JB Cases said:
thats a neat case. please have sterling contact me and send me pics of the 3x4 design you came up with, that they have in stock. spanky98ball@hotmail.com
mike
** WHITTEN STYLE (tribute/knock off) leather case ** low $$
- Thread starter spanky981
- Start date
thats a neat case. please have sterling contact me and send me pics of the 3x4 design you came up with, that they have in stock. spanky98ball@hotmail.com
mike
I'm with you. I'm getting dizzy trying to figure out how it works...
ribdoner said:
ribdoner said:
Well I guess so. I guess then that just about everything is a knockoff as it all came from somewhere.
The first guy who carried his crap in an animal skin was the original case maker and all of us have knocked him off.
It's funny but when someone admired makes something in the "style" of someone else then they are praised. When someone is not admired then they are a knockoff artist when they do it.
You think Apple was the first to come up with a touchscreen phone? No they weren't. What they did was come up with one with some neat features. Now people are copying those neat features and adding more. The end result is a genre of touchscreen phones that work better and are all useful tools. There are also plenty of Apple knockoff phones that are much worse than an original. These have no place in the market in my opinion.
Anyway this debate is endless. You are going to think what you want to think and so am I. In the end the world will keep spinning.
'We are all fleas' - George Carlin.
Didn't mean to case WWIII....
But I am glad some people feel the same way I do about these sorts of things.... Way to go JB BTW how do you have the time to type so much?
But I am glad some people feel the same way I do about these sorts of things.... Way to go JB BTW how do you have the time to type so much?
ugotactionTX said:
ugotactionTX said:But I am glad some people feel the same way I do about these sorts of things.... Way to go JB BTW how do you have the time to type so much?
I don't have time. But it seems as if I can't ever say what I want to in just a few words. I definitely don't have that ability.
A lot of my time is spent designing and when I get bored or stuck then I read AZ. I totally need to cut my AZ addiction though.
JB Cases said:
Your a smart guy and KNEW you were stepping into caca when you bogarted this thread, DIDN'T you?
Instead of deleting or modifying you chose to promulagate several thousand words pimpin your K/O's while denigrating Mike's
in HIS thread :nono:. JOHN, THAT'S NOT THE WAY THE GAME IS PLAYED, IS IT??
Now, let's talk about value:
My FRIEND Mike is selling his k/o for apprx. 30% of what the original would cost. One of your basic? GTF'S (1x2) is offered for $210 which is apprx. 40% MORE than a comparable? ENGLES sold for when manufacturing ceased. What % of the originals do your "improved" JUSTIS "style
" cases sell for?FWIW i like (w/the exception of the "PROM QUEEN") your cases, but, your actions in this thread were boorish, to say the least.
ribdoner said:Your a smart guy and KNEW you were stepping into caca when you bogarted this thread, DIDN'T you?
Instead of deleting or modifying you chose to promulagate several thousand words pimpin your K/O's while denigrating Mike's
JOHN, THAT'S NOT THE WAY THE GAME IS PLAYED, IS IT??
Now, let's talk about value:
My FRIEND Mike is selling his k/o for apprx. 30% of what the original would cost. One of your basic? GTF'S (1x2) is offered for $210 which is apprx. 40% MORE than a comparable? ENGLES sold for when manufacturing ceased. What % of the originals do your "improved" JUSTIS "style
FWIW i like (w/the exception of the "PROM QUEEN") your cases, but, your actions in this thread were boorish, to say the least.
Yes I guess I did know it. Mike, I will gladly pay you for bogarting your thread. Send me you address and I will send you a new Jiasen case FOR FREE for the trouble I have caused here.
The GTF is not MY case. It's GTF's product. And it costs more to make it than a J.Flowers case.
I have no idea what an Engles cost when they were new. I know what a Thomas 1x2 goes for and I'd say that the GTF prices are definitely comparable there. I also know that a GTF Replica which is made to emulate the Fellini is about 5 times the "original" 70's price. Then again, so is gas and everything else.
This isn't about price Adam and you know it. It is not about whether the price is "good" or not. I know you want to turn this around but the fact is that this case that Mike is selling is a knockoff. Mike and I have talked and we are cool about it. It is what it is and I have already said I shouldn't have jumped in but I did and I am here and I will finish it. You know as well as I do that -deleted- often says far more than what was actually said.
But we can do price - first it's not a Justis style case. It's Flowers style case - Justis does Flowers style cases with distinctive Justis styling. Just want to get that out there so your attempt to redirect the conversation and outline the terms doesn't get accepted as fact.
Secondly, the Flowers style cases I sell are priced at about the SAME price as they were in the 80s and late 90's as near as I can tell. Maybe a little more. So that seems like a pretty damn good value if you ask me.
1. You get a case that is made by a case maker with a proven track record of quality and customer service.
2. you get a product that has a highly visible point of contact as well as an established dealer network.
3. you get a case made with all the improvements in cue case making that have been developed in the last 15 years.
4. You get a case that is reminiscent of one that is not in production anymore.
All that for the same price as they were 20 years ago.
Now let's compare a straight up knockoff from an unknown entity.
1. you get a case made by ????
2. you get a case with one source of origin from someone who isn't a dealer nor has any profit or incentive to service the customer after the sale.
3. you get a case that looks like a famous case but is made to an unknown standard.
4. you get the good feeling of walking around with a blatant knockoff of a current design. And when people ask you about your Whitten or compliment you on it you get to tell them all about how you bought a knockoff.
All this for a fraction of the current price of the originals still on sale. Seems like a great deal to me.
I know I ****ed up and should have stayed out of this thread. But you know what - in all the years I owned Instroke no one ever stood up for me in regards to all the knockoffs. I am standing up for MY FRIENDS - Dan and Joe Whitten whose ONLY livelihood is making cue cases in the design that is their signature.
If that is boorish to you then so be it. And for the record, I didn't mention GTF or Flowers until someone else brought it up and then I simply answered the question of what is the difference between what I do and this.
Dirty Pool..........
Thats what I call pretty weak. JB the knock-off king is AZB's #1 thread pirate. Get 2 people together talking cases an here he comes. I never seen anybody work so hard at being RUDE. How about not running over the other guy an give Mike a chance an start your own thread.
Pinocchio
Thats what I call pretty weak. JB the knock-off king is AZB's #1 thread pirate. Get 2 people together talking cases an here he comes. I never seen anybody work so hard at being RUDE. How about not running over the other guy an give Mike a chance an start your own thread.
Pinocchio
Pinocchio said:
How about you not be a jerk and let us work out our own stuff?
Or are you still on track to be AZ's #1 jerkoff?
Let me clue you in because you obviously can't read. Mike and I have talked about it, I said I was sorry for butting into his thread and in deference to Adam I even offered to atone for it with a free case. So go somewhere else and play with you nose Pinnochio.
And yes, you've seen someone work harder at being RUDE every time you look in the mirror. Or did you conveniently forget all the pearls of wisdom you like to drop into my threads? Oh but it's ok for you to insult me any way you want to right?
So please forgive me if I think your opinion is worthless.
ribdoner said:Your a smart guy and KNEW you were stepping into caca when you bogarted this thread, DIDN'T you?
Instead of deleting or modifying you chose to promulagate several thousand words pimpin your K/O's while denigrating Mike's
JOHN, THAT'S NOT THE WAY THE GAME IS PLAYED, IS IT??
Now, let's talk about value:
My FRIEND Mike is selling his k/o for apprx. 30% of what the original would cost. One of your basic? GTF'S (1x2) is offered for $210 which is apprx. 40% MORE than a comparable? ENGLES sold for when manufacturing ceased. What % of the originals do your "improved" JUSTIS "style
FWIW i like (w/the exception of the "PROM QUEEN") your cases, but, your actions in this thread were boorish, to say the least.
Thanks Adam..
John really didnt understand that I a not trying to promote this product or anyway trying to be a cue case dealer. My thing is cues.
As stated I bought 2. One for me and one to sell to offset shipping costs.
They are nice cases but in no way as good as a Whitten. Hence the lower price.
Thank you for your support.
I am not a fighter or arguer. I usually stay out of these types of threads. I hope everyone sees where I stand on this.
Also John..
I accept your apology and in no way do I expect you to send me a free case but If you feel you must I will PM you my address.
Mike
Now, I am sticking my 2 cents in where I think it is appropriate. I have owned Whittens. Fellinis, Instroke Knock-offs, Fellini Knock-Offs, 1x2 Whitten Knock-offs, German made Instrokes, and several other U.S made quality cases.
John made a point that stuck in my head about inferior quality of some Knock-offs hurting sales of original makers' and I have seen both sides of that coin, but mostly the inferior one. For instance, my experience with a couple poor quality Instroke knockoffs left me disliking the style and somewhat distrustful of ever owning a "Real" Instroke. It wasn't until I stole a German made used one on Fleabay that I came to realize that I liked the old Instroke as really solid. However, I still don't trust the one's being produced today in Asia. I have seen too many with handles coming apart carried by other players. Maybe they were counterfeits, I don't know.
As for the 1x2 leather Whitten style knock-off, the same shit happened with it that happened with the Instroke Knock-offs. The bottom fell out and had to be reglued and renailed. Did it hurt my opinion of Whitten??? It made me cautious enough to inspect someone else's Whitten first before buying one.
So... I agree that inferior knock-offs do harm the original maker's sales in some way. I wouldn't trust these Whitten Knock-offs to hold up like a Whitten. I would spend my $150 on a solid used Instroke or $200-250 on a used Whitten that won't depreciate much and still most likely outlast the knock-off.
Bottom line. Buy American.. We need the jobs here.
John made a point that stuck in my head about inferior quality of some Knock-offs hurting sales of original makers' and I have seen both sides of that coin, but mostly the inferior one. For instance, my experience with a couple poor quality Instroke knockoffs left me disliking the style and somewhat distrustful of ever owning a "Real" Instroke. It wasn't until I stole a German made used one on Fleabay that I came to realize that I liked the old Instroke as really solid. However, I still don't trust the one's being produced today in Asia. I have seen too many with handles coming apart carried by other players. Maybe they were counterfeits, I don't know.
As for the 1x2 leather Whitten style knock-off, the same shit happened with it that happened with the Instroke Knock-offs. The bottom fell out and had to be reglued and renailed. Did it hurt my opinion of Whitten??? It made me cautious enough to inspect someone else's Whitten first before buying one.
So... I agree that inferior knock-offs do harm the original maker's sales in some way. I wouldn't trust these Whitten Knock-offs to hold up like a Whitten. I would spend my $150 on a solid used Instroke or $200-250 on a used Whitten that won't depreciate much and still most likely outlast the knock-off.
Bottom line. Buy American.. We need the jobs here.
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spanky981 said:
I feel I must. I have a vested interest in this topic as a producer of cases. As such my opinion can't be counted as neutral. I jumped into this thread with both feet and I know that some will think that I am being hypocritical. All I can say to that is walk a mile in my shoes and you may feel as I feel.
I also want you to see the difference between a copy and a case that is truly made with care from the inside out.
So send your address and I will have a case on the way this coming week. I'd appreciate it if you would give it a real thorough workout and post your opinion of it.
our_auctionguy said:
One night in 2003 I put my custom Joss into a Whitten knockoff that I got in a trade deal. I was too lazy to walk across the shop and get an Instroke. The bottom fell out and my cue slid through a ring of nails as it clattered to the floor. In addition to new dings and blemishes it now had long scratch from the bumper to about halfway up the wrap.
The irony is that I was taking it to Mark Smith Cues to get it refinished.
For me the bottom line is buy quality - because buying quality from people who have earned the reputation insures that they can continue to supply quality stuff. If you invest in quality then it pays you back every day you own it.
Nice looking case. While I normally wouldnt post on a thread that is this derailed, I figure I would make a few comments.
1. Comparing this thread to buying a knockoff purse/watch on the streets is different. Most of the street pushers will swear up and down they are the 'real' thing (not to mention they are branded), and they are being your best friend selling you a $15,000 rolex for $20 dollars. I don't think too many people really expect them to be the real thing, nor really expect them to hold up to the same standards. This thread is basically showing off a 'whitten inspired' case. Ok.. a bit more than inspired, but the key thing is, it is not stamped as a Whitten, trying to pass off as the real thing.
2. Personally, if I had the cash to pick up a case this nice looking for the price of a Porper case, I would buy it in a heartbeat. ( currently all of my cash is being saved to complete my McDermott D series collection )
3. JB does raise a concern that anyone buying a knockoff case has, Will it protect my cues? If that is the concern, then doing some research on who made it and opinions of others who have used those cases would be in your best interest.
Nice looking case, and good luck with the sale
1. Comparing this thread to buying a knockoff purse/watch on the streets is different. Most of the street pushers will swear up and down they are the 'real' thing (not to mention they are branded), and they are being your best friend selling you a $15,000 rolex for $20 dollars. I don't think too many people really expect them to be the real thing, nor really expect them to hold up to the same standards. This thread is basically showing off a 'whitten inspired' case. Ok.. a bit more than inspired, but the key thing is, it is not stamped as a Whitten, trying to pass off as the real thing.
2. Personally, if I had the cash to pick up a case this nice looking for the price of a Porper case, I would buy it in a heartbeat. ( currently all of my cash is being saved to complete my McDermott D series collection )
3. JB does raise a concern that anyone buying a knockoff case has, Will it protect my cues? If that is the concern, then doing some research on who made it and opinions of others who have used those cases would be in your best interest.
Nice looking case, and good luck with the sale
folkar said:
My thoughts exactly. I have been looking for a case for my wife for over 2 months now. Unfortunately she is somewhat picky on the color, and this color scheme is perfect for her. I haven't found many older instroke cases with the lighter tan/brown color scheme and the one I did win on eBay back in early November I paid and it was never shipped. So I am out my $$$ until PayPal finishes their investigation.
I have a nice custom case that was made for me almost 2 years ago, but she won't let me spend that much on her since she is not into pool as much as I am. So its either find that one in a million old Instroke that is a color she likes or buy her a knockoff like this. Too bad I saw this one a little too late.
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