Who Wrote the WPA 10-Ball Rules ? They need to be put in front of a firing squad !

You can change the rules

For all of you who find disfavor with the new rule set for Ten Ball, you can change them. New rule sets such as this are put in force by the WPA for a one-year 'trial' period where players, promoters and fans can try them out and then submit their suggestions to the WPA for changes.

It is best to do this in a positive manner. State the changes you would make and the rational for each change. The rules that are in place for this year were thoughtfully considered and designed. But the folks who drew them up are very serious in their duty to serve those who play the game and will listen to constructive input.

If you would like your input presented to the WPA you may go to their website: www.wpa-pool.com and use the contacts there or you may send your suggestions to jerry@azbilliards.com and I will be happy to forward your thoughts to the WPA. If I get enough replies I will try to categorize and organize them, so if you could reference the current rule number that you are addressing it would be a help.

Do submit your comments with some degree of haste. After the one-year trial period changes are made the final rule set will become part of the five-year moratorium, and so will remain unchanged for the following four years as we will be one-year into the new moratorium at that time.

Best,
Jerry
 
MikeJanis said:
ESPN may have been the main factor for going to 1 foul but nobody can deny the fact that thje TE rules took off like a whirlwind and caught on with every player and promoter. Yhe 2 foul suggestion only came back into play after many of the old time stars of the gane started getting beat by the new stars. It's happening again today with the rack and break rules.
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I beg to differ. A few years ago, when I was still competetive, I could take
many a young, straight shooter, who could kill me at Texas express rules,
and if I could get them to play roll out (two shot foul) rules, they had no
chance to win! Thats why I say TE rules are bogus and the best player
does not always win (and that would be me. Har har.)
 
SJDinPHX said:
I beg to differ. A few years ago, when I was still competetive, I could take
many a young, straight shooter, who could kill me at Texas express rules,
and if I could get them to play roll out (two shot foul) rules, they had no
chance to win! Thats why I say TE rules are bogus and the best player
does not always win (and that would be me. Har har.)
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You just wrote what I wrote in different words then disagreed with what I wrote. What up with that?

You could have just given me props and agreed.

Mj
 
Neil said:
I posted this in the other thread on this subject. But I want to make sure Mike sees it, and get his take on it after he thinks about it a little.The same (very similar) scenario happens his way also. It's called a safety.

I agree with call pocket. But even if you have balls made on a safety spotted, you can also use that to your advantage.

The example shown is a good one. One could just as easily put up an example of both players are hill-hill, and the shooter misses by a mile, but slops it or something else in and runs out to win the match. And somehow some of you think that this is fairer? IMHO one should never be rewarded for slopping in a ball. It's getting rewarded for missing.

In the example shown, that is nothing more than strategy. No different than getting bad shape and playing safe behind another ball to where there is no hit. Same thing. And it's (call pocket) been around in 8-ball for a long time
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Do you think all balls should be called in one pocket too??

Flex
 
Patrick Johnson said:
Is this sarcasm, Flex? All balls are automatically "called" in one pocket.

pj
chgo
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I worded it poorly. By "all balls" I didn't mean any ball going in, but calling a specific ball to be made, basically eliminating most fluke shots.

Flex
 
Look at this example in post #8 by jsp http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=87678
It tells volumes on why these rules are bad.
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I don't get why playing safe this way is so bad - without the call shot/call safety rule you could just leave the same kind of long shot on the 8 as this example leaves on the 9. The ability to make a ball and call safe doesn't give anybody a special advantage.

I get the objection to changing the traditional nature of rotation games, but this particular example is lost on me.

pj
chgo
 
I said this yesterday, when someone put up a thread about the NEW 10ball rules.

basically now, if your hooked or someones calls a "saftey" and you kick hit the OB and make a ball but dont call the right pocket, you give up ball in hand, and basically can lose the game.

Now imagine the same situation, but you also make the 10ball, after doing a 5 rail kick, or a jump shot, yet having to give up your turn at the table.

I know people have talked about making 9ball like this, where its a called-shot game to take away the FLUKE part of it. Which sounds good, UNTILL it bites you in a ass!!!!!!!!!! when you fluke in a ball and dont get rewarded for it.
 
Yes Siree Bob!

SJDinPHX said:
I beg to differ. A few years ago, when I was still competetive, I could take
many a young, straight shooter, who could kill me at Texas express rules,
and if I could get them to play roll out (two shot foul) rules, they had no
chance to win! Thats why I say TE rules are bogus and the best player
does not always win (and that would be me. Har har.)
Click to expand...

Right on, corrrect etc etc etc.

(Except, the best player would be me har har har.)
 
Bottom line, two shot foul is the best rule. The best player will prevail.
Should it be any different? Should we let guys who get out of line
on an easy runout play a lockup safety and win the game?
 
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What???

Gerry said:
Whats wrong with Texas express rules for 10ball?!....nothing!, and screw that alternate break crap!

not to mention making the 10ball on the break IN ANY POCKET is a win. That sux! I like it being spotted and the breaker keeps shooting. As for the other lammo rule MJ talked about...I'm right there with him!
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I suppose tennis would be a great game if they played "winner serves"
Give it a rest. the only fair way to play is alternate break.
 
The WPA.....an european group....in charge of american pool, with the blessing of the BCA. Hmmmm.
Until someone gets to the table and runs 10 racks everytime they have a chance to play, just leave the game alone. 9-ball or 10 ball should be played only one way. The Texas Express way.
ESPN didnt introduce this game. They just used a version of our rules.
Easy to understand and implement, even the newbies take to it real quick.
 
Rockin' Robin said:
The WPA.....an european group....in charge of american pool, with the blessing of the BCA. Hmmmm.
Until someone gets to the table and runs 10 racks everytime they have a chance to play, just leave the game alone. 9-ball or 10 ball should be played only one way. The Texas Express way.
ESPN didnt introduce this game. They just used a version of our rules.
Easy to understand and implement, even the newbies take to it real quick.
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Robin. I think you should write the WPA. Given who you are (you will probably need to explain this to them) your words will hold a ton of weight. Maybe, you and Randy G can get together on this project. PLEASE !

If you would please at least send them a note through this link http://wpa-pool.com/index.asp?content=contact you will be doing all of us a great servive.

PLEAAZZZ :D :D and thanks,
Mj
 
I have to go along with Mike and Robin on this. The whole idea of going to Ten Ball was to make the break shot more fair. PERIOD! They didn't have to change all the rules to do this. Just add one ball and you've accomplished a lot. It's becomes a much harder game. From the break shot on.

As far as I'm concerned, plain old Texas Express rules devised many years ago by John McChesny, Robin Adair and Randy G. are still the best, and will work fine for Ten Ball. Let the player win if he makes it on the break. It ain't easy! And let a player run some racks if he can. It ain't easy!

Pool is not Tennis and it's not Golf. It's POOL! And that's what makes it unique. Let a man run racks if he is capable. It takes skill and is quite exciting. And his opponent will get his chance, just like in Straight Pool. In 14.1 they often had to sit for a long, long time between turns, and watch their opponent run rack after rack. Should we make them trade racks in 14.1? Now wouldn't that be a joke! Be careful, they might do that too.

Leave it to the powers that be to f'k up a good thing. Who are these "genuises" and who gave them the authority to make a mess of things. I know I'm not popular with this crowd of rule makers, but so be it. They're not so popular with me either. I feel just like Mike does. They should be getting some input from the people who run tournaments all over the world. And the players who play in them.

After 20+ years of producing and directing major pool tournaments, no member of any rules committee has ever seen fit to ask me one thing about the rules. They change rules at their whim, and operate in their own closed circle of righteousness. At this point in time, if I produce an event, I will make my own rules, because their rules suck.

When they took away a win for making the eight ball on the break, I knew they were headed in the wrong direction. And then, in their infinite wisdom, they decided to allow a player to shoot directly through a frozen ball. Push it, shove it, bang it, whatever. It's all legal now. Why practice and develop skill at pool? Just fram the balls and see what goes in. Call them all, or call them safe. Who cares? They sure don't!

I think the rule makers should be sentenced to play a tournament every day, using their own rules, for the rest of their lives. That's the sentence they have given us.
 
SJDinPHX said:
I suppose tennis would be a great game if they played "winner serves"
Give it a rest. the only fair way to play is alternate break.
Click to expand...

just read Jays post if you don't get it.

Pool is NOT 2 players on the same table AT THE SAME TIME like tennis. If it's my turn, I'm gonna shoot til I miss or the set is over period! Why should you get to come to the table right after I just ran out? I didn't miss. People who like alternate break IMO can't string racks, and need a crutch to help them win. I'm sure alternate break was invented to slow down the best players and give more players a chance to win therefore getting more players to pony up the entry fee.

Leave alternate break to one pocket.....the real test of skill! :D

OH yea, Thanks Jay for backing me up on this topic.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
I don't get why playing safe this way is so bad - without the call shot/call safety rule you could just leave the same kind of long shot on the 8 as this example leaves on the 9. The ability to make a ball and call safe doesn't give anybody a special advantage.
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I don't understand how you can say this. Take a look at the particular example that was drawn up, with and without the shot/call safety rule. If you were the person sitting in the chair and your opponent screws up position from the 8 to the 9, wouldn't you want him to get punished for being so careless?
 
My Thoughts !

WPA...Whoa!.
Rotation pocket games have always been fast paced, aggressive, entertaining pool. When you introduce the new rule 'pocketing a ball and calling safe', you tinker with the way the game is played, by the greats. You will slow it down, take that aggressive nature away somewhat, and make players play "safe" more, is that what the sport of rotation deserves?
I don't think we should fool with this aspect of the game, Unless there is a good reason, if so I would like too hear what it is and why it makes any sense.

This is MY letter to JF.
 
MikeJanis said:
ESPN may have been the main factor for going to 1 foul but nobody can deny the fact that thje TE rules took off like a whirlwind and caught on with every player and promoter. Yhe 2 foul suggestion only came back into play after many of the old time stars of the gane started getting beat by the new stars. It's happening again today with the rack and break rules.
Click to expand...
No need to go "generation gap" on me. Before TE, games used to be
won by the best player, not by the best jumper,or the luckiest kicker!
 
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