a little bit more freedom on aiming...

 

[chefjeff]

Yes the grip wrist. Earl does a wrist turn on most or all of his shots but he only turns one way. Just turn your wrist and it will impart English onto the ball, the advantage is you can aim dead center on the cueball. No pivot just turn your hand as you are stroking through. The more dramatic the twist the more English imparted.

Wayne

Has anyone done an experiment on this?...one that is online perhaps?

Jeff Livingston

 

[pete lafond]

Has anyone done an experiment on this?...one that is online perhaps?

Jeff Livingston

I'm not sure this is what really happens, twisting wrist. What normally occurs is that the backhand will assist in the stroke to get a little more action on the cue ball. It is just not spinning the ball, it is also digging the cue ball into the cloth which is were the action comes from and causes the cue ball to move in an arc.
This can be done at a low or high speed shot and is developed by feel more than anything.

 

[chefjeff]

DCP,
Where do you come up with these dilemma's? You must be cursed. There is no frickin' magnet effect (if you believe that you'll believe Loogootee had a chance to win state).

(snip).

But it must be true that some outside force is doing it because it happened the "past couple of nights " (!!!)

Bigger picture, DCP, bigger picture. Why not use wide-scope accounting?...it reduces harmful conclusions.

Jeff Livingston

 

[Rod]

DCP,

The solution is simple. If the obstacle ball is to your right, just use your cue to sight a line between the right edge of the cue ball and the left edge of the "almost" blocking ball. Allow just a small space between the line and the interfering ball. Now just move your cuestick parallel to this line until you reach center ball - this is the closest you can come to the object ball without jumping or masse'/throw action. If this line allows you to make the real object ball you are home free; if not you must resort to masse'/jump techniques.

Right on Wille. I don't use the cue, I just look at what I need to clear. Whether it be a ball near the o/b or shooting the o/b past another ball. If that is enough to pocket the ball (even using using the pocket a little) then the blocking ball is far from my thoughts.

What he needs to be concerned with is a pure true stroking action. Dwelling on the near ball is a waist of time, just be sure you use the best smooth stroke possible. That is where most people fail. If you have good eyes then it's all up to trusting your stroke.

Rod