Which Way Do You Play This Shot?

gregcantrall said:
I have not viewed the video but noted only 1 one rail path in the posting. My favorite is just go the other side of the 5 between it and the 7 and found a natural that I could duplicate easily. Whitey ends up in a large sweet spot. Well my sweet spot. Wheel house is a favorite from baseball. Ramblin Rose .....why you ramble.....no one knows...
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I shot them both ways. That side of the table is no good either. By the time the CB clears the 5, it would need to stop on a dime to leave a makable cut on the 3. Sorry, it's just a bad shot. I'm no champion, but there is not a pro player alive that would play this route 1 rail, instead of either 2 rails forwards or 2 rails backwards.
 
iusedtoberich said:
Video of all the options. 3 min with all the fluff fast forwarded out. I have not shot a ball in 3 weeks, and warmed up with 10 short stop shots before filming. I'm a 570 for context. All the attempts are shown, nothing was cut out. On the one rail shots, I pointed my stick if I was attempting the path between the 5/9 or the path outside the 5.

Summary
2 rails forward: 4/4
2 rails backwards: 4/4
1 rail: 5/10, and of those, only 2 of the 5 "successes" led to a good shots on the 3, so I'd actually call it 2/10.

The 2 rail forward or backwards were dirt easy I stopped after each was 4/4, and then worked more on the 1 rail route.

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Thank you for the video
your shot at around 2:05 you dont think if you concentrated and took your time you could not do for money?
 
sjm said:
I think you are getting too caught up in this debate. In pool, personalizing the percentages is part of the game and nobody is suggesting that the shot that you feel is best for you is wrong for you. Anyone who can produce that angle every time, as noted, is playing the cleanest route available from an angle management standpoint, as it crosses no obstructions and ensures a good look at the three.

Still, you are persisting with the argument that everybody's percentages are exactly the same as yours, and that's simply not the case. Some have greater facility with certain paths, strokes and speeds and, even with the top 10 players in the world, those biases exist and will sometimes figure into pattern play decisions.

In this thread, many have shared their choices and the philosophy behind those choices. There's more than one way to go here, and several defensible approaches. That's why this thread has been such a good one.
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Sjm
i hear you
and i am with the crowd of low right…🙂
but the stun is really not a ridiculous choice
i guess thats i play like i do and you guys are better…🥲
 
bbb said:
Sjm
i hear you
and i am with the crowd of low right…🙂
but the stun is really not a ridiculous choice
i guess thats i play like i do and you guys are better…🥲
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Agreed. stun is not a ridiculous choice here, but it does seem that it is not the comfort zone shot for many in this thread as there are some other satisfactory, but less elegant, alternatives offering a high probability of success.

I think you are being too hard on yourself now. To suggest that struggling with a decision like this one is what's holding you back as a player is probably in error.

I would suggest that the takeaway from this thread for you is that, sometimes, the most geometrically sound path is not as safe as some of the alternatives. In terms of process, this means that you must, situationally, weigh the alternatives and decide whether risk reduction is sufficient compensation for playing something other than the perfect angle.

As long as you pledge to yourself that you will take the trouble to compare alternative paths with an understanding that there's a little more to pattern play than finding the perfect angle to the next shot, you will solidify your pattern building.

Good luck with your game.
 
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sjm said:
Agreed. stun is not a ridiculous choice here, but it does seem that it is not the comfort zone shot for many in this thread as there are some other satisfactory, but less elegant, alternatives offering a high probability of success.

I think you are being too hard on yourself now. To suggest that struggling with a decision like this one is what's holding you back as a player is probably in error.

I would suggest that the takeaway from this thread for you is that, sometimes, the most geometrically sound path is not as safe as some of the alternatives. In terms of process, this means that you must weigh the alternatives and decide whether risk reduction is sufficient compensation for playing something other than the perfect angle.

As long as you pledge to yourself that you will take the trouble to compare alternative paths with an understanding that there's a little more to pattern play than finding the perfect angle to the next shot, you will solidify your pattern building.

Good luck with your game.
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Stu
i cant tell you how much i appreciate you giving me your advice from someone like you that knows what they are talking about
😍
 
gregcantrall said:
My first attempt had whitey finding the hole in the side rail. 🤷‍♂️ I am often painfully reminded that I CAN miss anything at any time. 🤷‍♂️ 😉 So your bet was lost before it was made.
Looking at the picture had me chose the draw for the reason you have posted. I learned something when I then attempted the other 2.
I have since put in enough reps to confirm that for me, given my methods/skills set, the red line works best for me.
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Hah! That's confirmation bias at its corrupt worst. :ROFLMAO:

Actually, if I were able to get out on everything, I'd probably shoot in that manner.
 
Stun is absolutely a ridiculous choice here. Look at my still picture on post 137. There is hardly any error on the direction of the stun line.
 
iusedtoberich said:
I shot them both ways. That side of the table is no good either. By the time the CB clears the 5, it would need to stop on a dime to leave a makable cut on the 3. Sorry, it's just a bad shot. I'm no champion, but there is not a pro player alive that would play this route 1 rail, instead of either 2 rails forwards or 2 rails backwards.
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OK I got the chance to view the video. Good job. I find it interesting that we come to different preferences. The shot you make at 2.10 is my preference and easily repeated for me. 🤷‍♂️
 
gregcantrall said:
OK I got the chance to view the video. Good job. I find it interesting that we come to different preferences. The shot you make at 2.10 is my preference and easily repeated for me. 🤷‍♂️
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I’m assuming you mean the shot starting at 1:58 and ending at 2:05? Yeah, that’s about best that line can be hit.

I’ll tell you what. Go down to your table and set up your phone. Mark with donuts just like I did. And do it accurately with DCP’s picture. Shoot all 3 versions 10 times. If you have a higher success (meaning a good shot on the 3) with stun, compared to either 2 rails forward or backward, I’ll send you $50. If not, you owe me nothing. Honest John. No do-overs.
 
gregcantrall said:
Why you wanna talk like that?:Headscratch:
Were you gang rejected?
Just wondering.......
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I am not referring to those who merely prefer center-axis...that's just smart. I'm referring to those who drank so much of the kool-aid that they choose and advocate for much more difficult shots just to avoid hitting with a tip of spin.

I don't know what gang rejected means, tho the center-axis cult def denied me entrance for daring to say that coming perpendicular off a cushion is infinitely easier with roll and a tip of outside than nailing a perfect amount of low for the speed I'm shooting at. So maybe i was center-axis gang rejected :p. There, u guys r cool now....ur a gang, not a cult. Don't jump me.
 
iusedtoberich said:
Also here is a picture standing at the table of the 1 rail route, with the stick on the tangent line. You'd need the CB direction to be within 2 ball widths to get field goal position between the 5 and 9. It's really a bad shot. Sorry, not sorry:)

View attachment 787960
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In previous replies I stated the high inside route would be my first choice, but now viewing this layout from this angle above, clearly the bottom right option is the logical choice.
 
iusedtoberich said:
I’m assuming you mean the shot starting at 1:58 and ending at 2:05? Yeah, that’s about best that line can be hit.

I’ll tell you what. Go down to your table and set up your phone. Mark with donuts just like I did. And do it accurately with DCP’s picture. Shoot all 3 versions 10 times. If you have a higher success (meaning a good shot on the 3) with stun, compared to either 2 rails forward or backward, I’ll send you $50. If not, you owe me nothing. Honest John. No do-overs.
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I find that an interesting offer. I have not used ring binder do nuts in decades. They are not available. For ball marking I use the Senior Center golf game method of ball marking....a little spit on the finger tip. Shrug.
Perhaps in the morning I can give it a run, just for fun. Will need to confirm my ball place mint as just a little more angle makes a big difference.
iusedtoberich said:
I’m assuming you mean the shot starting at 1:58 and ending at 2:05?
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No, the shot struck at 2:10 and the next after. I like that angle on the 3 ball.
 
ChrisinNC said:
In previous replies I stated the high inside route would be my first choice, but now viewing this layout from this angle above, clearly the bottom right option is the logical choice.
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Interesting, bc I was firmly in the low right path camp until I saw the vid of attempts and thought I'd switch to the top left bc of the longer position window for the angle on the 3 I prefer.

Looking at the rest of the run, I think playing the 5 in the corner on the 7's side makes things easy and 2/4 attempts in the vid worked out this way with the other two giving an angle I can assuredly get playing low right, only closer to the 3.

So the choice is really between low right to absolutely always be on it but with a little more cb travel and possibly trickier out if I don't get near enough the shot line on the 5 past the 6, vs taking a rather minimal risk of coming up short with the 5 in the way but being rewarded with a higher percentage out maybe half the time or the same one as the low right path the other half of the time.

It's a much more interesting spot than I originally thought. It must be if we both flip flopped in opposite directions.
 
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My evening study product:
First shot on my favorite path.
20241102_204934.jpg

No picture necessary for the draw option ...it fell in the sewer. The running English got this.
20241102_205619.jpg


My second attempt on my preference.
20241102_210013.jpg

20241102_210315.jpg

No picture necessary as shot 2 with follow went in the side hole.
No need for me to look further. In competition the first is the only one that counts.
 

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gregcantrall said:
My evening study product:
First shot on my favorite path.
View attachment 788006
No picture necessary for the draw option ...it fell in the sewer. The running English got this.View attachment 788024

My second attempt on my preference.
View attachment 788019
View attachment 788020
No picture necessary as shot 2 with follow went in the side hole.
No need for me to look further. In competition the first is the only one that counts.
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I can't imagine that you guys set up the same shot if all 4 of his attempts hit the long rail betwween the 2nd and 3rd diamond and yours somehow sewered in the side.

As diagrammed, I just don't see how any shot that meets the criteria for being called 'low-outside' could possibly find the side pocket.
 
Round 2 shooting with phenolic tipped jump/break cue.
20241102_214320.jpg

20241102_213945.jpg

No photo needed for draw as it found the hole in the side rail. 🤷‍♂️
 
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